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New member here! Having some issues with the B&S Intek 20hp in my Ariens mower. The model number for the engine is 406777, type 0442B1. I had a surging problem, so I purchased a new carb. It appeared to be identical, except for the fuel solenoid. The OEM one was on the bottom of the fuel bowl that operated in a vertical motion. The new carb had a solenoid that was horizontal. I just assumed it was a modification for something that was an issue with the vertical one. Installation was easy, and upon attempting to start it, I had to use ether to get it to fire. Once it was running, it had the same symptoms as the OEM carb. I decided to remove the fuel bowls from both carbs and compare. In the OEM carb, there was a plastic part that fits over the plunger. The new carb didn't have any such part. There was a metal shaft built into the fuel bowl, with a rubber o-ring that was crushed during assembly.
I can't seem to wrap my head around how the horizontal fuel solenoid works to shut off the fuel. Can someone here offer an explanation, or maybe a diagram of that particular carb so I can better understand how it works? Seems to me that it's missing something.

Thanks!

All the fuel solenoid is required to do is cut off the fuel supply to the main jet so the engine starves as well as not having any spark.
IT is a EPA regulation to prevent the engine pumping out unburned fuel to the atmosphere.
So it is an on or off device.
Originally they simply replaced the bowl bolt but in that position they also accumulate all the debris that ends up in the float bowl and get gummed up so stop working .

Something not right with the fuel solenoid as the 798779 solenoid here does have a white plastic tip used in the 798778 fuel bowls. Now if that that fuel transfer tube O-ring is damaged it can cause problems.

Now the after market KIPA solenoid is all metal but it still has a larger sealing end. Even the current Briggs solenoid has the all metal tip.

Thanks for the replies. The solenoid you're showing is the one that came with the new carb. My question is, how does it function? I can see how the OEM one works, but I can't see how the horizontal solenoid works. There are no other moving parts in the fuel bowl, like there is in the OEM one. Am I making any sense here? It just seems like a part or parts may be missing.
Maybe if I could find a diagram of the new carb it would help?

Well, this is depressing. I had disassembled the OEM carb, cleaned it, and reassembled it and installed it back on the engine. It started right up and ran very well. Idled nicely and accelerated well. So, today I am mowing, and it suddenly started surging. I turned off the mower deck, and headed for the garage. Then it smoothed out and began running well again. I started up the deck, and finished the lawn.

Any ideas what may be causing this?

Thanks!

OK, researching the carb parts and I seem to be missing the main jet housing in the new carb. I guess I will be contacting the seller. However, I still don't understand how the horizontal fuel solenoid functions. Still trying to wrap my head around this.

Look and see where in the float bowl the main jet fuel hole is.

If you missing the fuel transfer tube assembly you know it as the float is attaching to it. The main jet is inside this transfer tube assembly.

As for the fuel bowl the horizontal solenoid opens up a hole that goes to center of bowl and then that mates with the fuel transfer tube hence the o-ring for sealing purposes. Note the black wire in the below image that is fed through this hole.

OK, I guess I may be incorrect. But the original carb had a separate main jet housing. I should take the float bowl off again and compare.

Ah I went and looked at the IPL and you right as I was think of the single barrel version instead of the twin barrel.

Forgive me as I should had looked at the IPL again before typing. It should have awn me we are posting about a twin barrel with central transfer tube like the Kawasaki carburetor I working on but having to putting it back a few days as I wait on the transfer tube gasket that is coming in Monday.


and not this one.

Another issue I'm having is getting the O-ring on the emulsion tube to seal with the fuel tower on the float bowl. It just seems to large in diameter to fit. Is there something I'm doing wrong?

It may have swelled from E10 fuel contact but normally they don't. It will be a tight fit but bowl should slide up into it when it is in the transfer tube.

I don't have any of the 841653 o-rings in inventory to check the sizing on. But I do have the Kawasaki version (which should be the same o-ring) on hand and it is approximately 8.5mm x 14mm x 2.62mm. Note these measurements are thru the plastic bag they are in.

Thanks. The O-ring was apparently damaged during factory assembly, but it's not too bad. I just can't figure out why it won't fit up in the emulsion tube. If I put it on the metal tower in the float bowl, it won't allow me to assemble the bowl to the carb body, like it's too tight of a fit for the emulsion tube.

They are a very tight fit, I can not assemble them by pressing together with my hands, even with a TINY squirt of silicon spray .
Have bought a replacement tube only to find it was equally hard.
OTOH all that I have done have worked just fine after reassembly

bertsmobile1 said:

They are a very tight fit, I can not assemble them by pressing together with my hands, even with a TINY squirt of silicon spray .
Have bought a replacement tube only to find it was equally hard.
OTOH all that I have done have worked just fine after reassembly

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In your experience, was it better to reassemble the carb with the o-ring inside the emulsion tube, or installed on the float bowl?

IT made no real difference
I reassemble them upside down so it is O ring inside the emulsion tube and like I said a touch of silicon spray lube .
To me it seems like they are using an O ring that is too hard but I am not privy to all of the design parrameters of the carb, just one of the mugs who has to clean & repair them

Gotcha. I agree, that's a rather stiff rubber o-ring.

I have 2 o-ring kits, one metric and one SAE. I couldn't find a similar o-ring in either kit. I was hoping to find one that wasn't as stiff. Apparently these are made special for the manufacturer.

And rated for fuel.

slomo

Most O ring kits are neoprene rubber which is not suitable for petrol
In reality they are only good for water or for putting under flanged plugs & caps to prevent them from vibrating loose .
And these are the good ones.
Heaven only knows what the kits from China with no indication of what they are made from are actually made of.
I have been guilty of doing the same thing when walking through the supermarket in brain dead mode.
Last time I opened the box the O rings had sweated and were becoming slimey
Eventually I will throw them all out and put the O rings bought from McMaster Carr in there in place of the 2 drawer units they live in now.

I use a lot of them on my vintage motorcycles behind inspection caps & even the rocker caps to stop them falling off while riding so I have got my moneys worth out of them in the cost saving for replacing all of the plugs I used to use but for motor use they are useless & none of the sizes will fit any tap or other water fitting I own .

And yes I use Master's and Grainger too here for the Nitrile and Buna o-rings. But the o-rings kits I brough 20 yrs ago from JC Whitney are still good today though most of the needed sizes are never in those kits. As a shop Just cant see paying what Briggs want for one the above o-rings as according to my recent price file they are wanting $8 for just one o-ring and Bert you know darn well what they cost from McMaster's although we must buy in multiples.

Yes but I can charge them out at $ 5.00 along with the B & S part number so convince the customer I am better value than the glass fronts .
Just a shame I can't get away with a 300% mark up on expensive items .

I have used a dozen or so of these with no problems. Usually all i need to fix a nikki 2 barrel.

So this o-ring is a part specifically manufactured for B&S?

CLStout said:

So this o-ring is a part specifically manufactured for B&S?

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In China.

slomo

Well, ain't that just peachy. Of all countries, huh?
Could that possibly be the country of origin for the carburetor, also?

CLStout said:

Well, ain't that just peachy. Of all countries, huh?
Could that possibly be the country of origin for the carburetor, also?

Click to expand...

Just about all large public companies where the founders do not still have majority shareholdings are actually run by the major shareholders who are by & large hedge funds, money management funds , superannuation & pension funds , etc.
These organizations dictate to the board what returns they must get or they will vote the directors off the board.
Thus the management are forced to look at making the maximum possible profit every day, even if in the long term it will lead to the ruin of the company.
Thus nearly every part on an "American made" product will be made in the third world country.
GM built a new aluminium foundry in Mitichagan in 2016, that was the first foundry built on American soil since 1984.
China opens a new foundry every 6 weeks and India is averaging 4 a year .
When the financial leeches have sucked a business dry, they just move their funds elsewhere and destroy another business.
Remember the thieves working for the money companies get paid massive bonuses for every 0,01% the return they get beats the market index every quarter and they don't care how many companies they destroy or peoples lives they destroy, or how many people end up killing themselves they have no conscious just a relentless drive to accumulate more money.
this is exactly how the GFC happened

Hammermechanicman said:

I have used a dozen or so of these with no problems. Usually all i need to fix a nikki 2 barrel.

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From memory they come from DC spares in HK and are around $ 1.20 a hit so he is buying them by the box load , probably down to less than $1 a piece and flogging them for $ 6 . a piece on evilpay & probably amozone as well .
Exactly why the economy of the USA is in such a bad shape .
Note they are currently out of stock .

Not exactly sure which evilbayer i got them from. I still have about a half a dozen of them. Cheaper than the forty some dollar Briggs rebuild kits.

Well, I checked the float bowl, and from what I can tell everything is there. I got the float bowl attached by putting the o-ring inside the emulsion tube. Went together much easier. However, I did find something missing. The OEM carb has a spring on the choke shaft between the lever and the carb body. The new one doesn't have a spring. And it's a very tight fit between the lever and the carb body. There is about 3/8" clearance on the original carb between the body and the choke lever. There's a foam rubber disc between the carb and the lever on the new carb, where the spring should be. Even without the foam disc, there isn't enough room to install a spring, at least not one similar to the one on the original carb. Any ideas?

Thanks

Choke spring is only necessary when you have a single control wire that does both the choke & the throttle .
If it has individual control wires then the spring is not required .
That is why when ordering parts those code numbers from the engine & mower are important

Thanks. I did make sure that it was listed for that particular engine. And yes, mine is a single cable control.

Then you have the wrong carb
The work around is to get a small weak tension spring then drill a hole in the choke plate on top of the carb on the opposite side to the control wire ( might be one there already ) then pop the spring on there to open the choke when the cable backs off

I wonder if it might be easier to just ask for an exchange? Or, just in case, where might I get my hands on some small springs like that?

CLStout said:

I wonder if it might be easier to just ask for an exchange? Or, just in case, where might I get my hands on some small springs like that?

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Most hardwear stores or auto parts stores or engineering supply stores will have an assortment rack of small tension springs