Saw pictures of people lined up.

[midnite rider]

And we're all part of a collective. If we want good roads, streets, bridges, police, firemen, EMTs, military, parks, fancy sports stadiums, schools, libraries etc. Collectively we pay for those things. Is that socialism? I don't feel overtaxed onincome or what I buy. The US has one of the lowest tax rates in the world. Hell, there are some large corporations that have a negative effective tax rate.

I do feel overtaxed. Some of the Taxes United States Citizens Pay Each Year

Accounts Receivable Tax

Building Permit Tax

Capital Gains Tax

CDL license Tax

Cigarette Tax

Corporate Income Tax

Court Fines (indirect taxes)

Dog License Tax

Federal Income Tax

Federal Unemployment Tax (FUTA)

Fishing License Tax

Food License Tax

Fuel permit tax

Gasoline Tax (42 cents per gallon)

Hunting License Tax

Inheritance Tax Interest expense (tax on the money)

Inventory tax IRS Interest Charges (tax on top of tax)

IRS Penalties (tax on top of tax)

Liquor Tax

Local Income Tax

Luxury Taxes

Marriage License Tax

Medicare Tax

Property Tax

Real Estate Tax

Septic Permit Tax

Service Charge Taxes

Social Security Tax

Road Usage Taxes (Truckers)

Sales Taxes

Recreational Vehicle Tax

Road Toll Booth Taxes

School Tax

State Income Tax

State Unemployment Tax (SUTA)

Telephone federal excise tax

Telephone federal universal service fee tax

Telephone federal, state and local surcharge taxes

Telephone minimum usage surcharge tax

Telephone recurring and non-recurring charges tax

Telephone state and local tax

Telephone usage charge tax

Toll Bridge Taxes

Toll Tunnel Taxes

Traffic Fines (indirect taxation)

Trailer registration tax

Utility Taxes

Vehicle License Registration Tax

Vehicle Sales Tax

Watercraft registration Tax

Well Permit Tax

Workers Compensation Tax

and our newest tax according to our supreme court, ObamaCare. Not one of these taxes existed a little over 100 years ago and our nation was the most prosperous in the world, had absolutely no national debt, had the largest middle class in the world and Mom stayed home to raise the kids. What the hell happened? And to think we started a revolution over a tea tax and then the British King's imposed intolerable acts.
During the American Revolution, the active forces in the field against the King's tyranny never amounted to more than 3% of the colonists. They were in turn actively supported by perhaps 10% of the population. In addition to these revolutionaries were perhaps another 20% who favored their cause but did little or nothing to support it. Another one-third of the population sided with the King (by the end of the war there were actually more Americans fighting FOR the King than there were in the field against him) and the final third took no side, blew with the wind and took what came. The verdict of history is that no state remains committed to liberty forever, which means that such a time will come again.

 

[Mike88se]

Do you pay each of those taxes? I don't think that 100 years ago there was much of a middle class. The middle class began to grow about 100 years ago and boomed after WWII. The US is still the wealthiest nation in the world. Also by far the most powerful.
Before the income tax, US revenue came mostly from tariffs. That didn't work out that well for the average citizen but it was great for the wealthy. The gilded age.
100 years ago...
The average life expectancy in the U.S. was 47 years.

14 percent of the homes in the U.S. had a bathtub.

8 percent of homes had a telephone.

Infant mortality rate was about 15%

There were 144 miles of paved roads.

The average wage in the U.S. was 22 cents per hour.

The average U.S. worker made between $200 and $400 per year.

The average age was 23 years old.
Middle class?
You'd miss your cars and trucks and roads and bridges.
The first substantive act of the First Congress signed into law on July 4, 1789 imposed duties on tea, salt, beer, candles, sugar, cider, nails, shoes, soap.
Here's how overtaxed you are:


Anyway, we're getting way off topic here. My last say... People's guns are not going to be confiscated. We're not in danger of becoming socialist, communist, or Nazi. I'm 58 years old and I've been hearing this kind of talk since I was a child.
There will be no revolution.
I don't think the people who want a revolution could handle the US military, CIA, FBI, NSA, and all the rest of what the government would throw at them. I sure as hell wouldn't want to see it tried.

I do feel overtaxed. Some of the Taxes United States Citizens Pay Each Year

Accounts Receivable Tax

Building Permit Tax

Capital Gains Tax

CDL license Tax

Cigarette Tax

Corporate Income Tax

Court Fines (indirect taxes)

Dog License Tax

Federal Income Tax

Federal Unemployment Tax (FUTA)

Fishing License Tax

Food License Tax

Fuel permit tax

Gasoline Tax (42 cents per gallon)

Hunting License Tax

Inheritance Tax Interest expense (tax on the money)

Inventory tax IRS Interest Charges (tax on top of tax)

IRS Penalties (tax on top of tax)

Liquor Tax

Local Income Tax

Luxury Taxes

Marriage License Tax

Medicare Tax

Property Tax

Real Estate Tax

Septic Permit Tax

Service Charge Taxes

Social Security Tax

Road Usage Taxes (Truckers)

Sales Taxes

Recreational Vehicle Tax

Road Toll Booth Taxes

School Tax

State Income Tax

State Unemployment Tax (SUTA)

Telephone federal excise tax

Telephone federal universal service fee tax

Telephone federal, state and local surcharge taxes

Telephone minimum usage surcharge tax

Telephone recurring and non-recurring charges tax

Telephone state and local tax

Telephone usage charge tax

Toll Bridge Taxes

Toll Tunnel Taxes

Traffic Fines (indirect taxation)

Trailer registration tax

Utility Taxes

Vehicle License Registration Tax

Vehicle Sales Tax

Watercraft registration Tax

Well Permit Tax

Workers Compensation Tax

and our newest tax according to our supreme court, ObamaCare. Not one of these taxes existed a little over 100 years ago and our nation was the most prosperous in the world, had absolutely no national debt, had the largest middle class in the world and Mom stayed home to raise the kids. What the hell happened? And to think we started a revolution over a tea tax and then the British King's imposed intolerable acts.
During the American Revolution, the active forces in the field against the King's tyranny never amounted to more than 3% of the colonists. They were in turn actively supported by perhaps 10% of the population. In addition to these revolutionaries were perhaps another 20% who favored their cause but did little or nothing to support it. Another one-third of the population sided with the King (by the end of the war there were actually more Americans fighting FOR the King than there were in the field against him) and the final third took no side, blew with the wind and took what came. The verdict of history is that no state remains committed to liberty forever, which means that such a time will come again.

 

[RobertBrown]

Sounds like a lot of rambling, but if I may simplify ...what your saying is "shut up and pay it", "I don't own a gun so if they come for mine :cool2:.......it's just my rights after all, no big deal".
So members, If you can't afford your rights guaranteed by the constitution, no, matter what the price, that's not Mikes problem, he doesn't own a gun and apparently he's got lots of money.
You should consider politics, Mike. You have what it takes.

 

[Mike88se]

You can say I said something like that but that doesn't make it true. What's wrong with rambling... you did it
All I did was showed you that Americans don't really pay that much in taxes. Nobody likes paying taxes and fees... it's just something we have to accept if we want good roads and all that other stuff that makes it possible to live the way we've got accustomed to living. You don't have to shut up and pay it. But you do have to pay it. I'd never be so rude to tell anybody to shut up. There's a lot of things the govt does that I don't like. I don't like being spied on by our govt. I don't like our govt playing policeman to the world and starting senseless wars that waste a ton of money and lives and that can never be won. They don't ask my opinion on these things. I have to accept it. I don't have to shut up and accept it though. That's part of living here. You can say you don't like something but that doesn't mean it's going to be changed just because you don't like it. I'm gonna stop rambling now

Sounds like a lot of rambling, but if I may simplify ...what your saying is "shut up and pay it", "I don't own a gun so if they come for mine :cool2:.......it's just my rights after all, no big deal".
So members, If you can't afford your rights guaranteed by the constitution, no, matter what the price, that's not Mikes problem, he doesn't own a gun and apparently he's got lots of money.
You should consider politics, Mike. You have what it takes.

 

[midnite rider]

Do you pay each of those taxes? I don't think that 100 years ago there was much of a middle class. The middle class began to grow about 100 years ago and boomed after WWII. The US is still the wealthiest nation in the world. Also by far the most powerful.
Before the income tax, US revenue came mostly from tariffs. That didn't work out that well for the average citizen but it was great for the wealthy. The gilded age.
100 years ago...
The average life expectancy in the U.S. was 47 years.

14 percent of the homes in the U.S. had a bathtub.

8 percent of homes had a telephone.

Infant mortality rate was about 15%

There were 144 miles of paved roads.

The average wage in the U.S. was 22 cents per hour.

The average U.S. worker made between $200 and $400 per year.

The average age was 23 years old.
Middle class?
You'd miss your cars and trucks and roads and bridges.
The first substantive act of the First Congress signed into law on July 4, 1789 imposed duties on tea, salt, beer, candles, sugar, cider, nails, shoes, soap.
Here's how overtaxed you are:
View attachment 18839

Anyway, we're getting way off topic here. My last say... People's guns are not going to be confiscated. We're not in danger of becoming socialist, communist, or Nazi. I'm 58 years old and I've been hearing this kind of talk since I was a child.
There will be no revolution.
I don't think the people who want a revolution could handle the US military, CIA, FBI, NSA, and all the rest of what the government would throw at them. I sure as hell wouldn't want to see it tried.

I pay 80% of taxes I listed.

The USA is also the most in debt nation in the world, more than double that of the second most in debt nation and owes 20.61% of total world debt.

Tariffs are only for imports/exports, not items domestically produced and sold.

Average life expectancy was lower then due to infant mortality rate. Take that away and life expectancy increases.

People took a bath once a year in the not so distant past so no need for a bath tub. Years before that there were no telephones. Technology increases as we go forward. I fail to see your point.

The Roman Empire was the most powerful in the world and had more than 400,000 km of roads, of which over 80,500 km were stone-paved. Many believed the Roman Empire would not fail too.

Average individual income in 1900 was $800. As of 2013 average individual income is $26,364. Officially $800 in 1913 would be $18,602 today and unofficially $53,836. Quite a gap between the reported inflation and the real inflation rate as reflected in the price of gold. Always convert to gold to get to the truth. We have had a 99.7% reduction in the value of currency, and a 350% rise in the unemployment rate (because most in know understand real unemployment is probably over 23%).

July 4, 1789 imposed duties on tea, salt, beer, candles, sugar, cider, nails, shoes, soap were on imports, not domestic products. This was a voluntary tax, if you chose not to purchase imports you paid no tax. The first permanent income tax in the USA began in 1913.

Government Revenue in the United States has steadily increased from 7 percent of GDP in 1902 to over 35 percent today.

The attached chart shows the increasing length of time you work each year to pay your taxes in the USA.

I apologize for getting off topic and political, just thought people should know the facts. Never say never.

I do not want to see a revolution either, but history shows us that it will happen again. Whether or not in our lifetime, we have to see.

Thanks for the comments Mike, we can agree to disagree. Good day to all.

 

[wjjones]

I pay 80% of taxes I listed.

The USA is also the most in debt nation in the world, more than double that of the second most in debt nation and owes 20.61% of total world debt.

Tariffs are only for imports/exports, not items domestically produced and sold.

Average life expectancy was lower then due to infant mortality rate. Take that away and life expectancy increases.

People took a bath once a year in the not so distant past so no need for a bath tub. Years before that there were no telephones. Technology increases as we go forward. I fail to see your point.

The Roman Empire was the most powerful in the world and had more than 400,000 km of roads, of which over 80,500 km were stone-paved. Many believed the Roman Empire would not fail too.

Average individual income in 1900 was $800. As of 2013 average individual income is $26,364. Officially $800 in 1913 would be $18,602 today and unofficially $53,836. Quite a gap between the reported inflation and the real inflation rate as reflected in the price of gold. Always convert to gold to get to the truth. We have had a 99.7% reduction in the value of currency, and a 350% rise in the unemployment rate (because most in know understand real unemployment is probably over 23%).

July 4, 1789 imposed duties on tea, salt, beer, candles, sugar, cider, nails, shoes, soap were on imports, not domestic products. This was a voluntary tax, if you chose not to purchase imports you paid no tax. The first permanent income tax in the USA began in 1913.

Government Revenue in the United States has steadily increased from 7 percent of GDP in 1902 to over 35 percent today.

The attached chart shows the increasing length of time you work each year to pay your taxes in the USA.

I apologize for getting off topic and political, just thought people should know the facts. Never say never.

I do not want to see a revolution either, but history shows us that it will happen again. Whether or not in our lifetime, we have to see.

Thanks for the comments Mike, we can agree to disagree. Good day to all.

Yep I counted 19 off the list that apply to me, and most people in this country. What can you do but just pay the taxes. We can always agree to dis-agree thats what makes this forum so great

 

[Carscw]

I also pay 19 on list. Will be 21 if the judge ever let's me drive again.

 

[RobertBrown]

I'm gonna stop rambling now

Promise? You said that once before.

"You Americans"?

What we are talking about here...... if I may sift through all of the junk you just spewed... is your government hijacking rights guaranteed by the constitution and selling them back to it's constituents. That revenue is supposedly used to enforce gun laws which we are already paying for. These guns have already been registered once.
If you like that Mike... great. shut up and pay it!

 

[wjjones]

Promise? You said that once before.

"You Americans"?

What we are talking about here...... if I may sift through all of the junk you just spewed... is your government hijacking rights guaranteed by the constitution and selling them back to it's constituents. That revenue is supposedly used to enforce gun laws which we are already paying for. These guns have already been registered once.
If you like that Mike... great. shut up and pay it!

Play nice now Mr. Robert. We all know the government doesnt tell us what they really use the money for. We have to live ignorant as far as they are concerned, and just pay the taxes. I dont mind paying my fair share of taxes. I think what upsets most tax payers is that its never enough, it is always mis- managed, wasted, and then they want more.

 

[Mike88se]

Okay... no rambling. The basic problem here is a lack of argument and reading comprehension skills on your part. Or maybe you just want to deliberately change my words and hope it isn't noticed?
There is no post where I say "you Americans."

Registering more than once? I didn't see that. Where did you see that?
Might want to keep in mind that there are state constitutions and then there's the US constitution.
This is a state law... not a federal law.
I do agree with wjjones... we have a right to know that each tax is going for what it was intended for and if what it's intended for is necessary. I'm thinking about these "bridges to nowhere" type taxes. There's a lot of things I don't like in government. Mostly this... how government works:

Promise? You said that once before.

"You Americans"?

What we are talking about here...... if I may sift through all of the junk you just spewed... is your government hijacking rights guaranteed by the constitution and selling them back to it's constituents. That revenue is supposedly used to enforce gun laws which we are already paying for. These guns have already been registered once.
If you like that Mike... great. shut up and pay it!