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i have been thinking and i would like to create a 4x4 lawn mower just for a mud toy but the problem i keep coming across is how to drive the front end and still have steering any suggestions as to what i could do to make this work?

This has been brought up a few times try a search real quick. However as many times as its been brought up I have yet to see one get done took a rear end and set it up under the front but couldn't figure out how to rig up steering best I could come up with is a kind of tilt style steering and the other more practical required some fabrication

A belt driven rear axle mounted upside down with two brackets close to the wheels that is basically 12" piece of metal sticking straight up connected to each other with the steering in the middle to pivot. Problem would require a completely new suspension

Farm Show Magazine did a special edition a while back. It had about anything you would like to do done with riding lawn mowers from turning them int articulated steering to making them all wheeled drive to making them tracked vehicles....... At the end of each article there is a contact for the person doing the modifications. If you like to build stuff then you outta contact them and get a copy of it. It has hundreds of modifications, rebuilds, rep owners, and more.

Use a go kart live axle front and back.
You can get them with a gear box on them

Carscw said:

Use a go kart live axle front and back.
You can get them with a gear box on them

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that would be the best bet. using the dual tie rod steering.

I am sure it can be done. You just can't be bashful, and just spend ,spend and spend. A nice shop that is fully equipped with the latest equipment with a crew of skilled operators. Just watch orange county choppers it will give you the right idea. Just maybe it would be a little easier and cheaper to buy one already made??? But you are the person to know how big your wallet is.

Mechanically, the easiest way would be to use a couple of hub drives for the front like these
36V250W SWXU Front Drive V-Brake Hub Motor - BMSBATTERY

You need to add a generator to supply 36v to these motors. If you add some control circuits and heavy duty batteries, you have a on-demand hybrid 2/4 wheel drive riding mower.

Edited: Sorry the link above is for only bicycle hubs but similar, heavier duty motors for utility vehicles exist if you search for "hub motor".

panabiker said:

Mechanically, the easiest way would be to use a couple of hub drives for the front like these
36V250W SWXU Front Drive V-Brake Hub Motor - BMSBATTERY

You need to add a generator to supply 36v to these motors. If you add some control circuits and heavy duty batteries, you have a on-demand hybrid 2/4 wheel drive riding mower.

Edited: Sorry the link above is for only bicycle hubs but similar, heavier duty motors for utility vehicles exist if you search for "hub motor".

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Sure looks easy them motors are just going to slip into place. You are living in a fancy world here. Do you have any idea what something like that would involve. Lets get back into the real world. Yes it can be done but to do a job that amounts to anything will take some engineering and don't forget money. OK now all this money and time spent and it doesn't work out right then what? Yes by all means go for it. I am still going to say it would be cheaper to buy one already made.

As fun as it would be to build if you do not already have the parts laying around it would be cheaper to buy a atv.

Now if you have a old 4x4 atv you can use the front end on the mower. Assuming you have a welder and the know how and skill.
I still do not see the need for the four wheel drive.

Carscw said:

As fun as it would be to build if you do not already have the parts laying around it would be cheaper to buy a atv.

Now if you have a old 4x4 atv you can use the front end on the mower. Assuming you have a welder and the know how and skill.
I still do not see the need for the four wheel drive.

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Now I can see a need for 4X4. When I get a heavy load of fire wood to take out of the woods. I have two ATV's one a 2X4 and the other 4X4 and I need the 4X4 to get through the woods. Now as I understand that is what the OP wants 4X4 for is the mud. I am just saying it would be cheaper and better to buy what you need instead of making it.

reynoldston said:

Now I can see a need for 4X4. When I get a heavy load of fire wood to take out of the woods. I have two ATV's one a 2X4 and the other 4X4 and I need the 4X4 to get through the woods. Now as I understand that is what the OP wants 4X4 for is the mud. I am just saying it would be cheaper and better to buy what you need instead of making it.

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I can see it for work but not for a mower just to play in the mud. I ride my mud mowers in 2 foot deep mud and never get stuck.

Carscw said:

I can see it for work but not for a mower just to play in the mud. I ride my mud mowers in 2 foot deep mud and never get stuck.

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Better tires probably would go a long way and are cheaper and less work lol

This is a rally with atv rear tires off a 110cc
Stock engine pulley and a 3inch rear pulley
17.5 hp Not real fast maybe 20mph but a whole lot of fun in the mud

Carscw said:

I can see it for work but not for a mower just to play in the mud. I ride my mud mowers in 2 foot deep mud and never get stuck.

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I don't run my mowers in the mud or off road. This is reserved for my ATV's. I have ran in a lot of off road trails and have found there is a different types of mud. Two foot of pure mud is deep. I would say that would be a challenge even for the best ATV's with mud tires and four wheel drive. Now if you got a good hard base under two foot of soft mud and water I can see it could happen.

reynoldston said:

I don't run my mowers in the mud or off road. This is reserved for my ATV's. I have ran in a lot of off road trails and have found there is a different types of mud. Two foot of pure mud is deep. I would say that would be a challenge even for the best ATV's with mud tires and four wheel drive. Now if you got a good hard base under two foot of soft mud and water I can see it could happen.

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Playing in the mud or even just trail riding on a modified mower is a lot of fun

Carscw said:

Playing in the mud or even just trail riding on a modified mower is a lot of fun

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How fast do they go? Are they legal on trails? ATV's and off road motorcycles need licenses plates and insurance. Can you even buy insurance for a lawn mower? It looks like you would have to run them on your own land.

We don't need tags on ATVs here bit you also can not drive them on public land or roads. We do have spots that everyone rides. I mostly ride on my own land.

There are a couple go kart dirt tracks that will let us race a few times a year.

If you really want to play in the mud you can go to the mud park.

http://m.westgamudpark.com

reynoldston said:

How fast do they go? Are they legal on trails? ATV's and off road motorcycles need licenses plates and insurance. Can you even buy insurance for a lawn mower? It looks like you would have to run them on your own land.

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My rally only goes 20mph the craftsman has hit 45mph

Carscw said:

My rally only goes 20mph the craftsman has hit 45mph

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what your pulley ratios?

metz12 said:

what your pulley ratios?

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On the rally stock engine 3 inch rear.
The craftsman 6 inch engine 2 inch rear

yeah, that would make you go around the 40's! my buddy and i just did one, 5 on the front and 3 on the back. the thing goes like 35ish. rear tires are the ags, and the front are the stock turf savers. 12.5 flathead. we are probably going to lower it and put a bigger engine pulley on the thing. if i can find a bigger motor (hopefully an opposed twin) will go on my craftsman and the 20hp kohler will go on the race tractor.

metz12 said:

yeah, that would make you go around the 40's! my buddy and i just did one, 5 on the front and 3 on the back. the thing goes like 35ish. rear tires are the ags, and the front are the stock turf savers. 12.5 flathead. we are probably going to lower it and put a bigger engine pulley on the thing. if i can find a bigger motor (hopefully an opposed twin) will go on my craftsman and the 20hp kohler will go on the race tractor.

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A 12.5 flathead is the best engine to use quickest throttle response and easy to get racing parts for. First thing I change is the flywheel to a lighter race flywheel. Mostly for safety. A stock one is heavy and will come apart and take your head off.

Carscw said:

We don't need tags on ATVs here bit you also can not drive them on public land or roads. We do have spots that everyone rides. I mostly ride on my own land.

There are a couple go kart dirt tracks that will let us race a few times a year.

If you really want to play in the mud you can go to the mud park.

West Ga Mud Park..

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Sound like a completely different environment then where I ride. Where I am riding its mountains and wood land. I have never came across a mower on the trails, but a lot of motorcycles and ATV's. Some days we put over a 100 miles on our bikes. The law dose check us for plates and insurance. I am afraid my mower never leaves my yard unless I mow the neighbors yard.

reynoldston said:

Sound like a completely different environment then where I ride. Where I am riding its mountains and wood land. I have never came across a mower on the trails, but a lot of motorcycles and ATV's. Some days we put over a 100 miles on our bikes. The law dose check us for plates and insurance. I am afraid my mower never leaves my yard unless I mow the neighbors yard.

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Sounds like fun. I have not been trail riding on a bike in years

Carscw said:

Sounds like fun. I have not been trail riding on a bike in years

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That part of me I just never outgrew. I am in my 70's and still ride on and off road. A lot slower now that my body can't take the hard use anymore. I also prefer two wheels over four or three. Just something about a bike on a nice twisty road that get the blood flowing.

Carscw said:

A 12.5 flathead is the best engine to use quickest throttle response and easy to get racing parts for. First thing I change is the flywheel to a lighter race flywheel. Mostly for safety. A stock one is heavy and will come apart and take your head off.

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probably what i will do then. we are both on the lookout for any cheap mowers to make an offroading mower for me. a bunch of my buddies go 4wheeling in their trucks and jeeps, and i dont want to wheel my cherokee being my only vehicle, so i want something to beat on besides my car, like they do with their everyday driver.

I used to have a racing mower that I played around on and hit 50 Mph. I loved drag racing my neighbors on there four wheelers on one of there drive ways lol but I run a 7in on the motor and 2in on the transaxle and the motor was a 18 horse v-twin Kohler command with Shaved heads and a aluminum flywheel with dual exhaust coming out on both sides straight pipes so it was nice and loud. I wrecked it about 2 years ago and messed up the frame I miss it a lot but now I'm building a new one . If it can be thought of you can do it to a lawn mower as long as you have the tools, time, money, and you really want it you can do it but good luck building it and I'm sure y'all can figure some way of doing it