I have A Scag Liberty Z 48 with Kawasaki FR651V, and am wanting to get a cannister air filter from Power Equipment Man. They say no need to re-jet the carb or other modifications. What say the great minds on this forum?
Any mods or adjustments needed for install of cannister air filter?
- Thread starter BTBO
- Start date
Of course they are not going to tell you to do any modification. That would be a violation of Federal law. Give them a call and ask them. This is unedited from their website. “NOT FOR SALE TO CALIFORNIA DUE TO EMISSIONS RESTRICTIONS - all other states please check your local emissions laws before ordering. Installing this kit may affect your emissions and engine warranty. We are not liable for issues with your machine meeting emissions standards for your state or warranty coverage issues. You are installing this kit at your own risk."
Other so called experts on this forum scoff at this and will tell you that you are fine. Especially one expert that doesn’t even live in the US. The EPA fine is $44,000. Their poor advice won’t pay your fine or warranty claim. You decide.
Other so called experts on this forum scoff at this and will tell you that you are fine. Especially one expert that doesn’t even live in the US. The EPA fine is $44,000. Their poor advice won’t pay your fine or warranty claim. You decide.
Aside from all what you mentioned above---would YOU install a cannister air filter on your machine?
ILENGINE
Lawn Royalty
- Joined
- May 6, 2010
- Threads
- 44
- Messages
- 10,775
And with that statement it wouldn't be hard for the EPA to prove that the seller didn't reasonable know that the sold parts would violate the emissions law. So therefore the seller is subject to the $44,000 fine and the purchaser the $4,400 fine for installing it.
No offense to the above replies, my gut tells me that it would not be a mistake to install based on Kawasaki's FX series engines come standard with the cannister type filters. Perhaps I should contact Kawasaki for their feedback.
bertsmobile1
Lawn Royalty
- Joined
- Nov 29, 2014
- Threads
- 65
- Messages
- 24,995
It is one of those totally stupid legal regulation things you only get in the USA .
And yes it is illegal to convert an engine with a bad filter to the exact same filter fitted the the exact same motor from new with a different sticker on the blower housing.
Down here in OZ you can buy the Donaldson kit off the shelf Fr 651 kit
Note all the parts are listed by their Kawasaki part numers and there are no jets
This kit includes the steel blower housing
When I do the conversion I mount the filter onto the ROPS then use some longer convoluted tube to connect it to the carb.
If you mount it directly onto the plastic blower housing , the housing will ( over time ) crack.
Also mounting directly to the blower housing makes removing the housing to do the annual fin clean a PIA
It is worthwile to add the FILTER MINDER because once that is fitted you never ever need to touch the filter till it shows obstruction
Do not remove the inner once installed, it will never need replacing but the outer will.
My commercial customers get about 6 years from an outer
The ones than bag a lot of leaves get around 4
A residential customer should never need to replace the filter elements.
So just order the parts and do not tell the place you are ordering them from that they are going on a FR & not an FX
If it makes you feel any better, order some FX decals for the engine.
Once you tell the shop what you propose to do then they have to tell you NO becaue you could be from the EPA trying to get some easy convictons to make it look like they are doing something about air pollution ( which they are not )
And yes it is illegal to convert an engine with a bad filter to the exact same filter fitted the the exact same motor from new with a different sticker on the blower housing.
Down here in OZ you can buy the Donaldson kit off the shelf Fr 651 kit
Note all the parts are listed by their Kawasaki part numers and there are no jets
This kit includes the steel blower housing
When I do the conversion I mount the filter onto the ROPS then use some longer convoluted tube to connect it to the carb.
If you mount it directly onto the plastic blower housing , the housing will ( over time ) crack.
Also mounting directly to the blower housing makes removing the housing to do the annual fin clean a PIA
It is worthwile to add the FILTER MINDER because once that is fitted you never ever need to touch the filter till it shows obstruction
Do not remove the inner once installed, it will never need replacing but the outer will.
My commercial customers get about 6 years from an outer
The ones than bag a lot of leaves get around 4
A residential customer should never need to replace the filter elements.
So just order the parts and do not tell the place you are ordering them from that they are going on a FR & not an FX
If it makes you feel any better, order some FX decals for the engine.
Once you tell the shop what you propose to do then they have to tell you NO becaue you could be from the EPA trying to get some easy convictons to make it look like they are doing something about air pollution ( which they are not )
Last edited:
ILENGINE
Lawn Royalty
- Joined
- May 6, 2010
- Threads
- 44
- Messages
- 10,775
The truth is the engine will most likely run fine with the canister air filter. And the truth is most likely the EPA wouldn't really care, but they have been known to get stupid sometimes. Things like the EPA raiding a Toro dealer a few years back because their distributor accidently shipped they spring order before the first of the year that had the following years EPA certification stickers. Like shipping a 2013 certified mower in January prior to the label being valid. Or MTD stopped selling the carb adjustment tools to their dealers because they were theatened because the service centers didn't have the proper testing emissions equipment to prove they still meet the emissions certification after adjustment.
And as a side note for you guys replacing a bad engine from another engine, to be legal the replacement engine needs to be newer than or the same year as the engine that is being replaced. So no replacing a 2022 engine with one from a 2019 mower.
Clown show as usual with these fools on here.
The FR engine is rated with the FR filter. Kawasaki is going to follow the law and and are not going to recommend the swap, would be my guess. If it were me, I probably would have made sure I was buying the correct engine/mower for my needs. FR is good for tractor applications where there is a hood over the engine. Or, for very nice lawns like you see in Toro Time Cutter commercials. In reality, most don’t have the lush green lawns and are mowing more dirt than grass. These lawns and commercial users really need an FX engine with the canister filter. Or, if people did proper maintenance, the FR engine could be fine for all but extreme conditions. Proper maintenance is changing air filters. Not blowing them out.
- Joined
- Feb 19, 2020
- Threads
- 93
- Messages
- 11,589
Hopefully the clown show connent is not directed at me...
Of course Kawasaki want you stick with the FR setup as they lots of replacement filter covers though the new style may cut down on that. But I do see a need for the canister filter on many of the ZTRs with the FR engine. Usually those come in with the FR filter nearly completely clogged with crap. The canister filter takes a lot longer to clog up especially with the dust ejector setup.
Of course Kawasaki want you stick with the FR setup as they lots of replacement filter covers though the new style may cut down on that. But I do see a need for the canister filter on many of the ZTRs with the FR engine. Usually those come in with the FR filter nearly completely clogged with crap. The canister filter takes a lot longer to clog up especially with the dust ejector setup.
By posting the conversion kit, yes sir, I consider you part of the clown show. Also by false advertising your kit as "genuine Kawasaki heavy duty air filter conversion kit". The kit parts might be genuine, the part numbers might genuine, but there is no such kit from Kawasaki.