Laws Governing Professional Lawn Maintenance Businesses

[djdicetn]

OK, guys....I was gonna start a POLL thread, but never having done that before I figured I would mess it up:0)
So I am starting this thread which will most likely make some of you mad at me, some of you will utilize it to vent and some of you will even agree with my twisted perception of how governing bodies should/should not "dictate" additional constraints on a Lawn Maintenance business. Here goes:

A recent broadcast on a local network news program reported a lawn care maintenance professional who died when his John Deere Zero Turn overturned. The pictures of this "Commercial mower", as the news reported, had no ROPS. I don't know if indeed it was a "Commercial" John Deere model or not by what I saw on the news but I did notice the lack of a ROPS. Sooooooooo, should there be a "law" that fines a lawn care service if their mowers do not meet "safety requirements"? For this discussion, let's drop the debate of what constitutes a "professional lawn care maintenance" person and just go on the premise that this law would govern anyone who receives money for mowing a lawn(or the "owner" should it be a company with a license). I'll bet that if this news story was indeed a "licensed/insured lawn maintenance services company", that their insurance company just sent them a letter of their coverage being cancelled. Also, should the dealer that sold a "Commercial" ZTR to a lawn service(or individual that had the intent to mow lawns for money)without a ROPS be held liable as well? I say that because when I recently considered the purchase of a Bad Boy Outlaw(which is considered a "Commercial" model of that brand), all of the pictures on the Bad Boy website showed it with a ROPS(but there was no specific mention of it in the "specs") only to find the Outlaw at the dealer did not "come with one" and the dealer wanted an extra $300 for it(that didn't go over too well with me:0) And........if we shift gears and assume we are the deceased guy's wife in this news story, who do we decide to sue over this(unless he signed an employment waiver of liability)? Everyone knows what a legalistic society we live in(can you spell hot coffee in a McDonald's drive-thru) and that kind of repercussion is bound to happen.

Now......I'm ready to be "blasted" by any ignorance on my part(I reserve the right to be wrong) of any existing licensing/insurance coverage details that already deals with this "safety issue". Personally, I think there needs to be some accountability at the dealer level and regulations at the business level, but I can be swayed by overwhelming arguments as to why not. And I am very curious as to the opinions about this subject that many of the other users on these forums have about this topic as well as adding details and other perspectives and/or "what ifs". Have at it guys!!!!

 

[Carscw]

OK, guys....I was gonna start a POLL thread, but never having done that before I figured I would mess it up:0)
So I am starting this thread which will most likely make some of you mad at me, some of you will utilize it to vent and some of you will even agree with my twisted perception of how governing bodies should/should not "dictate" additional constraints on a Lawn Maintenance business. Here goes:

A recent broadcast on a local network news program reported a lawn care maintenance professional who died when his John Deere Zero Turn overturned. The pictures of this "Commercial mower", as the news reported, had no ROPS. I don't know if indeed it was a "Commercial" John Deere model or not by what I saw on the news but I did notice the lack of a ROPS. Sooooooooo, should there be a "law" that fines a lawn care service if their mowers do not meet "safety requirements"? For this discussion, let's drop the debate of what constitutes a "professional lawn care maintenance" person and just go on the premise that this law would govern anyone who receives money for mowing a lawn(or the "owner" should it be a company with a license). I'll bet that if this news story was indeed a "licensed/insured lawn maintenance services company", that their insurance company just sent them a letter of their coverage being cancelled. Also, should the dealer that sold a "Commercial" ZTR to a lawn service(or individual that had the intent to mow lawns for money)without a ROPS be held liable as well? I say that because when I recently considered the purchase of a Bad Boy Outlaw(which is considered a "Commercial" model of that brand), all of the pictures on the Bad Boy website showed it with a ROPS(but there was no specific mention of it in the "specs") only to find the Outlaw at the dealer did not "come with one" and the dealer wanted an extra $300 for it(that didn't go over too well with me:0) And........if we shift gears and assume we are the deceased guy's wife in this news story, who do we decide to sue over this(unless he signed an employment waiver of liability)? Everyone knows what a legalistic society we live in(can you spell hot coffe in a McDonald's drive-thru) and that kind of repurcussion is bound to happen.

Now......I'm ready to be "blasted" by any ignorance on my part(I reserve the right to be wrong) of any existing licensing/insurance coverage details that already deals with this "safety issue". Personally, I think there needs to be some accountability at the dealer level and regulations at the business level, but I can be swayed by overwhelming arguments as to why not. And I am very curious as to the opinions about this subject that many of the other users on these forums have about this topic as well as adding details and other perspectives and/or "what ifs". Have at it guys!!!!
P.S.
I know....I know, I mispelled Maintenance in the Subject, but I don't know how to fix it:0)

Ok what if you do not use a mower that is sold as a commercial mower?

As sorry as I feel for this mans wife. There should not be a law because of dumb *** people that flip there mower over. Everyone knows that ztr can not mow hills that's why I don't have one.

(( racing is the only sport that you need two balls ))

 

[djdicetn]

Re: Laws Governing Professional Lawn Maitenance Businesses

Ok what if you do not use a mower that is sold as a commercial mower?

As sorry as I feel for this mans wife. There should not be a law because of dumb *** people that flip there mower over. Everyone knows that ztr can not mow hills that's why I don't have one.

(( racing is the only sport that you need two balls ))

Carscw,

Interesting that you mention a mower not sold as commercial. That opens up the topic of a lawn business "starter" who cannot "afford" a $7k-$10k "Commercial" mower that has a ROPS. And what about "Commercial" walk-behinds with a sulky or standers where a ROPS may not be feasible. manufacturers would be "required" to implement ROPS(or alternative safety devices on anything in their line that they "sold as" a Commercial unit. Their "out" could possibly "stop selling ANY zero turns as "Commercial". But maybe, as you pointed out, due to "known restrictions" ZTR's(because of their design) would be the only ones with a ROPS "required". BTW, my Gravely Pro-Turn blatantly has "COMMERCIAL" across the front of it, so Gravely wouldn't be able to sell it that way and get out of the "regulation" were there one.

 

[Ric]

Re: Laws Governing Professional Lawn Maitenance Businesses

Ok what if you do not use a mower that is sold as a commercial mower?

As sorry as I feel for this mans wife. There should not be a law because of dumb *** people that flip there mower over. Everyone knows that ztr can not mow hills that's why I don't have one.

(( racing is the only sport that you need two balls ))

It's not the fact that a ZTR can't mow hills because it can and it can do as well as any mower going, it's the fact that people ignore the manuals and mow the wrong directions. Both ZTR and Lawn tractors are rated at no more than 15 degrees so either can roll if you try and use them on a slope of more than fifteen degrees. The problem come when people think they know what there doing instead of pay attention to the manufacturers. As far as the Rops is concerned I stated in a post before that the residential and commercial operators have two different sets of rules as far as mowers.

 

[Carscw]

It's not the fact that a ZTR can't mow hills because it can and it can do as well as any mower going, it's the fact that people ignore the manuals and mow the wrong directions. Both ZTR and Lawn tractors are rared at no more than 15 degrees so either can roll if you try and use them on a slope of more than fifteen degrees. The problem come when people think they know what there doing instead of pay attention to the manufacturers. As far as the Rops is concerned I stated in a post before that the residential and commercial operators have two different sets of rules as far as mowers.

I am not sure what it is for my cub cadet but the engine is 25 degrees.

I know here in order to do any state work like rest stops you have to have rops and seat belts.

I do not think manufacturers should have to change how they label or sell a mower because a few fools flip there's over.

(( racing is the only sport that you need two balls ))

 

[djdicetn]

Re: Laws Governing Professional Lawn Maitenance Businesses

I am not sure what it is for my cub cadet but the engine is 25 degrees.

I know here in order to do any state work like rest stops you have to have rops and seat belts.

I do not think manufacturers should have to change how they label or sell a mower because a few fools flip there's over.

(( racing is the only sport that you need two balls ))

Carscw,

Makes sense that the GA State Government would specify that kind of requirement in an RFP(Request For Proposal) for awarding a mowing contract. They definitely don't want the people of Georgia(actually them) sued.

 

[Ric]

Re: Laws Governing Professional Lawn Maitenance Businesses

I am not sure what it is for my cub cadet but the engine is 25 degrees.

I know here in order to do any state work like rest stops you have to have rops and seat belts.

I do not think manufacturers should have to change how they label or sell a mower because a few fools flip there's over.

(( racing is the only sport that you need two balls ))

The engine in my stander is capable of running at 25 degrees for lubrication purposes, the maximum slope operation is 20 degrees. I think the manufacturers are most likely doing everything they can to inform the public of safe operating practices but it doesn't do any good because you always have those who think they know more than the manufacturer knows. The things that bother me are things like safety switches on Residential mowers vs Commercial why do they set up mowers the way they do. Does it make sense to put a blade stop on a Residential mower so the blades disengage when you go in reverse and not have the same on a commercial, does it make sense to have a Rops on a commercial and not a residential ztr. Whatever the manufacturer does you'll always have a few that will push the limits. People need to read the manuals first and take it to heart do what it says in every respect from driving on slopes to changing the oil.

 

[midnite rider]

Re: Laws Governing Professional Lawn Maitenance Businesses

Whatever the manufacturer does you'll always have a few that will push the limits. People need to read the manuals first and take it to heart do what it says in every respect from driving on slopes to changing the oil.

As the saying goes "You can't fix stupid." Eventually they cull themselves out of the gene pool.

 

[Ric]

Re: Laws Governing Professional Lawn Maitenance Businesses

As the saying goes "You can't fix stupid." Eventually they cull themselves out of the gene pool.

:laughing::laughing::thumbsup::thumbsup:

 

[Mad Mackie]

Re: Laws Governing Professional Lawn Maitenance Businesses

I like the expression "cull themselves out of the gene poll"!!!
My 2008 Scag Tiger Cub is my first machine with a ROPS, as I had been mowing with Ingersoll GTs for many years.
I took on a new customer a while back who's trees were in bad need of lower trimming and I hung up the ROPS on a branch of one of the needy trees as I was radially mowing under it from the center out. It lifted the front on my ZTR almost to the point of flipping me over backwards.
I stopped mowing, went to my trailer, got out my trimming tool and nipped off the branches that I thought were problematic and disposed of them in a wooded area behind this house. He saw me, came out and blew his top at me and while attempting to explain the situation to him he fired me on the spot. I packed up and left.
He hired a young chap that said he would mow for half my price. About a month later I was traveling past this place and the new lawn care guy was doing the lawn on his new big box store bargain mower, but without a collection system he was leaving a mess. Several hours later on my return trip past this same house, I saw a tow truck attempting to lift the new guys mower from the collapsed septic tank!!! I stopped to see what was going on and I thought to myself that this situation was very amusing!!! I never did mow near this stinky soft area. A week or so later I got a call from this customer asking me to come back and mow his lawns again, but I declined. However I did offer to take him to a local power equipment dealer and assist him in finding a mower that would suit his needs and he took me up on the offer. He put in a new septic tank and leach fields and now does his own lawn care. I ran into him at a local deli and chatted with him some, he thanked me for my patience and guidance with him. I casually asked him if he had installed floats on his mower, he chuckled and mentioned that the other guy had demanded that he replace the "wet" mower!!! Oh well, stuff happens!!!!:laughing:
Mad Mackie in CT:laughing::biggrin::smile: