Pins on Toro MX5060 don't work

bertsmobile1

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The pins do not control the brake they control the bypass valve between the pump & motor .
The brake is a toothed plate which engages with a toothed wheel on the side of your transmission
Here is a little video that explains how it works
Toro brake module
Now as to your bypass valves
When there is no load on the wheels some oil will go through the motors so on a jack the wheels will spin, pins in or out .
Having said that the control rods are thin & do bend so check that the lever on the side of the box that you keep on thinking is the brake ( which it is not ) moves to the end of its travel, if not then straiten or bend the wire as needed .
To disengage the brake manually you have to get under the mower and remove the brake rods from the brake module .
The brake is on the INSIDE of the transmissions wher the arm you are playing with os on the OUTSIDE of the transmissions.
The instructions for doing this are in your owners manual.
If you have lost yours then it is a free download from Toro but you will need the numbers off the mowers ID tag to make sure you get the correct one .
 

jcworks

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bertsmobile1, (As to putting it on a jack and seeing the wheels move): Thanks for explaining that, I didn't know that. So, the video of me demonstrating the wheels spinning does NOT even apply to my complaint about being hard to manually push. From what you just said the video doesn't really illustrate anything. Thanks for that

A - (As for the parking brake not being connected in any way to the pins): Yes, I knew that. Thanks.
B - The only time this issue is an issue for me is when I get the mower stuck (like in the ditch) and I have to pull it out with the truck. Or, for example once the drive belt broke and I had to push it up on a trailer to take it to the shop. All other times the mower works as it should -- forward and backward. In those two incidents I just stated the manual says push the pins in to disengage the trans. Its that that does not seem to work. I push the pins in, turn the ignition to ON, and pull the control arms inward like in driving mode. Its then that it does not seem to make any difference. The time I had to load it on a trailer because the drive belt broke I had to get someone to help me push it and line it up to the tailgate, and push it up onto the trailer. It was tough. The wheels were rolling but was real difficult for two men to push up the ramp. And, I thought it was way to difficult for two men to push even on the ground. So, its not the electric parking brake that I thought was the issue; but whether the pins are are disengaging the trans.

B - (As for the pins being bent): Yes, they are thin like you said. They do have what I'd call a dog-leg bend to them.....I think both of them. And I think they came that way as they both have the same bend (I think). I'll have to take another look at that just to be sure. And, they do seem to move to the end of its travel. I'll go back and check that on both sides.

C - It does not matter whether the pins are pushed in or out; makes no difference at all in operating the machine. I can drive it forward or backward with the pins in either position.
 
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bertsmobile1

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OK so I am onboard now.
Remember I am not standing there next to you drinking your beer & farting so all we have to go in is the words you posted .
It would appear the bypass valves are not working as designed.
My first thought would be to see if you could move the levers further back than the bypass rod pulls them .
When the bypass is open ( push mode ) the wheels should spin easily but not as free as a car in neutral
If it was just one then the prospect of a defective drive would present itself but not for both of them unless some idiot removed the bypass rods rotated the bypass valves a full turn then put the rods back on
 

jcworks

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I think I see what you mean. Do you think maybe this is something I could correct at home? I mean if the rod (pins) are removable would I be able to rotate those valves manually and then reattach the pins? Or maybe best let the shop do that. I'm not nearly as well-versed as you in this stuff but I get the mental picture those valves inside the trans are like a choke on a lawnmower carbuerator.

I agree. These forums are really good so people can discuss stuff; but its not quite like a face to face, and all we can go by is printed word. Thats good, but it has its limits.
 

bertsmobile1

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I ask people to get a copy of the parts book for their mower so they can at least use the correct terms
In most cases & toro is one of them it is a free download ( service manual for your mower is free too ) because it then makes it clear what the thinga ma bobby that screws into the do dad is .
Unless the responder is very familiar with the exact model, most of us pull up the parts manual before we attempt to answer a question so I don't think it is an onerous task to ask the mower owner to do the same thing.
When we are all singing from the same song sheet you can get beautiful sounds.

The bypass valve is just a ball valve like you us for water ( although some are a cone ) but the same thing
If the release rod pushes down on a pin then they are a piston valve .
The rods should just twist a bit then slide out of the arms .
I have occasionally come across some mowers where the bypass rod has been bent by something so wont fully open and have had 1 & only 1 in 11 years where the oil had so much debris in it that it had blocked the bypass valve off .
 

jcworks

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Gotcha. Understood and makes sense.

Its a 2013 Toro MX5060. Model # 74641. Serial # 313001378. 300 hrs on the time meter.

THE FOLLOWING IS FROM https://www.toro.com/en/parts/partdetails?id=40409&iid=422583&pid=468474

Here are the parts:
LEFT HAND BYPASS ROD Part #: 121-2965 . #19 in the schematic.
FLAT WASHER Part #: 3256-22. #29 in the schematic which shows (2). My machine has just (1), both sides right & left
PIN-COTTER [HAIR .080 NO.2] Part #: 1-806003
BYPASS ARM KIT Part #: 107-2489 Replaces 112-9852 , #34 in the schematic of 2nd attachment

The bypass rods connect to the bypass arm kit. left side and right. The arm kit slides back and forth horizontally
 

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bertsmobile1

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Doubt that the numbers of washers would make any difference
The arm they connect to moves about 1/4 to 1/8 of a turn
The rods used to be heavy with a spring so when you got to the end of the travel of the arm the spring just stretched and most were spring loaded to return to the run position .
Then some stinge worked out you could remove the spring and just make the rod thin so it would flex .
So put the rod in the push position then put your finger on the arm and see if it moves back any further
This is easier said than done .
If the arm moves further back than the rod can pull it , bend the rod a little more .
 

jcworks

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I agree with you on the change by someone to remove that spring. I've seen similar stuff like that so much the last 20 years or so. You get something that works just great, and eventually some new guru comes along and "improves" it. I "think" I did that before to see if it would move further. Bert this has been an issue so long and my memory isnt as good as it use to be so I'm not 100% sure I did it the way you describe , that its, pushing the arm instead of the rod. That makes sense. If I did do that before it would not go any further.

However, I can't try that until I get the machine back from the shop. The starter is shot. Yesterday I cranked it up but had to pour a little gas in the air intake before it would start after sitting up all winter. The starter has been whining for a couple of years. I knew it would be toast sooner or later. It barely turned over when I tried to crank the engine -- dragging real bad. I had a brand new battery in it. So after it cranked yesterday I decided I'd better get it on the trailer while its running and before I got stuck again with not being able to get it on the trailer. I am having them put on a new starter and while its there a new fuel and air filter. I know the starter won't be cheap. Also, I told them about this not disengaging issue to check out too. I don't have a real good feel they'll solve that though. They cautioned me about having to go into the trans; I could tell they did not really want to have to do that. Maybe their mechanics weren't well versed in dealing with that. Or maybe it was because of the cost. I don't know, I'm just guessing on all that. But he indicated that if they could not fix it externally it might be best to just leave well enough alone as I can mow with it. We'll see. He said I'll have to wait a couple weeks or so. So I cant do the test with the arm till I get it back. You're right, this will be easier said than done.

*I just had a thought on the bypass arm. Assuming that the shop cannot fix the disengaging issue externally, I'm wondering if I removed the cotter pin and the bypass rod from the bypass arm and then push the bypass arm forward as far as possible. If the machine continues to not disengage I'd think that would tell me its an internal issue. If it does disengage it would have to be it has something to do with the bypass rods. Maybe I'm putting cart before the horse -- and just wait to see what they tell me.
 
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bertsmobile1

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yes that would work but you will need something to stop the valve arm springing back
Internally most are spring loaded to the drive position
 

jcworks

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OK. I understand. Thanks. I'll be waiting to see what the dealer says and if its unchanged I'll do this when I get it back. I'll let you know in a couple weeks or so. Thanks, Bert
 
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