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I have a 42" cut/ 14.5 HP 917.270532 riding mower.

When I park it the battery will be fully charged, but two weeks later the battery will be dead. I changed the battery and the amp meter shows it is charging when the mower is running.

This only happens when the seat is down.

My hunch is the following... The grill is missing and the wire to the front lights is not connected to anything. See photo (you'll see the loose wire in the bottom left).

Do you think that is the cause? If so, can I plug that wire? I don't plan on spending the money to buy a grill with lights (never cut at night).

Do you think it is the seat switch?

Any other suggestions?

Alex

Really doubt that the light plug is your problem. More than likely it is the seat switch. I would start by tracing the wires from the seat back to the key switch with your eyes and fingers. Try these tricks first to see if you can isolate the problem, but it may take time. You could disconnect the seat switch and then see if the problem is still there after a week. If it is then it is not the seat switch, but something else in the line. Do you leave the parking brake and/or the tranny in gear when you shut off the unit. The reason I ask, is that they are also wired in the same circuit as the seat switch and there could be a bad wire there also. It could also be the key switch that is not completely shutting down all circuits and allowing a battery drain. Do you have or can you get a VOM METER or a test light? Both would make it much easier to troubleshoot this problem.

OK, I'll try these things in this order.

1) Disconnect seat switch and wait a week to see what happens.

2) Keep in gear and wait a week to see what happens. Then take out of gear and let sit to see what happens.

3) Put in park and wait a week to see what happens. Then take out of park and let sit to see what happens.

I have a test light. What do you suggest I do with that?

Alex

What you want to do with the test lights, with the unit shut off, test all the connections to see if any are live, which would be causing the power drain.

I looked at all the wires I could see, and any exposed wire I taped. I don't think that was the problem, but I want to rule that out.

Please give me an example of what I would test? The key is off.

What we are looking for is any connection that could be draining the battery down. If you can get at the key switch that is where I would start. With the key off only one terminal should be hot, that is the B (battery) terminal. Any other terminal that lights up the test light indicates a problem. If you can't get at the key switch you can start by checking the the seat switch, clutch switch, and neutral safety switch. Are you sure you have a good battery, how old is it?

The battery is 2 months old. It holds a charge with the seat up.

Thank you,
Alex

When the seat is down, the seat safety switch will not activate unless someone is sitting on the seat. Even if it is activated, that would not be the cause of battery drain, as when the ignition switch is off, all circuits are dead.

Therefore, I would say, something on the bottom of the seat is shorting out the battery terminals. Do you have the red rubber terminal cover on the battery cable?

Make sure the metal bottom of the seat is not contacting the terminal. You may also have a worn spot on the cable that is contacting either the bottom of the seat, or another metallic part of the mower when it is pushed by the pressure of the seat. In which case, replace the cable or tape any worn areas.

ok guys, here goes again and I know it can put off some people...Use your VOM (digital volt meter) to first see if there is battery drain. The drain is "current" flowing thru the circuit when it should not. We know just a little drain over 24 hrs or several days will deplete the battery. Even the cheapest VOM has a "current" hookup, but is slightly different from the voltage or continuity (beep) function-you can get the beep equivalent with a test ilght.

Get the little instruction pamphlet that came with your vom and read how to change the test leads over to "current." Unhook the ground lead from the battery and let it dangle. Take one test lead from the vom and attach it to ground terminal of the battery and the other test lead to the dangling bat cable clamp . With the ignition key OFF and the vom set to current read the vom. Unlike a car which keeps a small current going for the clocks etc, it would seem the tractor should read zero. If you get a reading try wiggling and moving the suspect wires around while reading the vom .

Disconnecting a connector will not cause current to flow as the wire is "open" (not connected to ground return). If the above setup causes your vom to stop working in current mode you may have a current drain in excess of the vom fuse (2-10 amps). The vom comes apart for a new fuse.

I got back to this problem again.

Just bought a new battery and the drain is still occurring. So it is not the battery.

From the battery there is power on the thick red wire (positive battery wire) going into the ignition block. There are three other connections on that ignition block and none of the others have any power with the key off.

I disconnected the seat switch and with the key off, that wire has no power.

The positive battery wire goes to the ignition block, and coming off that connection is one small red wire (which has power) and that goes to the ignition switch. With the key in the off position, I volt meter tested all the other wires coming out of the ignition switch. None had power except the red wire going in.

I am missing the front light. With the key off, there was no power on that wire.

I do have the red terminal cover on the battery cable at the ignition block, but not on the positive on the battery. When I park the mower, the seat is always up and the battery still drains.

At this point, my guess is the ignition switch is good, the positive wire from the battery to the ignition block must have a nick in it that I can't see.

I have the tractor in netural and I will see if that has anything to do with the drain.

What else do you suggest?

Alex

You need to do a battery draw test. disconnect one of the battery cables now take a test light and connect one end to the disconnected battery cable and the other to the empty battery post. Use a test light not a volt meter. If the test light lights it will mean you have a draw on your battery. Now you need to start looking what is causing this battery draw, switches, wiring, lights, stator, when the light go's out you have found your problem.

The thing hat usually draws down the battery is the alternator .
Find the plug that comes out of engine & dissconnect it between uses.
See what happens.
If your battery drain stops then the diode needs replacing

bertsmobile1 said:

The thing hat usually draws down the battery is the alternator .
Find the plug that comes out of engine & dissconnect it between uses.
See what happens.
If your battery drain stops then the diode needs replacing

Click to expand...

Test the diode, very testable, don't just start changing parts. A short in the alternator/stator will also draw your battery down. Sorry I like trouble shooting. It saves time and money.

Here is a basic wiring diagram for a small lawn tractor. Yes, I know it is probably not exactly like your's, but it will give you a good idea where each of the wires should go. I don't understand what an ignition block is, but I am assuming you are talking about the starter solenoid. Hope it is of some help.

My lawn tractor cranks but wont start. I dont believe the

delete.

I did the battery draw test and the light didn't come on, but I'm not sure if it would be drawing enough power to turn the light on. It is probably a very low draw.

I meant the starter solenoid, yes.

The diagram confirmed what I thought. The only wires getting power with the key off would be the positive battery to the solenoid, and the red wire going to the ignition switch, right?

If any other wires have power, that should be the problem. The ignition switch is fine because with the key off only the red line going in has power.

I'm thinking of just replacing the positive battery wire and see if that will solve the problem. Next would be the solenoid thinking that is drawing power in some way.

Thank you for you help. I'll see what happens this week.

pickenspolitics said:

I did the battery draw test and the light didn't come on, but I'm not sure if it would be drawing enough power to turn the light on. It is probably a very low draw.

I meant the starter solenoid, yes.

The diagram confirmed what I thought. The only wires getting power with the key off would be the positive battery to the solenoid, and the red wire going to the ignition switch, right?

If any other wires have power, that should be the problem. The ignition switch is fine because with the key off only the red line going in has power.

I'm thinking of just replacing the positive battery wire and see if that will solve the problem. Next would be the solenoid thinking that is drawing power in some way.

Thank you for you help. I'll see what happens this week.

Click to expand...

If the light doesn't light you have a draw in the battery its self. Something has to be drawing amperage to run the battery down. You might need to test how much amperage is coming from the battery. I have found a test light is all I needed for this draw test but it looks like you will need a amp meter which my multi function meter has. The starter solenoid is just a heavy duty switch it either on or off. Yes it could have a short in it. Very hard to trouble shoot without hands on so all I can do is guess. So I would say just start install parts that aren't needed till you find the problem and hope for the best or get some help.

As noted the real value of a DVM in this problem is that is gives amount of current being drained. A light will not light if insufficient current is flowing, but a DVM is very sensitive and will show "thousandths" of an amp flowing which can drain a battery over time. Also please note another built in feature of most DVMs is a continuity (diode) test which many times includes a "beep" indicating yes , this thing passes current. For newbies a good diode is made to pass current in only one direction so the DVM can check this. DVMs do not need to cost e.g., $100. They are half that or less.

motoman said:

As noted the real value of a DVM in this problem is that is gives amount of current being drained. A light will not light if insufficient current is flowing, but a DVM is very sensitive and will show "thousandths" of an amp flowing which can drain a battery over time. Also please note another built in feature of most DVMs is a continuity (diode) test which many times includes a "beep" indicating yes , this thing passes current. For newbies a good diode is made to pass current in only one direction so the DVM can check this. DVMs do not need to cost e.g., $100. They are half that or less.

Click to expand...

Yes over time, is this what he is looking for?? A good battery we are talking months. This is the reason its hard to trouble shoot electric over a form we are just making a lot of guesses. If he doesn't want to spend a lot of money for a DMV he can buy a analog multi volt meter from HF for around 10 dollars.

Here's your Owners Guide , the Electric Diagram is at the very end ........ might help in tracing your wiring, I had a similar problem , Positive Battery cable was worn through at a spot where it passed through a hole in my frame , hard to find on a regular machine but I found mine when I was disassembling for entire rebuild .... DECK was removed ! Good Luck, and patience will prevail .
Electrical troubleshooting is a step by step process , DON'T replace parts by guess...... KNOW what you're replacing is N.F.G. . ............ Boobala ....:smile

View attachment L0070108.pdf

I put my volt meter on ohms or connectivity. I put one probe on the negative of the battery and another on the positive of the starter and it beeped. That means it is ground to ground, right? Should it be that way?

Alex

pickenspolitics said:

I put my volt meter on ohms or connectivity. I put one probe on the negative of the battery and another on the positive of the starter and it beeped. That means it is ground to ground, right? Should it be that way?

Alex

Click to expand...

So all that proves you have continuity. That test is through the test meter its self with it own battery. I can't see where it would be telling you where the battery draw is coming from?

pickenspolitics said:

I put my volt meter on ohms or connectivity. I put one probe on the negative of the battery and another on the positive of the starter and it beeped. That means it is ground to ground, right? Should it be that way?

Alex

Click to expand...

yes it should .
Stop and think about it.
You put power to that post and the starter motor turns so there must be a connection from the + post through to the - battery or the starter will not work.
With these really frustrating problems there is a tendency to go rushing from one bright idea to another,
The only way to do it is to isolate every thing, one item at a time till the culprit is found.
The other thing that is important is to write down each & every thing you have tested,

Apart from the battery itself.
The most common one is the alternator.
Less common are things like 4 pole safety switches leaking to earth
Followed by a chaffed wire
Followed by a faulty ignition switch

And on the subject of batteries it is not uncommon for a supplier to have a shelf full of bad batteries that they bough cheap from a van trader ( because he liberted then from a scrap pile ) so the owner goes back to the same merchant, buys another identical ( and faulty ) battery and assumes that they have a good one just because it is new,

Alex, Please do the following: Read the little instruction manual which you got with your DVM . If you do not have it , download or tell us. These little manuals have a brief instruction about how to set up for CURRENT. So far you have looked at VOLTAGE and CONDUCTIVITY. Do not let these words bother you. Just set up your little DVM for current. This usually involves moving the test cables on the DVM to differrent socket(s). Then set the read out selector to "current" in "milliamps." Then do like Reynoldson said earlier. After setting it up and placing the pointy tips on the neg bat terminal and loosened bat cable look at the readout. If the value is very low like below 25 milliamps (.025 amps) the guys are suggestig it is probably not the diodes/ alternator. If large like 2000 milliamps (2 amps) the battery would go down very fast. Let us know. Be sure to change the test cables back after the current test.

Although it may seem there is lots of wiring you can wiggle runs of wiring while watching the DVM. If it is chafed wiring you might find it in this manner. These beasts are vibration makers . Another reason to make sure wire bundles are tied up and located, not flapping around.

I'm a novice, so thank you for the education. I took off the key switch and I had continuity between the B prong and the S when it was turned all the way, the B prong and the Light when one one click. When in the off position, I had continuity between G and M. When in off. I had no continuity between B and any of the other prongs, so I think the key switch is good. The battery was tested and it was good.

Motoman, here is the test I did. I set it up on Current which is DC Current and plugged the red prong into 10A on the DMV and black into Com on the DVM. I set the meter to 10A in the DC Current scale on the DMV. I had the key off. I disconnected the positive on the battery and connected the red prong to the battery positive and the black to the battery cable. It had 0 in the DMV display. Just to make sure I was doing it right, I then turned the key to Alt 1 for the lights and the DMV displayed about .3 on the meter. By the way, I then turned the key to Alt 2 for the carb solenoid, and that also displayed about .3.

Next I'll wiggle some wires and see if I can get a reading with the key in the off position.

Alelx, Rynoldson has described what to do in post 11 above. Disconnect the grounding cable (negative side)from the battery. Now you have two points to touch with the DVM probes (pointy ends), the battery negative post and the (removed) battery cabel end. To free up you hands you can use clips to hold them on. Let us know

I did that with the DC Current set to 10A. I disconnected the negative battery cable, and put the red test probe to the negative battery terminal and the black test probe to the (now disconnected) negative battery cable.

With the key off, the DMV display was zero.
With the key in Alt 1 (light on), the display was 35
With the key in Alt 2 (carb solenoid), the display was 35 also.

There doesn't seem to be a draw with the key off. The battery checked as "good".

That's a great test. I'll just play around with a bunch of things with the key off, hoping to recreate the draw with one of them.

Alex, Good show except still no culprit. When you put the DVM on current and got .3 that seems like 3 amps on a 10 amp setting which may be light , but you said the connector was hanging loose??? Then the 35 reading sounds like 35 milliamps. Did you change the requested readout to milliamps for that reading? Anyway try milliamp setting with key off if you have not done so. Like Berts says , are you getting your replacement battery from the same source. Also refreshing on line the gurus state complete testing of a lead acid battery is impossible so .... Finally , I do not know how old your machine is but I have had gremlins in car switches with high mileage. The contact posts arc and burn over time. Please do not incur the cost of a new switch over this statement. With the DVM in place try just barely turning agains spring pressure (the start key). You seem to have patience. Electrical gremlins are difficult but rewarding when solved. Hang in.

The mower is 18 years old.

With the key off, I'm getting 0 amps on the draw down test.

I did replace the positive wire from the battery to the solenoid a few days ago. My guess is that was the problem or there is a wire that is causing the problem on an on-and-off basis. And right now it isn't drawing current.

I've got the mower sitting, and I'm waiting to see if the battery draws down over the next few days. The key is off, and the DMV reading was 0, so it should not draw down.

Now the battery is fully charged reading 12.73 volts. I'll keep checking the volts over the next few days.

Thank you. I may not have solved it for sure, but I have the knowledge to solve it now I think. Thanks. Well chat in a week or so.

I fixed it. In the end it was something very simple. The battery cable was bad. I replaced it and no more drain. I learned a lot and I appreciate you all.

Alex