Kohler Courage 20---what beside main crank seal will quickly dump all oil from under engine?

[Carver69]

Purchased a Toro Bronco new 15 years (or more) ago and it has had a very babied life at a lakehouse that only gets used about 3 times a year. I had a need to loan it to son-in-law that burned up ( it literally caught on fire ) his new JD Zero turn.

Never had any issues at all with the Toro / Kohler other than replacing a couple of tires that dry-rotted.

I Picked it up and made a trailer ride back to home. Did a full tune-up and oil change. When I cranked it all the oil immediately sprayed out from beneath the motor in just a couple of seconds. I felt pretty sure it was a main seal on the crank because of he volume and speed with which it occurred and just ordered a new OEM seal. With the mower lifted overhead and pulleys removed The part of the motor around the crank is dry and dusty.
After a lot of digging online I stripped the top end of the motor and it does not even suffer the common oil leaks and all side of the engine are still dry and dusty.
When the oil was being discharged it came out like it was under high pressure directly down on the trailer ..

That was a lot of background for a relatively simple question. Does the Kohler Courage 20 have any type of opening beside the main seal on the very bottom of the engine that could of dumped all the oil in just a few seconds. If not, I am suspecting a catastrophic block crack. I can pull the engine and inspect the bottom but that simple act will cost me considerably and I will probably just cut my losses and try to find a used mower.

 

[7394]

 

[ILENGINE]

Some of the early Courage single with the cover bolts coming loose also had issues with the counterbalance retaining strap, that keeps the weight running straight will break and the counterbalance weight cracks or flat out ventilates the rear of the lower crankcase.

 

[StarTech]

Personally I have never a major failure of the Courage single though I have heard of them thru the grape vine. It is called a bucket engine for a reason as the crankcase is like a bucket.

Most times when lower crank seals go bad it is the lip next to crankshaft. While just sitting there oil runs down the crankshaft onto the motion drive pulley. Then when you crank up the engine oil is slung off that pulley. The engine's crankcase will be dry as oil does run uphill or spray uphill unless forced to do so.

Also when new seals are installed it is possible to roll the lip and have the gather spring to become dislodge causing leaks. Now on rarer occasions the seals can leak between itself and crankcase. But you are dealing with a seal that is 15 yrs old so I think as harden over the years on top of wearing normally. It is the reason I keep these seals in stock here.

Also you hadn't already disassemble the engine you could have used UV dye to find the leak down before doing an invasive disassembly. It can save a lot of unnecessary work.

 

[ILENGINE]

Personally I have never a major failure of the Courage single though I have heard of them thru the grape vine. It is called a bucket engine for a reason as the crankcase is like a bucket.

I have seen one were the top front bolts were coming loose but were caught prior to engine damage. Two where the bolts came loose to the point that failure ended with the Kohler crack. One was to the point were the heads of the bolts were ground down by the rotating flywheel. And had one were the counterbalance weight retaining strap broke which allowed the weight to ventilate the bottom rear of the crankcase.

 

[Bertrrr]

I ran into this with the same engine, I think there is a design flaw on this model , mine threw the rod and busted the crankcase.

 

[StarTech]

Yes there can be always a major failure with anything. What I was getting at is to look for simpler things first before condemning an engine.

It like that Briggs I had earlier where a simple spark plug cause me a lot extra work as there were other root causes that had already been fixed. I got lock into it must had been something I had done that I overlook a bad plug. It strange that I now had two more with the same crazy problem. Must be a batch of bad plugs.

 

[Carver69]

Some of the early Courage single with the cover bolts coming loose also had issues with the counterbalance retaining strap, that keeps the weight running straight will break and the counterbalance weight cracks or flat out ventilates the rear of the lower crankcase.

Thank You ! Not knowing the inner workings of these I have been at a total loss, but that really sounds logical for the events I witnessed.
I feel physically pretty good this morning ( health issues compounded by age ) and am going to get the engine off the chassis to peer at the bottom. I broke all the mounting bolts loose yesterday while I had everything accessible and only need to do some "light" work to get it off.

The mower could pass for brand new other than no functional engine. I have already researched a direct replacement engine and have found nothing. If anyone knows of a direct replacement I would sure appreciate the advice !

I'll share what I discover if for nothing more than entertainment of others suffering from ownership of a Kohler Courage engine.

 

[Carver69]

Personally I have never a major failure of the Courage single though I have heard of them thru the grape vine. It is called a bucket engine for a reason as the crankcase is like a bucket.

Most times when lower crank seals go bad it is the lip next to crankshaft. While just sitting there oil runs down the crankshaft onto the motion drive pulley. Then when you crank up the engine oil is slung off that pulley. The engine's crankcase will be dry as oil does run uphill or spray uphill unless forced to do so.

Also when new seals are installed it is possible to roll the lip and have the gather spring to become dislodge causing leaks. Now on rarer occasions the seals can leak between itself and crankcase. But you are dealing with a seal that is 15 yrs old so I think as harden over the years on top of wearing normally. It is the reason I keep these seals in stock here.

Also you hadn't already disassemble the engine you could have used UV dye to find the leak down before doing an invasive disassembly. It can save a lot of unnecessary work.

Thanks Star Tech. I have now seen the entire engine in daylight for the first time and am still a bit bewildered but less than before. The bottom of the engine is dry and clean with no damage or evidence of anything troubled. The top plate shows history of what appears to be a minor slow leak near the rear but nothing that would dump oil so quickly. The oil continued to leak onto the trailer until there was none on the dipstick. I am hoping now that what I witnessed was the pulley dumping a load of slowly leaked oil as you mentioned earlier. The upper gasket appears to be in place and all bolts are tight. since all the oil that came out was new I am assuming I am missing something I cannot see with the naked eye. This main event happened three weeks ago and it has just been sitting on the trailer under a tarp. Can you point me towards the UV dye you referenced. Since the case does not appear to be lost I am hoping I can actually repair it. I have a couple of UV lights if they are in the proper wavelength.

Forgive me if I respond to you posts slowly, I can't physically lift or move it indoors and cannot go out in direct sunlight or even exert my self at all so I may be a day or two between even simple tasks.

Thanks Again, Phill

 

[StarTech]

Don't worry about the response times. We all have limitations that love to get in the way. I personally just getting back at it myself from a major Afib attack and now the right hand giving troubles. If it isn't for one thing it is another lately.

Having to learn how to work around it now until the doctor will listen to me about it. Currently he thinks I am some dope just wanting a pain pill fix. And yes I am also suppose to stay out the direct sun too but won't happen. Having back problems requires me to use an engine lift crane for those near 100 lb engines that I use just around with ease.

Only responding quickly here as I just got back from a long run to the food store and was checking my messages.

Yes having the right wavelength is important. The UV dye I use requires 365 nM to work best. Plus the pen light is using a 3.7v boost battery vs the 1.5v one so it produces a brighter light response.