Kohler Courage 20---what beside main crank seal will quickly dump all oil from under engine?

[TobyU]

Personally I have never a major failure of the Courage single though I have heard of them thru the grape vine. It is called a bucket engine for a reason as the crankcase is like a bucket.

Most times when lower crank seals go bad it is the lip next to crankshaft. While just sitting there oil runs down the crankshaft onto the motion drive pulley. Then when you crank up the engine oil is slung off that pulley. The engine's crankcase will be dry as oil does run uphill or spray uphill unless forced to do so.

Also when new seals are installed it is possible to roll the lip and have the gather spring to become dislodge causing leaks. Now on rarer occasions the seals can leak between itself and crankcase. But you are dealing with a seal that is 15 yrs old so I think as harden over the years on top of wearing normally. It is the reason I keep these seals in stock here.

Also you hadn't already disassemble the engine you could have used UV dye to find the leak down before doing an invasive disassembly. It can save a lot of unnecessary work.

Most of the ones that were going to have the major failure have already self-destructed and are out of circulation that's probably why you haven't seen them.
These things kind of go in cycles.

It also has to do with the region they're in which affects people's mowing habits and the season.
I was tracking them quite well for a while and it seems that all the 2000 to 2003 models have already blown up. Lol
I thought anything 2006 or newer was out of the woods but I finally found two 2006s that had the bolts not tight enough but still not as bad as the old ones.
To this day I have never seen anything 2007 or above where the bolts weren't nice and tight.

It was just those front five also. And of course there's only two where the flywheel can hit and cause the crack but even before that those front four to five will loosen up and the whole cover will start to walk around and open up the guide pin hole and everything else.

If you catch it even at that point, you can clean all the threads out nicely and use at least blue loctite on them and preferably a lock washer or some kind of shoulder bolt that's a locking bolt along with loctite and torque them to the factory spec and it shouldn't happen again.

I still check everyone that comes in but I can pretty much guarantee that if it's 2007 or above they're going to be fine.

 

[hlw49]

Check the oil drain. They are bad to come loose.

 

[fish56]

Are you sure the new oil filter had the gasket properly in place or that the gasket from the old oil filter came off and it didn't double up?

Most probable issue. Years ago, I did this on a car I changed the oil on. I knew it was a possibility that the old oil filter might come off and leave its gasket behind. The one time I didn’t check, it happened. I drove my 77 Chrysler LeBaron about a mile and a half, smoking from the oil leaking onto the exhaust. Turned around and fixed the mistake when I got home. Never took it for granted again.

 

[StarTech]

Could always be like me. I did an oil change on my PU and drove to a Walmart 20 miles away when the oil came on. When I check the oil I was two quarts low. Refilled and drove back again two qts low.

Come to find out via UV dye that the new oil had the stretch crack in its cup. Boy I thought I had a read main seal to blow. OIl filter under OEM warranty but they refused to honor it so I no longer buy Purlator filters. I could have lost an engine because of this.

 

[ILENGINE]

Changed the oil and filter spring/summer of 2023 in my Kioti, and January of this year with 40 hours on the new oil and filter it started leaking, and had to turn the filter an additional 1/4 turn with a filter wrench to stop the leak. Changed the filter shortly thereafter to prevent any issues with being overtightened.

A couple month after that kept smelling diesel but couldn't find the leak until I had filled the tank full. Discovered that when the tank was installed at the factory back in 2005 the mounting strap had been overtightened and caused a kink in the side of the tank which caused it to crack over time. So $473 and 2 hours of labor later had the tank replaced. If it had been discovered when the tractor was new would of been a warranty repair, and there were a few tractors from the time frame that did have cracking tanks due to this issue that were replaced under warranty, but mine waited close to 20 years before failing.

 

[Alan46]

Changed the oil and filter spring/summer of 2023 in my Kioti, and January of this year with 40 hours on the new oil and filter it started leaking, and had to turn the filter an additional 1/4 turn with a filter wrench to stop the leak. Changed the filter shortly thereafter to prevent any issues with being overtightened.

A couple month after that kept smelling diesel but couldn't find the leak until I had filled the tank full. Discovered that when the tank was installed at the factory back in 2005 the mounting strap had been overtightened and caused a kink in the side of the tank which caused it to crack over time. So $473 and 2 hours of labor later had the tank replaced. If it had been discovered when the tractor was new would of been a warranty repair, and there were a few tractors from the time frame that did have cracking tanks due to this issue that were replaced under warranty, but mine waited close to 20 years before failing.

I have a 2005 Kioti ck25 HST ,how hard is it to check the tank out for that problem or change the tank out?

 

[ILENGINE]

I have a DK45S. I my case they tightened the strap over the top of the tank too tight which pushes the top of the tank down. The top 3 inches or so slopes at about a 45 degree angle. That point over time will cause it to bow inward which create a kink in the tank, and over time will cause a crack.

Changing my tank out required removing the hood, side shields, air filter, muffler. Unbolt the firewall to get it out of the way and then you have to unbolt the entire frame that the tank sits in and it has to be lifted out as a single unit, I used my overhead chain hoist to give lift since it has to be raised and tilled forward to wiggle it out from below the dash frame and the rear of the engine. Then after removing from the tractor then you can remove the strap that holds the tank to the tank frame.

But from the parts diagram for your tractor it looks like your tank bolts to the tank frame, not strapped to the frame with a flat band like mine. So your setup shouldn't have the same issue I had.

 

[Alan46]

I have a DK45S. I my case they tightened the strap over the top of the tank too tight which pushes the top of the tank down. The top 3 inches or so slopes at about a 45 degree angle. That point over time will cause it to bow inward which create a kink in the tank, and over time will cause a crack.

Changing my tank out required removing the hood, side shields, air filter, muffler. Unbolt the firewall to get it out of the way and then you have to unbolt the entire frame that the tank sits in and it has to be lifted out as a single unit, I used my overhead chain hoist to give lift since it has to be raised and tilled forward to wiggle it out from below the dash frame and the rear of the engine. Then after removing from the tractor then you can remove the strap that holds the tank to the tank frame.

But from the parts diagram for your tractor it looks like your tank bolts to the tank frame, not strapped to the frame with a flat band like mine. So your setup shouldn't have the same issue I had.

Thank you for taking the time to research my question! You’re a good human bro!!!

 

[sessman55]

Purchased a Toro Bronco new 15 years (or more) ago and it has had a very babied life at a lakehouse that only gets used about 3 times a year. I had a need to loan it to son-in-law that burned up ( it literally caught on fire ) his new JD Zero turn.

Never had any issues at all with the Toro / Kohler other than replacing a couple of tires that dry-rotted.

I Picked it up and made a trailer ride back to home. Did a full tune-up and oil change. When I cranked it all the oil immediately sprayed out from beneath the motor in just a couple of seconds. I felt pretty sure it was a main seal on the crank because of he volume and speed with which it occurred and just ordered a new OEM seal. With the mower lifted overhead and pulleys removed The part of the motor around the crank is dry and dusty.
After a lot of digging online I stripped the top end of the motor and it does not even suffer the common oil leaks and all side of the engine are still dry and dusty.
When the oil was being discharged it came out like it was under high pressure directly down on the trailer ..

That was a lot of background for a relatively simple question. Does the Kohler Courage 20 have any type of opening beside the main seal on the very bottom of the engine that could of dumped all the oil in just a few seconds. If not, I am suspecting a catastrophic block crack. I can pull the engine and inspect the bottom but that simple act will cost me considerably and I will probably just cut my losses and try to find a used mower.

 

[sessman55]

Purchased a Toro Bronco new 15 years (or more) ago and it has had a very babied life at a lakehouse that only gets used about 3 times a year. I had a need to loan it to son-in-law that burned up ( it literally caught on fire ) his new JD Zero turn.

Never had any issues at all with the Toro / Kohler other than replacing a couple of tires that dry-rotted.

I Picked it up and made a trailer ride back to home. Did a full tune-up and oil change. When I cranked it all the oil immediately sprayed out from beneath the motor in just a couple of seconds. I felt pretty sure it was a main seal on the crank because of he volume and speed with which it occurred and just ordered a new OEM seal. With the mower lifted overhead and pulleys removed The part of the motor around the crank is dry and dusty.
After a lot of digging online I stripped the top end of the motor and it does not even suffer the common oil leaks and all side of the engine are still dry and dusty.
When the oil was being discharged it came out like it was under high pressure directly down on the trailer ..

That was a lot of background for a relatively simple question. Does the Kohler Courage 20 have any type of opening beside the main seal on the very bottom of the engine that could have dumped all the oil in just a few seconds. If not, I am suspecting a catastrophic block crack. I can pull the engine and inspect the bottom but that simple act will cost me considerably and I will probably just cut my losses and try to find a used mower.

The courage engine is notorious for the block cracking near the top front of the engine. Remove the top cover and the flywheel and you’ll see the issue straight away.