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RSD......Spindle Lub?
#1
chemingthroughtheleather
chemingthroughtheleather
I see no zerks around the spindles of my RSD,am I missing something.....:thumbdown:
#2
M
Mad Mackie
Spindles are sealed and not serviceable.
Hustler Turf
M
Mad Mackie
I see no zerts around the spindles of my RSD,am I missing something.....:thumbdown:
Spindles are sealed and not serviceable.
Hustler Turf
#3
chemingthroughtheleather
chemingthroughtheleather
I don't like this,just how often to replace bearings then?
#4
M
Mad Mackie
Many lower end machines have sealed non serviceable deck spindles. I'm not sure where Hustler makes the change to serviceable spindles, but my Hustler X-ONE has serviceable spindles that are cast iron.
Generally when a spindle bearing starts to fail it will get noisy. When you change blades you can inspect the spindles for radial play and seal condition. I wouldn't be that concerned about the spindles, use but don't abuse you machine and it will have a substantial life. Hustler considers these spindles to be replaced as an assembly and doesn't show any breakdown for the spindle in the parts manual for the Raptor SD model.
Mad Mackie in CT:laughing::biggrin::smile:
M
Mad Mackie
I don't like this,just how often to replace bearings then?
Many lower end machines have sealed non serviceable deck spindles. I'm not sure where Hustler makes the change to serviceable spindles, but my Hustler X-ONE has serviceable spindles that are cast iron.
Generally when a spindle bearing starts to fail it will get noisy. When you change blades you can inspect the spindles for radial play and seal condition. I wouldn't be that concerned about the spindles, use but don't abuse you machine and it will have a substantial life. Hustler considers these spindles to be replaced as an assembly and doesn't show any breakdown for the spindle in the parts manual for the Raptor SD model.
Mad Mackie in CT:laughing::biggrin::smile:
#5
chemingthroughtheleather
chemingthroughtheleather
I'll add this to my want list along with a better "fuel gauge",and heavier spindle covers.Still love the mower.:smile:
#6
djdicetn
More and more manufacturers are going to the sealed bearings(wheels and blade spindles) and it sometimes stirs up quite a controversy. There have been significant advances in the design and materials used in sealed bearings over the last few years and their longevity greatly increased. I, too, was accustomed to a lawn tractor that had greases zerks in the blade spindles and I religiously lubed them every 25 hours. When I began shopping ZTR's in the summer of 2012 I found that MANY of the higher quality(Commercial) ZTR's had sealed bearings and was quite disappointed that you could not perform maintenance on something so important(especially on such expensive mowers). I asked almost every dealer why and the resounding response was that not only were the sealed bearings just as good....but that for years some manufacturers were actually adding grease zerks on spindles that contained "sealed bearings". The Gravely dealer mechanic actually showed me a spindle that they had rebuilt and indeed the original bearings that were removed were completely sealed and the grease zerks only filled the spindle cavity around the bearings and never touched an actual bearing. He told me the manufacturers were doing that because the consumers demanded grease zerks and that the addition of them was nothing more than a placebo to satisfy consumers who insisted on maintaining their spindles. And I got this same story from 4-5 different dealers as well as on forums like this. The more I researched this the more I was convinced that sealed bearings were not a concern. The Gravely mechanic assured me that the life expectancy on the sealed bearings used on my Pro-Turn was easily 2,500-3,000 hours and were very much good for the expected lifetime of most ZTR's. And yes...the improvements to sealed bearings were propagated by professional landscapers who needed the time they had to devote to maintenance reduced.
djdicetn
I don't like this,just how often to replace bearings then?
More and more manufacturers are going to the sealed bearings(wheels and blade spindles) and it sometimes stirs up quite a controversy. There have been significant advances in the design and materials used in sealed bearings over the last few years and their longevity greatly increased. I, too, was accustomed to a lawn tractor that had greases zerks in the blade spindles and I religiously lubed them every 25 hours. When I began shopping ZTR's in the summer of 2012 I found that MANY of the higher quality(Commercial) ZTR's had sealed bearings and was quite disappointed that you could not perform maintenance on something so important(especially on such expensive mowers). I asked almost every dealer why and the resounding response was that not only were the sealed bearings just as good....but that for years some manufacturers were actually adding grease zerks on spindles that contained "sealed bearings". The Gravely dealer mechanic actually showed me a spindle that they had rebuilt and indeed the original bearings that were removed were completely sealed and the grease zerks only filled the spindle cavity around the bearings and never touched an actual bearing. He told me the manufacturers were doing that because the consumers demanded grease zerks and that the addition of them was nothing more than a placebo to satisfy consumers who insisted on maintaining their spindles. And I got this same story from 4-5 different dealers as well as on forums like this. The more I researched this the more I was convinced that sealed bearings were not a concern. The Gravely mechanic assured me that the life expectancy on the sealed bearings used on my Pro-Turn was easily 2,500-3,000 hours and were very much good for the expected lifetime of most ZTR's. And yes...the improvements to sealed bearings were propagated by professional landscapers who needed the time they had to devote to maintenance reduced.
#7
L454S
L454S
My last set of sealed units on an entry level MTD lasted 20+ yrs. Not sure if this is worth concern.
#8
T
Tta197
T
Tta197
I had sealed bearings on my John Deere tractor that was 13yrs old when I sold it. I never had any issues with the sealed bearings.
#9
chemingthroughtheleather
chemingthroughtheleather
Old habits die hard,my Wheel Horses had em and when they didn't I added them.Part of my ritual was to grease the spindles,I guess I will focus on keeping the deck clean as I was remiss in the past.To think I was administering a placebo....:laughing:
#10
RetiredGuns
RetiredGuns
I wondered about this also as my new Raptor of course has sealed spindle bearings. I had my Cub Cadet for 9 years before I realized it had zirc fittings on the spindles and I only put grease in them 45 minutes before I sold it! Never had an issue and still had the original belt.
If these sealed bearing last for 2000+ hours then I should be good for over 75 years! If I am still mowing grass when I am 123 years old then I reckon I can afford a spindle assembly.
My neighbor works for a major lawn care company and he said they add zirc fittings to front castor spindles on their mowers. After reading above, I wonder if it does any good. I think it's just natural for a man to want to pump lube into things...:^)
If these sealed bearing last for 2000+ hours then I should be good for over 75 years! If I am still mowing grass when I am 123 years old then I reckon I can afford a spindle assembly.
My neighbor works for a major lawn care company and he said they add zirc fittings to front castor spindles on their mowers. After reading above, I wonder if it does any good. I think it's just natural for a man to want to pump lube into things...:^)
#11
M
motoman
M
motoman
I have read this explanation before and find it interesting. My Craftsman dyt 4000 has zerks and middle one is a giant PIA to access. I grease them a couple times in the summer. What I find interesting is that after pumping at least 3-4 cartridges down the zerks I have never seen a drop expelled or dripping (hot grease like oil). Further it is hard to imagine a mfgr playing to our anxiety or fetish . (Gotta grease a zerk,gotta grease a zerk...). The big box units are carefully priced and why would MTD or Sears put another ?$5 worth of parts on when 75% of owners don't read their manuals , and could not describe or recognize a zerk? Finally forum member have described some spindle bearings with total seals on one side but partial seals on the other (to let zerk grease in and out?) I guess this will remain one of the final big mysteries of life. Right up there with where the missing socks go and how come I never see the mattress tag police.:laughing:
#12
C
clay45
C
clay45
My 1996 Jeep Cherokee was the last vehicle I owned that I had to grease. So far I haven't missed it because I get all I can stand with my mower. :laughing:
#13
A
AYSKOFI
Look under the deck. hustler in their wisdom chose to nstall them where you wouldn't dream of looking. You must not have noticed the "Smile, you're on Candid Camera" sign.
A
AYSKOFI
I don't like this,just how often to replace bearings then?
Look under the deck. hustler in their wisdom chose to nstall them where you wouldn't dream of looking. You must not have noticed the "Smile, you're on Candid Camera" sign.
#14
B
bertsmobile1
B
bertsmobile1
lack of greas fittings is an EPA regulation AFAIK.
We get a lot of grey import domestic Toros down here.
None of the ones with California EPA compliance sickers have a grease nipple any where.
The Aust version have nipples on the front casters, caster pivots , spindles, tensioning arm pivots, & deck mounts.
OTOH most of the commercial Toro's do have nipples fitted but as noted previously the spindle one are in the side, under the deck.
If the deck is fitted with a easy clean hose fitting then there are no grease nipples ( EPA again ? )
I oft remove the entire spindle housing and rotate it to make the nipples where fitted easy to get at, seems the factory fit them in a random orientation.
We get a lot of grey import domestic Toros down here.
None of the ones with California EPA compliance sickers have a grease nipple any where.
The Aust version have nipples on the front casters, caster pivots , spindles, tensioning arm pivots, & deck mounts.
OTOH most of the commercial Toro's do have nipples fitted but as noted previously the spindle one are in the side, under the deck.
If the deck is fitted with a easy clean hose fitting then there are no grease nipples ( EPA again ? )
I oft remove the entire spindle housing and rotate it to make the nipples where fitted easy to get at, seems the factory fit them in a random orientation.
#15
Ric
I think most manufacturers are going to the sealed bearings especially on the residential mowers. I have three Toro commercial mowers that get used daily during season and all have sealed bearings throughout, the GS has averaged close to 200 hours a year for the last 3 years and never gave me the first hit of trouble with the bearings.Hustler makes one of the best mowers on the market, my guess is you don't have to worry about sealed bearings.
Ric
I don't like this,just how often to replace bearings then?
I think most manufacturers are going to the sealed bearings especially on the residential mowers. I have three Toro commercial mowers that get used daily during season and all have sealed bearings throughout, the GS has averaged close to 200 hours a year for the last 3 years and never gave me the first hit of trouble with the bearings.Hustler makes one of the best mowers on the market, my guess is you don't have to worry about sealed bearings.
#16
B
bertsmobile1
B
bertsmobile1
FWIW I have around 7 ( that I know of ) Great Dane chariots in my service run.
All of them have sealed ball barings in the spindles.
According to GD these are to be replaced annually
The hardest used one about 1500 hrs / year goes through a set of top bearings every two years according to the owner and a set of bottoms every second set of tops ( approx 4 years).
I have only had this run for a couple of years so am yet to get into the long term cycles.
OTOH, if you are going to change the blades it is only another 5 minutes per spindle to change the bearings at the same time and down here the bearings are arond $ 10 each retail so onerious to neither the life nor wallet.
A little trick I picked up early was to run all of the zero turns up on flat decked car ramps.
The ramps are laid on a piece of upside down carpet so when the castors are at the top you can swing the ramps 90 deg out of the way so get under the decks really easy.
When finished I swing the ramps back, lift the front of the mower an inch with an old bumper jack, just far enough to take just enough weight off the front casters to rotate them the right way to reverse the mower off the ramps
All of them have sealed ball barings in the spindles.
According to GD these are to be replaced annually
The hardest used one about 1500 hrs / year goes through a set of top bearings every two years according to the owner and a set of bottoms every second set of tops ( approx 4 years).
I have only had this run for a couple of years so am yet to get into the long term cycles.
OTOH, if you are going to change the blades it is only another 5 minutes per spindle to change the bearings at the same time and down here the bearings are arond $ 10 each retail so onerious to neither the life nor wallet.
A little trick I picked up early was to run all of the zero turns up on flat decked car ramps.
The ramps are laid on a piece of upside down carpet so when the castors are at the top you can swing the ramps 90 deg out of the way so get under the decks really easy.
When finished I swing the ramps back, lift the front of the mower an inch with an old bumper jack, just far enough to take just enough weight off the front casters to rotate them the right way to reverse the mower off the ramps
#17
S
SeniorCitizen
By changing bearings in 5 minutes can we assume neither of the 2 bearings in the spindles you service are a press fit.
S
SeniorCitizen
FWIW I have around 7 ( that I know of ) Great Dane chariots in my service run.
All of them have sealed ball barings in the spindles.
According to GD these are to be replaced annually
The hardest used one about 1500 hrs / year goes through a set of top bearings every two years according to the owner and a set of bottoms every second set of tops ( approx 4 years).
I have only had this run for a couple of years so am yet to get into the long term cycles.
OTOH, if you are going to change the blades it is only another 5 minutes per spindle to change the bearings at the same time and down here the bearings are arond $ 10 each retail so onerious to neither the life nor wallet.
A little trick I picked up early was to run all of the zero turns up on flat decked car ramps.
The ramps are laid on a piece of upside down carpet so when the castors are at the top you can swing the ramps 90 deg out of the way so get under the decks really easy.
When finished I swing the ramps back, lift the front of the mower an inch with an old bumper jack, just far enough to take just enough weight off the front casters to rotate them the right way to reverse the mower off the ramps
By changing bearings in 5 minutes can we assume neither of the 2 bearings in the spindles you service are a press fit.
#18
B
bertsmobile1
May have been new but defineatly not now.
B
bertsmobile1
By changing bearings in 5 minutes can we assume neither of the 2 bearings in the spindles you service are a press fit.
May have been new but defineatly not now.
#19
S
SeniorCitizen
Don't attempt to blow smoke up this old man's ***. It ain't gonna work.
S
SeniorCitizen
May have been new but defineatly not now.
Don't attempt to blow smoke up this old man's ***. It ain't gonna work.
#20
Ric
Ric
If the bearing had to be replaced on the Great Dane annually it's no wonder they went out of business and were discontinued.
#21
M
mowerman05
M
mowerman05
My great dane is about 10 years old, has a grease fitting under the deck in the spindle housing on the back side. have only changed one complete spindle assembly in all the years I have owned it.
#22
reynoldston
When I worked in manufacturing when we would service some machinery that run 24/7 we would replace all bearings once a year. So if it is a problem in your heart I would sat once a year then you should be safe. As for myself I wouldn't change them till they got noisy, but that's just me.
reynoldston
I don't like this,just how often to replace bearings then?
When I worked in manufacturing when we would service some machinery that run 24/7 we would replace all bearings once a year. So if it is a problem in your heart I would sat once a year then you should be safe. As for myself I wouldn't change them till they got noisy, but that's just me.
#23
B
bertsmobile1
As such the very first thing I did ( as with any impliment I have not seen before ) was to download the factory service manual and parts books.
When you don't know any better , following the written instruction can't do too much damage.
Oddly enough I have found quite a few "rebuilt" machines of different breeds where the shop has made a total mess of the job with wrong sized pulleys, tension springs working backwards or not fitted at all etc, etc.
And here is the relevant page for any who might be inclined to believe this white man speek with forked tongue.
View attachment chariotsr_service.pdf
By virtue of the fact the annual service is listed after the 500 hrs service one presumes GD intended these machines to be substantially more than 500 hrs/yr
B
bertsmobile1
Never seen or heard of one till I bought this run.If the bearing had to be replaced on the Great Dane annually it's no wonder they went out of business and were discontinued.
As such the very first thing I did ( as with any impliment I have not seen before ) was to download the factory service manual and parts books.
When you don't know any better , following the written instruction can't do too much damage.
Oddly enough I have found quite a few "rebuilt" machines of different breeds where the shop has made a total mess of the job with wrong sized pulleys, tension springs working backwards or not fitted at all etc, etc.
And here is the relevant page for any who might be inclined to believe this white man speek with forked tongue.
View attachment chariotsr_service.pdf
By virtue of the fact the annual service is listed after the 500 hrs service one presumes GD intended these machines to be substantially more than 500 hrs/yr
#24
B
bertsmobile1
Well that really depends upon the cost & consequences of downtime.
If you only have 1 big mower & you are doing better than 500 hrs/ yr having it brake down on the job followed by a week in the shop might not be allowable.
Even if you have a spare, the cost of the downtime still could very well exceed the cost of the preventative maintenance.
B
bertsmobile1
When I worked in manufacturing when we would service some machinery that run 24/7 we would replace all bearings once a year. So if it is a problem in your heart I would sat once a year then you should be safe. As for myself I wouldn't change them till they got noisy, but that's just me.
Well that really depends upon the cost & consequences of downtime.
If you only have 1 big mower & you are doing better than 500 hrs/ yr having it brake down on the job followed by a week in the shop might not be allowable.
Even if you have a spare, the cost of the downtime still could very well exceed the cost of the preventative maintenance.
#25
Ric
I don't doubt what you were saying about the GD. I think probably that was the reason for there downfall and being discontinued, they didn't do well. There was just to much down time and maintenance or up keep involved to make the mower profitable.
Ric
Never seen or heard of one till I bought this run.
As such the very first thing I did ( as with any impliment I have not seen before ) was to download the factory service manual and parts books.
When you don't know any better , following the written instruction can't do too much damage.
Oddly enough I have found quite a few "rebuilt" machines of different breeds where the shop has made a total mess of the job with wrong sized pulleys, tension springs working backwards or not fitted at all etc, etc.
And here is the relevant page for any who might be inclined to believe this white man speek with forked tongue.
View attachment 24533
By virtue of the fact the annual service is listed after the 500 hrs service one presumes GD intended these machines to be substantially more than 500 hrs/yr
I don't doubt what you were saying about the GD. I think probably that was the reason for there downfall and being discontinued, they didn't do well. There was just to much down time and maintenance or up keep involved to make the mower profitable.
#27
B
bertsmobile1
Don't know.
Untill i took over this run I had mainly only worked on domestics and principally walk behinds.
The nearest GD dealer to here is about 40Km away and there are a lot of them in my run so when new I would assume they were considerd good value
like I mentioned before I have one that does around 1500 hrs/ Yr, remember we have very similar weather to California so we mow all year and at present we just got 6" rain over the last 2 weeks so some grasses are growing a foot /week we have daylight saving so some contractors are doing 6am ( earliest leagal mowing time ) to 8 pm ( lattest legal mowing time ).
Two more look like about 500 hrs/yr and all the others are home owners on small acreages ( 5 to 300 )
I like them from a mechanics POV, easy to work on , nothing fancy to complicate things and all service information readily available as a free down load ( Bliss ).
OTOH i don't like driving them.
All seem to go way too fast and are really twitchy to steer. Probably just a matter of getting used to them but the Dixions, Dixies , Toros, Dear Johns, Hustlers & Coxes are far more civilised .
B
bertsmobile1
I don't doubt what you were saying about the GD. I think probably that was the reason for there downfall and being discontinued, they didn't do well. There was just to much down time and maintenance or up keep involved to make the mower profitable.
Don't know.
Untill i took over this run I had mainly only worked on domestics and principally walk behinds.
The nearest GD dealer to here is about 40Km away and there are a lot of them in my run so when new I would assume they were considerd good value
like I mentioned before I have one that does around 1500 hrs/ Yr, remember we have very similar weather to California so we mow all year and at present we just got 6" rain over the last 2 weeks so some grasses are growing a foot /week we have daylight saving so some contractors are doing 6am ( earliest leagal mowing time ) to 8 pm ( lattest legal mowing time ).
Two more look like about 500 hrs/yr and all the others are home owners on small acreages ( 5 to 300 )
I like them from a mechanics POV, easy to work on , nothing fancy to complicate things and all service information readily available as a free down load ( Bliss ).
OTOH i don't like driving them.
All seem to go way too fast and are really twitchy to steer. Probably just a matter of getting used to them but the Dixions, Dixies , Toros, Dear Johns, Hustlers & Coxes are far more civilised .