Engine Starved for Gas

[Boudreaux In Eunice La.]

Yes it can be a slope issue........... Yes the the rubber hoses can and will go south on you at any given time... I had a brand new top water hose on my 97 Silverado truck go south on me, also a earlier model truck 8 years before that.....

You said you took the CUP off of the carb..... That would be the bowl that holds the the gas in it.... Did the white assembly fall down ??

How many screws are holding the BOWL on your carb ?? Just the one bottom bolt or 2 extra small screws also ??

There is a noodle gasket that might be on your carb...... If that is not in the right EXACT place then it can be an issue.....

I myself have to take a NIKKI carb off to change that gasket..... It'a bugger alright ...........

Let us know Mon Ami ~!~!

 

[Chartman]

Thank you B & B for your prompt and thoughtful responses.
After reading what you wrote I decided to go take a look at the engine and see if I could find out anything useful.
I found the state of affairs pretty discouraging.
First thing, I noticed the carb cup was dripping gas where I had made my "cob job" repair with the cap screw and washer spacers.
But why was there any gas there, since I shut down the fuel valve to shut off the engine?
Well, it turns out the expensive "fuel valve" shutoff I bought did not hold; and in fact I could barely turn it any more.
Although I found it amid a bunch of fuel valve shutoffs, I think it is made of plastic not rated for gasoline. Perhaps it is a potable water shutoff for RV's.
I now have the original shutoff back in place.
I am not sure how best to seal the carb cup (or perhaps it is called the "bowl"). I found a Briggs part 691657 Float Bowl Screw in the parts manual. Can this really cost >$8 and not even include the gasket seal?
I may have to reinstall that solenoid shutoff, although I'd rather not.

I also found other discouraging things like loose bolts, including one through a strut that apparently supports the front of the engine. It connects to the muffler, it seems.
There was also a missing specialty bolt that mounts the red plastic housing to the top of the engine.
I am afraid that someone with less than professional credentials and ethics (other than me) may have been monkeying with things.

RE Mon Frere, Boudreaux-
The carburetor "bowl" is anchored with only the solenoid screw (and now just a screw) through the hole in the bottom. For this reason, I don't think that the carb is a Nikki (but I may not know what I'm talking about).
I cannot tell if it is a Walbro or perhaps a Ruixing?
I find the parts manual very hard to understand. There are many pages of diagram that appear identical or at least very similar.
I'm guessing they are for variations within this engine category, but I can't tell what applies to me and what doesn't.
I don't know what a "noodle gasket" is, but from what I saw, the float moved up and down freely. I did not remove it from the carb.
I think I would remove the carb from the tractor before trying to mess with anything in it.
I have done this before, and I have replaced the float, needle valve and seat. As I recall, I had to thread a screw into the seat (thus ruining it) and jerry-rig a puller system to get it out.
I am getting to be a little "too chicken" to mess with things like that any more, I think.

RE Bertsmobile1
I looked through the parts manual, as stated. I could not find any part named "blanking off plug".
In a couple of places I found an item identified as "PLUG-(Crankcase Cover/Sump)" Briggs part # 794903. There is no clue in the diagram of where it might be found.
I saw nothing on the engine that looked like a plug to a port that might be used for a fuel pump.
If I understand your suggestion, I might be able to drill out a port in that shiny metal cover at the front of the engine? This would be the piece with the Briggs logo and "OHV"?
It is held on with four bolts and there is a gasket that would probably need to be replaced.
But before I attempt anything like that, I think I need to step back and consider all options.
I think I may be getting in over my head.
If I can manage by just keeping the fuel tank very full, I may just live with it that way (...for a while; ...until it really drives me crazy.)
I think my next test (next week when the lawn need mowing again) will be to fill the tank all the way and then head right to the steepest incline in the back yard and see what happens if I mow there for a while.
If there are no problems, I will probably just live with things as they are.
If the problem appears right away; ...well, I'm not sure what I will do.
Perhaps I need to buy a new house with a level lawn.
Chartman

 

[bertsmobile1]

Yep thta is the place.
Kohler & some Hondas run the pump from the rocker cover.
Yes you should replace the gasket.
Put axel grease on the engine side and your favourite gasket gunk on the other side of the gasket then it will strip off clean and will last a long time if you don't do the bolts up too tight.
It is simple to do and should fix your problem.
It could even be you have a pump carb fitted and not a gravity carb fitted but don't have the information at hand to determine which one.
I have come across this sort of problem when swapping used engines which is usually fixed by swapping the carbs back.

 

[Boudreaux In Eunice La.]

Chartman........... I agree with Bert on the addition of a fuel pump....... You mentioned earlier that you had to JACK a seat out of the carb..... That is a Walbro carb.... I do those all the time.... The new seat has to be put back in the right way at the same level.....

If your float is dead level then you are in great shape.........

Watch this video. Mon Ami........... Is the second carb in the video yours ?????

 

[Chartman]

Chartman........... I agree with Bert on the addition of a fuel pump....... You mentioned earlier that you had to JACK a seat out of the carb..... That is a Walbro carb.... I do those all the time.... The new seat has to be put back in the right way at the same level.....

If your float is dead level then you are in great shape.........

Watch this video. Mon Ami........... Is the second carb in the video yours ?????

Hi Bdrx,
That seat I "Jacked out" was on my old tractor, not this one. I mentioned it because that whole process made me pretty nervous. However, it was an old tractor and I didn't think it owed me much, if anything.
This tractor is much newer and in much better shape. I'd be really pissed at myself if I FUBAR'd it.
So that I understand you correctly, the float bottom should be "level". I am taking this to mean that when the float is in the "valve shut"/"bowl full of gas" position, the bottom surface of the float should be parallel to the circle on the carb that the bowl seats to. Is that correct?
I think you are telling me this to make sure that I get the valve seat "fully seated" if I end up replacing that part.
I remember I had to push it in firmly with the back end of the right sized drill bit when I replaced that seat on the other engine.

I don't see the link to the video you mentioned.
Will this forum allow you to send a plain text link?
CM

 

[Boudreaux In Eunice La.]

Oops I forgot to post the link.............

https://youtu.be/t9W9bs-KLaI

 

[Chartman]

Oops I forgot to post the link.............

https://youtu.be/t9W9bs-KLaI

LOL!
Yes, these guys are about my speed. Maybe even a little advanced.
I guess I have the Walbro carb. He mentions again that the Nikki had two screws holding the bowl in place, and I don't have that.

I did some poking around the inter-web to see what it might take to get a fuel pump running.
In as much I thought the simple nut to seal the bottom of the carb bowl was outrageously priced, I think they are practically giving away the fuel pump ($7 with free shipping?) I think I need a 808656 Briggs & Stratton; or equivalent.
I think the fuel lines are 1/4" so I need some of that and a nipple to attach to the "rocker arm cover(?)" after I drill a hole in it.
I might be willing to give this a try, since it looks like the worst that can happen is that I will need to replace that cover. How expensive could that be?
I guess my plan would be to not drill through the front large face, but to find a place on the edge, probably high or low on the port side of the tractor (nearer to the carburetor). I guess I won't know for sure until I take the cover off and see what it looks like inside.
I will also need a replacement gasket for this cover.
I have looked at some straight nipples that have a 1/4 barbed end for a rubber hose and a threaded (NPT) end. It seems like I would be better off with one that has a 1/4" NPT rather than the 1/8" NPT to allow better pressure pulses to pump the gas (as I understand the pump operation).
I will need a nut to secure the nipple to the cover and perhaps some kind of sealant to keep the system pressure tight.
I wonder if there are already holes on the engine somewhere to mount the pump? I am not worried about working something out if there aren't.
It seems "doable", but I'm not ready to jump in with both feet yet.
Maybe I'll just order the parts first and let them get comfortable in this environment for a while.
(I'll wait to hear if anyone thinks I am on the wrong track somewhere, before I do.)
Chartman

 

[bertsmobile1]

One of the older L head engine ran the fuel pump off an arm moulded into the dip stick tube.
People who have been around longer than I might know the one I am thinking of.
All Briggs have the same size dip stick tube hole ( Vanguards are different ) so that might be an easy way to try before you start making holes in things.
The reason for using the rocker cover is it comes off so the swarf from making the hole does not end up in the engine.
Ferrit around for a flanged nipple so all that is inside is the flange and the nut ends up on the outside.
The big flange will also make a better seal and if you do go the rocker cover route, dot make a hole through the engine numbers stamped into the cover.

 

[Chartman]

One of the older L head engine ran the fuel pump off an arm moulded into the dip stick tube.
People who have been around longer than I might know the one I am thinking of.
All Briggs have the same size dip stick tube hole ( Vanguards are different ) so that might be an easy way to try before you start making holes in things.
The reason for using the rocker cover is it comes off so the swarf from making the hole does not end up in the engine.
Ferrit around for a flanged nipple so all that is inside is the flange and the nut ends up on the outside.
The big flange will also make a better seal and if you do go the rocker cover route, dot make a hole through the engine numbers stamped into the cover.

AH!
Now I get exactly what you mean about the flanged hose nipple. I will see if I can come up with one.
Now that you have mentioned it, I'm pretty sure that the "PT" in "NPT" means "pipe thread", so those connectors must have tapered threads, which is not really what I want.
I might be able to use a die to straighten out the taper then maybe use a nut on each side, but a flanged nipple definitely seems like the way to go, if I can find one.
Chartman

 

[bertsmobile1]

AH!
Now I get exactly what you mean about the flanged hose nipple. I will see if I can come up with one.
Now that you have mentioned it, I'm pretty sure that the "PT" in "NPT" means "pipe thread", so those connectors must have tapered threads, which is not really what I want.
I might be able to use a die to straighten out the taper then maybe use a nut on each side, but a flanged nipple definitely seems like the way to go, if I can find one.
Chartman

We call these things different names down here so just look up whatever you call outlets from tanks over there.
The flanged ones are made for plastic tanks
Pipe threads come 2 ways
Taper & parallel
Taper is generally used for pipe joiners and parallel for all the rest.
If something is just labeled NP then it is NPP