Great ethanol warning

[Smithsonite]

Fun, fun! I have more, but this site doesn't allow anything more than flip phone pics ...

 

[smhardesty]

Be very careful using Methanol in modern engines. It attacks certain types of Plastics and seized a fuel shut off valve on my Yamaha 80. Fortunately I can buy Ethanol free Premium Shell locally for my XLR. I simply drain and run dry seasonal equipment. Done.

Hmmm. I had no idea it would do that. Guess I should just stick with using ethanol free gas and my old faithful Seafoam. Thanks for that tidbit.
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[Smithsonite]

Oh yeah, methanol is a big no no, unless the fuel system is specifically designed for it. BIG damage ...

 

[smhardesty]

If you keep a barrel air tight, you can keep even E10 usable for a year or more. I wouldn't use 87 octane in something you cared about after that length of time, but it's possible. I've done it. E0 I'd wager would last 3 or more years in the same conditions. It's cold quite a bit up here in MA, so that may have something to do with it, but we've got some pretty crappy pump gas here.

I've got an '07 Silverado 1500 4x4 - has the LMG 5.3 flex-fuel engine. Whenever I fill up with E0, I get a noticeable power increase, and my mileage goes WAY up. Last run I made up to ME with my flatbed trailer to grab a car, I got 13.5 MPG coming home loaded after filling up with E0, and that was doing 75-80 the whole way back. I normally get 13.5 just driving around town here! HUGE increase in efficiency.

I always let my friends and neighbors know when I'm heading up north - I'll bring their gas cans up to grab E0. Stuff is like gold around here.

Interesting to see that you get better fuel economy. In my Internet research, I have found websites that state that you will always get better mileage with non-ethanol gas and then there are websites that swear you'll get better mileage with an ethanol blend. That's one reason I keep good records of my fill ups and mileage. I want to know where to buy my gas in order to get the best mileage. It was about 2 years ago that I found, by accident, that I got about 1.5 mpg better mileage buying gas out our local Marathon station as compared to buying gas at the local Casey's. I have no real idea why this is, but I do know that gas at Marathon stations includes STP added to the fuel.

One side note on that subject. I am located 35 miles form a Marathon refinery. I was born and raised less than 6 miles from that refinery. Fuel delivery trucks with every imaginable name painted on the sides of the trucks filled up there. We'd see all those different trucks filling up and wonder what the deal was. A lot of my family worked there and they explained the whole thing. When gasoline is produced at a refinery, it's all pretty much the same gas as what is produced at a different refinery. What makes the fuel different is the additives that the gas gets, not the actual gas. So, if a vehicle you drive gets better mileage, or has more power when you buy from one station versus another, it's the additive package that makes the difference. What really causes a lot of arguments is that my car might get better mileage running the gas bought at a Marathon station and your car might get better mileage using gas bought at Casey's. It is entirely possible for that to happen and has caused more than a few arguments between guys.

Just my two cents worth.
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[Smithsonite]

Yep, right on the money.

Usually the differences in mileage between E10 gas at different stations is differing alcohol content, I've found. The sticker on the pump says "Up to" 10% ethanol. My local Cumberland Farms I've tested at 7% ethanol. In the city it's always closer to 10%, and your mileage will reflect that. More ethanol in the gasoline equals more profit for the station. Just like drug dealers cutting cocaine with baking soda. Selling less for the same price.

 

[smhardesty]

Ethanol has about 10% less energy, so theoretically you'd get about 10% more in MPG if running pure gas...but if you get 15mpg...would you really notice if you got 16mpg? you'd have to be very specific in your testing to be sure that you are actually getting 10% better mpg

I agree 100%. That's why I'm not making any claims about power or mileage at this point. I'm only on the second tank of pure gas and that is nowhere near enough to make a real claim. I won't be sure of anything until I have used pure unleaded for several tankfuls and for different kinds of driving. These first two tankfuls have included a lot of highway driving and that isn't what the car does most of now. Since the wife retired, the car is used mostly around town, making very shorts trips. We have actually gone shopping and never got the engine warm. That is what I'm really looking forward to seeing the results of.
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[billypumper]

Ethanol has less energy than petrol so if you are running it in an engine that is jetted to lean burn strait fuel then it will be running very lean ( hole in piston type lean ) however that is not a problem for engines designed to burn it
Ethanol burns slower than petrol so the timing needs to be advanced just a smidge on engines not designed to burn it .
Ethanol will adsorb moisture which is good & bad.
The good bit is it will scavenge water that has accumulated in fuel tank & run it through the engine ( where it increases power ) .
The bad bit is when it is water saturated any more water will cause it to drop out ( phase separation )
The water ethanol mix is acidic and will cause galvanic corrosion to zinc plated parts and to a far lesser extent to cast zinc like carbs
The ethanol / water mix will support the growth of bacteria , just the same as the bacteria that can grow in diesel tanks left standing for a long time .

And remember it is only 5% to 15 % so it is not very much ethanol in fuel .
Brazil runs e85 and has been doing so for decades
South Africa ran e95 during the BS embargo in engines designed to run strait petrol without the entire country coming to a grinding hault although they did ban the use of all 2 stroke engines at the time .
While ethanol is touted as a enviromental pollution solution in reality it is a political & financial idea done in order to reduce the amount of imported oil .
Like all of the solutions looking for problem ( seafoam , etc ) weather e?? will cause you grief is very much dependent upon a host of factors that will be unique to your location & engine use .
Naturally the oil industry does everything in its power to accentuate the minor problems that can occur with e?? use and the corn lobby does everything they can to push the benefits of using e??
Some where in the middle is the truth
Bioactive sludge in the bottom of your carb is

Things customers do:
Dump the fuel out if a 2 stroke but not start it and really run the fuel out.
Dump stabilizer in the gas tank and not run engine to get stabilized fuel uo to the carb.
Store equipment half full if gas.
Use premium for off season storage.
Mix motor oil with the fuel to stop rust.
Remove spark plug for safe storage. (Probably some internet BS).
Never ever drain all the fuel from a generator or tiller.
Dump fresh fuel on top of fuel years old fuel and the carb is trashed and tell you it ran last week.
Bring in a piece of equipment saying they think it needs a spark plug and you notice the float bowl is rusted off.

very much as problematic as varnish from strait fuel and a lot easier to clean out .

 

[ILENGINE]

I read somewhere that there are MANY added things to the various blends of mixed gas...
The researcher found that for lowest octane rating E10 the mfg added different additives (solvents and stuff) than from Premium E10....E10 Premium behaved better and had less corrosive additives

I'm confused as to why THEY didn't go with Butanol which has more power and none of the problems of Ethanol. Butanol can be made from grasses which grows MUCH faster than corn, can be made from grass clippings (think golf courses, or residential lawn clippings).

Maddening

The entire ethanol thing started as a substity for the farmers due to low corn prices

Ethanol causes problems in Carburetor Engines. In Fuel Injection Engines there is no place for gas to pool and cause problems. Otherwise we'd have stalled cars all over the roads.

Most EFI systems have a excess fuel return to tank so the fuel gets circulated and mixed.

 

[smhardesty]

I wouldn't use 87 octane in something you cared about after that length of time, but it's possible.

I'm wondering why you say not to use 87 octane. Are you referring to ethanol blended gas, or are you saying only to use higher octane fuel. High octane fuel is used in ICEs that have high compression ratios. Running 91 or higher octane gasoline in a regular car, truck, or piece of OPE doesn't do anything. The use of high octane gasoline is recommended only in cars with turbochargers or that have high compression engines in them. It really only serves to decrease or eliminate knock in engines that really require high octane.
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[smhardesty]

Keep in mind, here in MA, anything listed on that site is an OPE dealer, powersports dealer, airport, hardware store, or canned fuel sold in the gas station store. Not a drop of E0 is available at ANY pump here in MA. It's all by the can - quarts, gallons, or 5 gallon jugs at $25+ per gallon.

The state is petrified of losing fuel tax revenue, so it's forbidden.

Man, that is just nuts! $25/gallon for ethanol free gas is more than highway robbery. And here I complain about it costing me 50 cents more a gallon compared to E10 or E15 gas.
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