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Snowstorms and traffic accidents

#1

I

indypower

Everytime there is a snowstorm, there are a lot of traffic accidents. Cars slide off the road, flip over and such. Even in this last storm yesterday, lots of accidents. You would think this late in the season and with all the "practice" everyone had in January, they would know how to drive in snow by now. As I look at pics of roll overs from the news, I notice no one is using snow tires. They are using so called "all season" tires. They are not worth a damn in the northern 1/3 of the U.S. , the snow belt. When radial tires came out, some one said "you dont need snow tires when using radial tires" since they "squat". Then the tire companies came out with "all season" tires. Well all season tires do NOT have the traction needed for snow. My neighbor had a problem getting out of his drive way (over the snow plow bank) and said "I bought this Honda Pilot all wheel drive so I wouldn't have problems like this." I helped push him out and told him that his so called all season tires are no good in the snows that we get. And he needs to buy full snow tires. I have full snow tires on my 2003 Dodge Ram 1500 2-wheel drive and have almost no problems. I have gone thru a snowdrift that a 4x4 got stuck in. He had all season tires.
My advice to those who live in the snow belt, is get a good set of full snow tires.
This is a decent tread.

Yokohama Tires


#2

BKBrown

BKBrown

Just like everything else, Some "all season" tires are better in snow than others. I personally (having grown up in the NY {south of Buffalo} snow belt) have a set of all season and a set of "winter snow and ice rated" tires, I run the all seasons in late spring to late fall and winters in the snow months.

If the expense is not reasonable for you to have 2 sets then check the ratings for traction when you buy the all seasons.

I personally want the best rubber under my vehicles since there are only 4 little patches of rubber to keep you going and stop you. :biggrin:


#3

BGC

BGC

People will use any gimmick to sell something and this should truly be against the law if it isn't already. It is sad that so many accidents happen though. The tire company should be held responsible for misrepresenting their tires.


#4

BKBrown

BKBrown

All Season, Winter, AWD, or 4WD does not mean you can act like an idiot on snow and ice. Good Vehicle and Good Tires make it easier, but most of the result lies in the driver (good or bad).

Sometimes there is no control and sometimes it is just the other idiot that you can't avoid. :eek:

Taking it easy and thinking ahead avoids many problems.


#5

JDgreen

JDgreen

BKBrown said:
All Season, Winter, AWD, or 4WD does not mean you can act like an idiot on snow and ice. Good Vehicle and Good Tires make it easier, but most of the result lies in the driver (good or bad).

Sometimes there is no control and sometimes it is just the other idiot that you can't avoid. :eek:

Taking it easy and thinking ahead avoids many problems.
Click to expand...

I drove heavy commercial straight trucks for a living during my 31 year career, often in the UP of Michigan during the worst winter weather they had. I have also driven my personal vehicles hundreds of thousands of miles during my 42 years of licensed driving, and in all that time I have NEVER gotten off the road or been stuck nor caused an accident in either my own cars or my work trucks. NEVER. IMHO the biggest cause of traffic accidents, fatilities, and geting off the road are from two "I's"...IMPATIENCE and INATTENTION. People drive too fast, follow too close, run red lights, etc. In bad weather some of the worst offenders are the reckless fools who think just because their vehicle has 4wd or AWD, they are magically immune to the laws of friction, gravity, and inertia.

Good traction is an asset, but so is common sense and caution...I drive my GMC 99% of the time during winter in two wheel drive...I do not NEED 4wd to make up for my lack of driving skill. I consider myself a (retired) professional driver and thanks for letting me have my say.


#6

L

LandN

JDgreen said:
I drove heavy commercial straight trucks for a living during my 31 year career, often in the UP of Michigan during the worst winter weather they had. I have also driven my personal vehicles hundreds of thousands of miles during my 42 years of licensed driving, and in all that time I have NEVER gotten off the road or been stuck nor caused an accident in either my own cars or my work trucks. NEVER. IMHO the biggest cause of traffic accidents, fatilities, and geting off the road are from two "I's"...IMPATIENCE and INATTENTION. People drive too fast, follow too close, run red lights, etc. In bad weather some of the worst offenders are the reckless fools who think just because their vehicle has 4wd or AWD, they are magically immune to the laws of friction, gravity, and inertia.

Good traction is an asset, but so is common sense and caution...I drive my GMC 99% of the time during winter in two wheel drive...I do not NEED 4wd to make up for my lack of driving skill. I consider myself a (retired) professional driver and thanks for letting me have my say.
Click to expand...

WELL STATED :thumbsup:


#7

JDgreen

JDgreen

indypower said:
Everytime there is a snowstorm, there are a lot of traffic accidents. Cars slide off the road, flip over and such. Even in this last storm yesterday, lots of accidents. You would think this late in the season and with all the "practice" everyone had in January, they would know how to drive in snow by now. As I look at pics of roll overs from the news, I notice no one is using snow tires. They are using so called "all season" tires. They are not worth a damn in the northern 1/3 of the U.S. , the snow belt. When radial tires came out, some one said "you dont need snow tires when using radial tires" since they "squat". Then the tire companies came out with "all season" tires. Well all season tires do NOT have the traction needed for snow. My neighbor had a problem getting out of his drive way (over the snow plow bank) and said "I bought this Honda Pilot all wheel drive so I wouldn't have problems like this." I helped push him out and told him that his so called all season tires are no good in the snows that we get. And he needs to buy full snow tires. I have full snow tires on my 2003 Dodge Ram 1500 2-wheel drive and have almost no problems. I have gone thru a snowdrift that a 4x4 got stuck in. He had all season tires.
My advice to those who live in the snow belt, is get a good set of full snow tires.
This is a decent tread.

Yokohama Tires
Click to expand...

Truck I had before my current 4wd GMC was a '90 Ford F-150, I had two sets of rims and tires, used BFG street radials in the summer and full snow tires on a second set of rims during the winter. Even with no positraction (but with weight in the cargo bed and a cap on the back) it had better rear traction in snow than my current GMC does with all-season tires and a locker in 2wd. Given todays prices for tires and a scecond set of rims, few people want to go to the expense of having a separate set of winter tires. The alternative is to have a pair of high traction winter radials mounted and balanced in late fall, then demounted and the all season pair of radials remounted in the spring. Labor charges for that add up fast.


#8

K

KennyV

Traffic Accidents are for the most part, caused by people, not equipment failure.
Put more people on the road and there is an excellent chance that there is going to be more accidents no matter what the weather...

As to tires... Michelin Hydro edge have proven to be the best, BEST all season design I have ever had...

Back to people again, there are those that have NO idea that there even is any difference from one tire to the next... some folks just will not bother to find out what makes for a good tire. The information is available, traction ratings, temperature and wear ratings... there are those that don't even realize there are speed and load ratings on tires. So it is not to be too surprising that there are those that pay no attention to tread type and design... :smile:KennyV


#9

JDgreen

JDgreen

KennyV said:
Traffic Accidents are for the most part, caused by people, not equipment failure.
Put more people on the road and there is an excellent chance that there is going to be more accidents no matter what the weather...

As to tires... Michelin Hydro edge have proven to be the best, BEST all season design I have ever had...

Back to people again, there are those that have NO idea that there even is any difference from one tire to the next... some folks just will not bother to find out what makes for a good tire. The information is available, traction ratings, temperature and wear ratings... there are those that don't even realize there are speed and load ratings on tires. So it is not to be too surprising that there are those that pay no attention to tread type and design... :smile:KennyV
Click to expand...

Kenny, Consumer Reports issue 11/09 did rate the Michelin Hydroedge as the best all season tire of the two dozen they tested, if you indeed own those tires how do you rate them in snow traction? My '04 Lesabre has Michelin Symetry tires, they are great on wet and dry pavement but snow traction is so-so. We get serious snow here so I am thinking about getting the Hydroedges as replacements. Thanks for your input...:thumbsup:


#10

L

LandN

KennyV said:
Traffic Accidents are for the most part, caused by people, not equipment failure.
Put more people on the road and there is an excellent chance that there is going to be more accidents no matter what the weather...

As to tires... Michelin Hydro edge have proven to be the best, BEST all season design I have ever had...

Back to people again, there are those that have NO idea that there even is any difference from one tire to the next... some folks just will not bother to find out what makes for a good tire. The information is available, traction ratings, temperature and wear ratings... there are those that don't even realize there are speed and load ratings on tires. So it is not to be too surprising that there are those that pay no attention to tread type and design... :smile:KennyV
Click to expand...

Your right kenny, people dont know about the tires on their car or other functions as well, which is REALLY REALLY scary when you especially see an aged vehicle traveling the roads you have to think to yourself ......do they really know whats going on with that car? i've spent my whole life in the auto repair/ retail gas business and i've seen a lot of people take their car and just "point and shoot" and hope for the best...tires are a lot better today than years ago when i started selling reversable red wall tires and dual white stripes on the same tire:thumbsup:


#11

K

KennyV

JDgreen said:
K
... if you indeed own those tires how do you rate them in snow traction?
Click to expand...

I do indeed run them and they have been nothing but incredible ...

I recommended them to a friend of mine down in Oklahoma... He puts on close to 1000 miles a wk... He has never had tires that run as well as the Hydro Edge his current set has OVER 130 thousand miles on them, they still have good tread depth and great snow traction, tho he says not quite as good as when they were new... he is going to get another set this spring. :smile:KennyV
You will not regret Hydro Edge...:thumbsup:


#12

RobertBrown

RobertBrown

JDgreen said:
I drove heavy commercial straight trucks for a living during my 31 year career, often in the UP of Michigan during the worst winter weather they had. I have also driven my personal vehicles hundreds of thousands of miles during my 42 years of licensed driving, and in all that time I have NEVER gotten off the road or been stuck nor caused an accident in either my own cars or my work trucks. NEVER. IMHO the biggest cause of traffic accidents, fatilities, and geting off the road are from two "I's"...IMPATIENCE and INATTENTION. People drive too fast, follow too close, run red lights, etc. In bad weather some of the worst offenders are the reckless fools who think just because their vehicle has 4wd or AWD, they are magically immune to the laws of friction, gravity, and inertia.

Good traction is an asset, but so is common sense and caution...I drive my GMC 99% of the time during winter in two wheel drive...I do not NEED 4wd to make up for my lack of driving skill. I consider myself a (retired) professional driver and thanks for letting me have my say.
Click to expand...

It's not just snow, here in Florida we have 2 seasons, dry and wet, everybody knows it's going to rain and everybody knows when it raining, yet there are alway a lot more accidents when it's raining.
You are absolutely correct JD, some people push the envelope and lose the gamble. It's just not worth it. Driving is, statistically, the most dangerous activity that you are likely to do. more dangerous than flying.


#13

N

NickNack

What gets me is this - why are all these people out there in the middle of a snowstorm anyway? Schools are closed. There is a winter weather watch. There's a traffic advisory saying "if you don't need to go out then don't" but you see people out. What is so important????


#14

A

abeja_reina_1989

Seriously, when the weather starts getting bad, if you don't have the right tires you are going to notice a difference. I never knew how important good snow tires were until I got my first car. It's pretty crazy what a change in tread can do!


#15

JDgreen

JDgreen

NickNack said:
What gets me is this - why are all these people out there in the middle of a snowstorm anyway? Schools are closed. There is a winter weather watch. There's a traffic advisory saying "if you don't need to go out then don't" but you see people out. What is so important????
Click to expand...

Unlike me, who is retired, people like my wife have to go to this place called "work" or they don't get paid.


#16

JDgreen

JDgreen

KennyV said:
I do indeed run them and they have been nothing but incredible ...

I recommended them to a friend of mine down in Oklahoma... He puts on close to 1000 miles a wk... He has never had tires that run as well as the Hydro Edge his current set has OVER 130 thousand miles on them, they still have good tread depth and great snow traction, tho he says not quite as good as when they were new... he is going to get another set this spring. :smile:KennyV
You will not regret Hydro Edge...:thumbsup:
Click to expand...

Thanks much for your input, the CR report tested 52 different all-season tires, one group of 23 were conventional all season type, and the other two groups added 30 more in two speed ratings of performance all season tires, and of the 52 different tires CR rated a total of 24 tires "fair" or "poor" in snow traction. The Hydroedges were rated "fair" in snow traction but the very best of the group of 52 in tread life...

I will get a set of the Hydroedges for my replacements, I would trust a recommendation from a LMF member over the whole group of CR testers, THANKS MUCH. :thumbsup::thumbsup:


#17

A

AndyMan

It's also important that your tires be properly inflated. Underinflating or overinflating can both reduce the actual traction that your tires get, regardless of what they were designed for.


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