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Hello,

Lawn Tractor: Craftsman YS4500
Model: 917.276680

I'm trying to figure out why my lawn tractor will not self-propel. Background on what led to the issue- I was mowing down some tall grasses and suddenly my lawn tractor would not self-propel. I thought the drive belt had become worn and was slipping, so I ordered a new one. I replaced the drive belt on my tractor with the recommended part number (140218), but as you can see in the posted video, it is very loose and will not propel my tractor as it should. Although it is the correct part number, perhaps this belt should not be advertised as fitting my tractor?

Do you see anything in the video I am missing that could be the problem? Thank you for your time.

that belt is way too long.
Also grab the pulley on top of the box and check that it has not stripped on the shaft.

Did you check the old belt against the new one for length ?
Belts do not stretch they get thinner so sit deeper in the pulleys and become looser.

usual sign of a wearing belt is the mower will only travel at low speeds and won't pull up hills
Instant stopping is generally something broken or brake jambed on.

bertsmobile1 said:

that belt is way too long.
Also grab the pulley on top of the box and check that it has not stripped on the shaft.

Did you check the old belt against the new one for length ?
Belts do not stretch they get thinner so sit deeper in the pulleys and become looser.

usual sign of a wearing belt is the mower will only travel at low speeds and won't pull up hills
Instant stopping is generally something broken or brake jambed on.

Click to expand...

Thank you for your reply. Yes, I did check the belt against the old one. It seemed OK.

I failed to mention that upon inspection when my tractor would barely propel, I found that the idler pulley was bad. You should be able to see on the video that I did replace that pulley. Now, which pulley are you talking about when you say "on top of the box." Pardon my ignorance. Perhaps you can direct me to that pulley using the video as a reference. Thank you.

BiC said:

Thank you for your reply. Yes, I did check the belt against the old one. It seemed OK.

I failed to mention that upon inspection when my tractor would barely propel, I found that the idler pulley was bad. You should be able to see on the video that I did replace that pulley. Now, which pulley are you talking about when you say "on top of the box." Pardon my ignorance. Perhaps you can direct me to that pulley using the video as a reference. Thank you.

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Looks to me as though your belt is NOT properly routed ...... check your manual for proper installation.....looks like its on wrong side of the black pulley ...
took a look at a manual ... it DOES appear the belt is on the wrong side of the black stationary pulley..the FLAT side of the belt should be touching the pulley ( its NOT a V pulley ..is it ..?? ) see pic attached ..notice belt pinched
give it try ...

Boobala said:

Looks to me as though your belt is NOT properly routed ...... check your manual for proper installation.....looks like its on wrong side of the black pulley ...

Click to expand...

Thank you for the reply. It is correctly routed according to the diagram on my tractor's undercarriage.

BiC said:

Thank you for your reply. Yes, I did check the belt against the old one. It seemed OK.

I failed to mention that upon inspection when my tractor would barely propel, I found that the idler pulley was bad. You should be able to see on the video that I did replace that pulley. Now, which pulley are you talking about when you say "on top of the box." Pardon my ignorance. Perhaps you can direct me to that pulley using the video as a reference. Thank you.

Click to expand...

Looks to me as though your belt is NOT properly routed ...... check your manual for proper installation.....looks like its on wrong side of the black pulley ...

BiC said:

Thank you for the reply. It is correctly routed according to the diagram on my tractor's undercarriage.

Click to expand...

Whatever ....!!!!

Just watched the video.
The dang belt is on wrong

Sent from my iPhone using LMF

Boobala said:

Whatever ....!!!!

Click to expand...

Here's the diagram (don't know why the forum loads it sideways).

Is the routing diagram on my tractor (and in my owner's manual) wrong?

I am following the diagram from the front of the tractor (engine pulley) to the rear.


(

Carscw said:

Just watched the video.
The dang belt is on wrong

Sent from my iPhone using LMF

Click to expand...

Is the routing diagram on my tractor (and in my owner's manual) wrong?

I am following the diagram from the front of the tractor (engine pulley) to the rear.

BiC said:

Is the routing diagram on my tractor (and in my owner's manual) wrong?

I am following the diagram from the front of the tractor (engine pulley) to the rear.

Click to expand...

I've been looking at this again ...... it DOES appear ...you have the belt routed as per the diagram ...
what I cant understand is ..... IF that pulley (black one) closest to the transaxle is a flat pulley (where the belt rides) that must be
the problem ... meaning the diagram IS wrong... why not try the belt installed on the other side of that pulley (but only if it is a FLAT pulley !! ... see how it operates WITHOUT running the engine... IF it appears OK then try a quick trial with engine running ... WORST scenario it doesnt work & possibly "eat" the belt ...

Boobala said:

I've been looking at this again ...... it DOES appear ...you have the belt routed as per the diagram ...
what I cant understand is ..... IF that pulley (black one) closest to the transaxle is a flat pulley (where the belt rides) that must be
the problem ... meaning the diagram IS wrong... why not try the belt installed on the other side of that pulley (but only if it is a FLAT pulley !! ... see how it operates WITHOUT running the engine... IF it appears OK then try a quick trial with engine running ... WORST scenario it doesnt work & possibly "eat" the belt ...

Click to expand...

I tried your suggestion. It is not a flat pulley like the "stationary flat idler" on the diagram. Also, placing the belt on the other side of the black pulley places the belt out of the belt guide (located on the right side of that pulley- looks like a "V" or "U". I ordered another belt (shorter one) which should arrive tomorrow. I'll post an update then. Thank you for your time.

Since I have done this once(put the belt on and did not put around the drive pulley correctly). Check to see that the belt is in the pulley at the engine and the trans axle. Like I said I did this once. Took over 30 min to notice were I messed up.

BiC said:

I tried your suggestion. It is not a flat pulley like the "stationary flat idler" on the diagram. Also, placing the belt on the other side of the black pulley places the belt out of the belt guide (located on the right side of that pulley- looks like a "V" or "U". I ordered another belt (shorter one) which should arrive tomorrow. I'll post an update then. Thank you for your time.

Click to expand...

HONEST Bic .....we are just trying to help ...NOT hinder ..please keep us posted and let us know your outcome
it will help other members in the same situation... Boobala

BlazNT said:

Since I have done this once(put the belt on and did not put around the drive pulley correctly). Check to see that the belt is in the pulley at the engine and the trans axle. Like I said I did this once. Took over 30 min to notice were I messed up.

Click to expand...

Thank you for the reply. It is good to go. But, I sure wish that was the issue.

Boobala said:

HONEST Bic .....we are just trying to help ...NOT hinder ..please keep us posted and let us know your outcome
it will help other members in the same situation... Boobala

Click to expand...

Will do. Thank you.

BiC said:

Thank you for the reply. It is good to go. But, I sure wish that was the issue.

Click to expand...

I was too hoping for that.

Bic this is really buggin me... it's makin us guys here look like klutz's ..and that ain't so..
going back to the beginning... I'm thinking you said you were mowing tall grass.... then the problem...
if the belt wasn't slipping while you were cutting and it didn't break ... GEEZ I hate to say this... maybe something in your trans has failed... you did check the pulley on the "box" = (transaxle)..?? is there any belt adjuster that may have broken or come loose...only other thing I can think of is a wrong belt ... I know for a fact certain mowers are "fussy" and require OEM belts .. then... some aftermarket belts are not made to correct specs. and finally the possibility that your new belt was a mistaken number .. other than that ... I wouldn't go outside if it's lightning ...( LOL )

If you watch the video you'll notice that the transaxle slows down slips and the belt continues turning so I would not think that it's in the transaxle itself. As far as it's slowing down while he's mowing in wet and Tall Grass. bet it got water on the belt and made it slip.

I have also gotten the correct part number on the box and the incorrect part number on the Belt.

BlazNT said:

If you watch the video you'll notice that the transaxle slows down slips and the belt continues turning so I would not think that it's in the transaxle itself. As far as it's slowing down while he's mowing in wet and Tall Grass. bet it got water on the belt and made it slip.

Click to expand...

Technically, the tall grasses I was mowing were dead (winter) grasses/weeds. So, it was dry at the time. I'll admit though, my lawn tractor was not designed to cut grasses/weeds 3 ft high (you know... moving forward only half way, backing up, and then mowing over it again. Rinse and repeat.) I knew I was pushing its limits. If it isn't the belt, then I likely overworked the trans. I'll see tomorrow when I get a new, shorter belt.

Boobala said:

Bic this is really buggin me... it's makin us guys here look like klutz's ..and that ain't so..
going back to the beginning... I'm thinking you said you were mowing tall grass.... then the problem...
if the belt wasn't slipping while you were cutting and it didn't break ... GEEZ I hate to say this... maybe something in your trans has failed... you did check the pulley on the "box" = (transaxle)..?? is there any belt adjuster that may have broken or come loose...only other thing I can think of is a wrong belt ... I know for a fact certain mowers are "fussy" and require OEM belts .. then... some aftermarket belts are not made to correct specs. and finally the possibility that your new belt was a mistaken number .. other than that ... I wouldn't go outside if it's lightning ...( LOL )

Click to expand...

I did look/feel around the transaxle, but did not see anything unusual. But, I agree... perhaps it's the trans. I will certainly post an update after the new belt arrives and I get it installed. Maybe I'll video that too.

BiC said:

Is the routing diagram on my tractor (and in my owner's manual) wrong?

I am following the diagram from the front of the tractor (engine pulley) to the rear.

Click to expand...

The "top" pulley is the one on the tranny with the fan on it.
hold the shaft while trying to turn the pulley to check the spline on top of the box has not stripped.
They are designed to do this to protect the box.
As previously mentioned double check the belt is properly seated in the box pulley and also on the engine pulley.
Run your fingers around the pulley to make sure the belt is properly seated in the pulley as it can pop off and sit on top of the pulley however when that happens the belt usually runs quite slow.

The pulleys do look wrong, idlers come as flat & V profiles, the back of the belt runs on flat idlers & the V runs in V idlers which is not happening in the video.
Numbering them 1,2,3 from the new pulley as No 1
The belt would normally go V side around No 1 pulley then flat side around No 2 pulley then around the engine pulley then back down to the No 3 pulley but running on the other side of the pulley.
The belt keepers are free to move around the pulley once the nut is loosened.
Routed that way the existing belt would pull tighter.
Have a close look under the mower for wear marks in the paint.
If there is a polished section where the belt has been running and now the belt clears that place then the routing s wron.
I find it a lot easier to put some glad wrap over the fuel filler then screw the cap back on to stop fuel draining out of the tank vent, remove the battery then stand the mower vertical so I can work in a comfortable position and see clearly what I am doing without eating dried grass

bertsmobile1 said:

The pulleys do look wrong, idlers come as flat & V profiles, the back of the belt runs on flat idlers & the V runs in V idlers which is not happening in the video.

Click to expand...

I've tripled checked (x2+) the routing according to the routing diagram in both the manual and the sticker diagram on the tractor. It is routed correctly according to the diagram. The only pulley I have replaced since owning the tractor (brand new) has been that new, black V-idler. The pulley closest to that black one is also a V-idler. The other one nearly out of view in the video (closest to the engine pulley) is a flat pulley- the only flat pulley out of the three.

BTW, my new belt (shorter one) that should have arrived today has been delayed en route. Hopefully it will be here by Saturday, at which time I will let everyone know if that was the issue.

Thank you everyone for your time.

Well either the diagram is wrong or you are reading it wrong because you never run the V on a flat pulley because it promoted the belt twisting hen turning upside down and that is the ned of you belt.
To me it seems like you have the belt run mirror image reversed.
Being a touch on the dyslexic side I can pick that problem having done the same thing several times myself.
Some times the stickers that are supposed to go on the deck so you are looking at the run from an above plan view get put underneath the mower floor thus you think it is a view from underneath whereas it is a view from to top so they get mirror reversed.
In the manual & on parts books the belt run is always shown from ABOVE.

As mentioned , get it up in the air and check for belt scuffing on other parts.

bertsmobile1 said:

Well either the diagram is wrong or you are reading it wrong because you never run the V on a flat pulley because it promoted the belt twisting hen turning upside down and that is the ned of you belt.

Click to expand...

But, I'm not running the V side of the belt on the flat pulley. The two pulleys which you can clearly and wholly see in the video are both V with the V side of the belt running on them. The lighting makes that middle pulley look like a flat pulley, but I assure you it is a v pulley. You can only see about 1/4 of the flat pulley in the video- at the top of the video.

The belt configuration is correct on the pulleys. The pulley to the front of the mower is a flat idler, the next one back is a V idler, and the most rear pulley on the right in the video is a V idler. Either the belt isn't installed on the engine pulley or transmission pulley, or the belt is too long. Wouldn't be the first parts diagram I have seen that had incorrect part numbers.

ILENGINE said:

The belt configuration is correct on the pulleys. The pulley to the front of the mower is a flat idler, the next one back is a V idler, and the most rear pulley on the right in the video is a V idler. Either the belt isn't installed on the engine pulley or transmission pulley, or the belt is too long. Wouldn't be the first parts diagram I have seen that had incorrect part numbers.

Click to expand...

Amen.

It's definitely too long. Hopefully the new one I have on the way is the fix to the issue.

BIC

I agree that your belt is on correctly since all the belt retainers meet the pulleys where they'd belong if routed correctly. However, it appears to me that the belt is too deep in each pulley which may mean the belt angles are too acute allowing the belt to sit down into the groove too deeply which would allow slack in your application.

Thus, you could have two things going on as far as the belt. Too long, too narrow.

I have been wrong before.

Good luck with the new belt.

Max

The new, shorter (3/4" shorter) belt is on, and things seem to be working as they should. I will know in due time if the belt holds up.

Here is the newest belt I ordered:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004TARR9Y/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o00_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Attached is a photo of the belt (packaging) I received:



Here is a video of the new belt in action:

https://youtu.be/E_UCNDy_Xso

Again, thank you all for the support. I've learned a couple of things. One is not to doubt my ability to correctly read a belt routing schematic (pictured in the video to the right as I am driving up and down the ramps). :wink:

I'll Likely see you around the forums. God Bless, and have a very blessed Easter!

~Rod

+BiC><> (Brother in Christ)

Nice to see it working.

Glad it seems to be workin... I wish he had purchased an OEM belt right from the beginning, MIGHT have
avoided the issue in the first place .. OHhh welll....

Boobala said:

Glad it seems to be workin... I wish he had purchased an OEM belt right from the beginning, MIGHT have
avoided the issue in the first place .. OHhh welll....

Click to expand...

As a matter of fact I did purchase an OEM belt. But, as you saw, it did not avoid the issue. Here's the belt I ordered, part# 140218, which should have worked, but it was too long:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004QJ30XU/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o08_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1

OEM isn't all that it's cracked up to be. That's for sure.

BIC,

Glad you're up and running! Now run it like you stole it and if you break it, fix it.

Max

mhavanti said:

BIC,

Glad you're up and running! Now run it like you stole it and if you break it, fix it.

Max

Click to expand...

Haha! Thanks! I just finished mowing for two hours. No issues so far.:thumbsup:

oem is superior and........if you reach your hand up following the brake lever under the frame to the cross member below the brake rod you may find a tightly packed pile of grass a couple inches thick or possibly a stick that is preventing the full and complete release of the brake and thus the lack of trans belt tension. seen that happen a lot.