Buying new mower help me decide

[twall]

.....I want to buy from a close dealer where I can get good service so I'm only considering these two brands so please NO suggestions on how I should buy something else just looking for advice on these 2 mowers.

I think I would prefer the KAW engine over the B&S but the suspension on the Simplicity looks nice what would you buy.

Sounds like you've placed enough stipulations on your 'choices'........seems you've already decided, and just want somebody else to confirm what you already want.

Go with what excites you the best, through the dealer that can service you the most.

I hate ZTR's, anyway, so I don't care really.......just looking through your posts.......

 

[Carl in CT]

I'm not much for zero turns either but have only used them a little bit. John Deere and Simplicity are both great machines. I just bought a Simplicity Conquest tractor with the Vangaurd motor but seriously considered the JDs. Do you know which Briggs engine is on the Simplicity? I like Kawasakis a lot but a Briggs Vangaurd is right there with the Kawasakis. Other Briggs are good but not commercial like the Vangaurd and Kawasaki.

I hate Kohler Commands, never had any luck with them and they are expensive to fix and they need a lot of fixing. The Command is supposed to be their top of the line so I'd stay away from anything Kohler. When they made cast iron workhorses Kohler was king but now they just build average motors but charge a premium for their reputation that they don't live up to and they don't stand behind their products when they break either.

What about Skag zero truns? I don't know much about them myself but I know a lot of landscapers around here use them and like them a lot as far as durability.

Good luck!

 

[Black Bart]

I'm not much for zero turns either but have only used them a little bit. John Deere and Simplicity are both great machines. I just bought a Simplicity Conquest tractor with the Vangaurd motor but seriously considered the JDs. Do you know which Briggs engine is on the Simplicity? I like Kawasakis a lot but a Briggs Vangaurd is right there with the Kawasakis. Other Briggs are good but not commercial like the Vangaurd and Kawasaki.

I hate Kohler Commands, never had any luck with them and they are expensive to fix and they need a lot of fixing. The Command is supposed to be their top of the line so I'd stay away from anything Kohler. When they made cast iron workhorses Kohler was king but now they just build average motors but charge a premium for their reputation that they don't live up to and they don't stand behind their products when they break either.

What about Skag zero truns? I don't know much about them myself but I know a lot of landscapers around here use them and like them a lot as far as durability.

Good luck!

Yes the engine is the professional series B&S
I was at the dealer last Tuesday and all he had was the smaller machine that don't have the 4 wheel suspension.
He said he had 2 on order and they would be in by the end of the week.
I ask him to call me when it came in but have not heard from him yet.

I talked to another dealer that sell both JD and Simplicity and when I mentioned the suspension he said yes Simplicity has a nice Gimmick their.

I ask him why he used the word Gimmick and he said because it is rock hard and don't move.

I want to see for myself but if the suspension don't work well then the JD has bigger tires and would ride better plus it has the Kawasaki engine and I will take it over the B&S any day.
.

I had 2 back surgeries and the ride is a big deal to me but if the Simplicity don't ride better then I will buy the JD.
It is only slightly more money and when I get ready to sell it I will get more for it than I would the Simplicity.

 

[BKBrown]

I wonder why Simplicity would bother with all the extra parts for a suspension if they didn't intend for it to work ????? I wonder if that sales person just likes the Deere better or if they get more profit on the Deere ????
Have you asked in the Simplicity Thread about the suspension ?

I know you said you didn't want other suggestions, but do you have a Tractor Supply near you ? The Bad Boy has a suspension too and is made in USA. Just ignore this part if you like !

 

[Black Bart]

I wonder why Simplicity would bother with all the extra parts for a suspension if they didn't intend for it to work ????? I wonder if that sales person just likes the Deere better or if they get more profit on the Deere ????
Have you asked in the Simplicity Thread about the suspension ?

I know you said you didn't want other suggestions, but do you have a Tractor Supply near you ? The Bad Boy has a suspension too and is made in USA. Just ignore this part if you like !

The Bad Boy is about $800.00 more.

I have a 725 Grasshopper with 72" deck that I have been using for 20 years.

Everything on it is original so it will soon need belts and the tires are all weather checking so 6 new tires will be needed soon.

I decided to sell it and buy a new one.
Since I'm at age where I won't be mowing many more years I don't need a commercial mower just a trouble free one for a few more years so a residential mower will be more than good enough.

Storage is a problem my Grasshopper is 12 feet long my 430 JD with the snow blower on it it a little over 12 feet plus my 180 JD and 3 hand mowers take up a lot of space.

Storing these and 5 cars and 2 pickup trucks has my garages full and I have decided to get rid of some stuff.

I have a buyer for the Grasshopper and I think I have a buyer for the 430 diesel.

When they get the Simplicity in I will find out if the suspension works or not should know some time next week I will post here what I find out..

 

[Carl in CT]

Sorry for the long post but I want to share the info I found. I think the Briggs Pro engine is probably ok for non-commercial use but personally I would not risk it if you can get a Kawasaki for similar money. If you like the Simplicity better and are happy with a good but not commercial grade motor and you can save at least $700 versus the price of the mower with a Kawasaki then the Simplicity with the Briggs Pro may be a good choice.

The Briggs Pros I have seen have the electronic fuel management system which is supposed to be more like a car. It's electronically controlled and I think it has no choke, it does that for you so you just turn the key and it does the rest. Sounds nice but I don't know how proven it is as I think it's fairly new and that makes me nervous. You might want to research that further. I can tell you that in my personal opinion the Simplicity tractors I looked at are built far better than the comparable John Deeres. Don't get me wrong, I think very highly of the JDs and was actually set on buying one but the Simplicities really impressed me, which is why I bought one instead of the JD. I'm not sure how the ZTRs stack up to each other but I have used one of the very expensive high end commercial JD ZTRs and it was an impressive machine but cost well over $10,000.

Personally I will not buy a non-commercial motor again after having nothing but trouble with two Kohler Commands. The only Briggs motor I would consider commercial is the v-twin Vanguard since it is made by Daihatsu, an excellent Japanese manufacturer which is owned 51% by Toyota and produces parts and some entire cars for Toyota, mostly in non-US markets. That's a big difference from the rest of the Briggs line. (single cyclinder Vanguards are still made in the US by Briggs I think). All other Briggs motors are made by Briggs in the US and I hate to say this but they are not in the same class as the Japanese made Vanguards. I honestly don't know if Kawasaki makes different grade motors like everyone else, they probably do. I admit I tend to say all Kawasakis are great but you should try and find out exactly what model Kawasaki motor is on the JD and is it actually a commercial grade motor or not.

One thing I like about the 23hp Vanguard on my Simplicity is the oil cooler. One of my Kohler Commands ran hot all the time, no matter what I or the dealer did to try and help it run cooler, maybe an oil cooler would have helped. Might not be a big deal but I am glad my new mower has it, perhaps the Kawasakis have them too.

My best advice is not to be in a hurry if you can help it (but the grass is growing fast I know). I did a lot of research which is why I was comfortable going with a Simplcity with a Briggs Vanguard when I had been set on a JD with a Kawasaki. Most people lump motors together by brand but you really can't do that. You need to know what you are buying and you need to do all you can to try to eliminate the chances of down the road saying, "Doh, I knew I should have bought the other one!"

 

[Black Bart]

Carl thanks for the info.
Like I posted above I have been mowing for the past 20 years with a 725 Grasshopper with a 72" deck and it is powered with a water cooled Kubota.

I'm selling it and buying a new mower but due to my age buying a Grasshopper or any other heavy built commercial mower would be a waste of money because I will not be around to wear it out.

When you get old it changes the way you look at things.

I still have not heard from the Simplicity dealer but it all depends on the suspension if it works good then I may buy the Simplicity but if it is solid like I have been told then the JD has much bigger tires and a comfortable seat with suspension under it so it may ride better.

The JD has a commercial Kawasaki and it has more power than the B&S in the Simplicity.
If I want to sell in a few years the JD would be easier to sell and command a higher price, better return on my money.

This is not an easy decision since both are great machines.

 

[Carl in CT]

Water-cooled Kubota, now that's a sweet motor!!! I hope the JD/Simplicity dealer gives you the straight info, not just pushing the mower he makes the most money on. Some people say JD parts are more expensive but I don't know if that's true or not, might be.

Comfort is important. I just turned 40 and I appreciate a nice ride more than I did than when I was 20 and landscaping full time, being thrashed around on a one wheel sulky behind a JD commercial walk-behind mower. Actually I loved those and yup, they had Kawasaki motors that were used and abused and never missed a beat.

 

[Black Bart]

Water-cooled Kubota, now that's a sweet motor!!! I hope the JD/Simplicity dealer gives you the straight info, not just pushing the mower he makes the most money on. Some people say JD parts are more expensive but I don't know if that's true or not, might be.

Comfort is important. I just turned 40 and I appreciate a nice ride more than I did than when I was 20 and landscaping full time, being thrashed around on a one wheel sulky behind a JD commercial walk-behind mower. Actually I loved those and yup, they had Kawasaki motors that were used and abused and never missed a beat.

The dealer that sells both of them is 55 miles from my home I called him on the phone just to check pricing.

When I was at local Simplicity dealer last Tuesday he did not have a model with 4 wheel suspension but he had a smaller machine with suspension on the front.

I tried to make it move but when I pushed down with all of my 300 lbs all that happened was I bent the piece that I pushed on but the shocks never moved.

He said he would have the model that I wanted by the middle of the week I ask him to call me when he got it in but have not heard from him.

It has been a week since I was their so I may call him tomorrow and find out if he forgot to call me or if the mower didn't come in yet.

If the suspension don't work well then I will buy the Deere it has a bigger and better deck ( more capacity } also the Deere has the Kawasaki engine and I would much prefer it over the B&S.

Another thing is warranty is 2 years on Simplicity and 4 years on the Deere.
If the shocks on the bigger machine works like the smaller one it will be a deal breaker.

 

[Carl in CT]

Yup, I have to agree with you, certainly can't go wrong with the Kawasaki and there's no point of a suspension that doesn't move. I wonder if the suspension moves with the weight of the rider and the machine on it while moving over rough ground. Still, I would have thought 300 lbs would have at least made it budge. As much as I like the Simplicity tractors and still think the ones with the Vanguards are killer machines JD is sounding like the better ZTR unless that other Simplicity model has a better suspension but it's not sounding promissing. Keep us posted, I will be curious how you make out.