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Are the Kohler engines that John Deere uses on their commercial grade mowers different or better than the Kohlers they use on their residential models? I have always heard to make sure to get the Kawasaki engine on any John Deere that I bought, but I've only ever looked at residential grade mowers up until now. If I looked into used commercial grade mowers for residential use, should a Kohler engine be a red flag like it would be on a residential model?

I like motorhead12's response on MLF. I would stay away from the residential Kohler's.

Never heard of a Kohler engine classified as a commercial or residential engine. Where did you get that from? Kohler had a problem with their Courage line, not all their engines as some here would want you to believe.

Rivets said:

Never heard of a Kohler engine classified as a commercial or residential engine. Where did you get that from? Kohler had a problem with their Courage line, not all their engines as some here would want you to believe.

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Well like how the Courage is kind of residential and the Command Pro is kind of commercial.

lawn mower fanatic said:

Well like how the Courage is kind of residential and the Command Pro is kind of commercial.

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WHAT?????? Stick to cutting the lawns and stop commenting on the equipment. Kind of like you know what you are talking about and kind of like you want people to think you know what you are talking about. Sounds to me like you are the second kind of. Those kind of posts do more harm than good, and are the reason many people come here looking for help and end up frustrated. If you ever worked on the engines and knew how they worked, not just read things on the internet, you would be able to kind of like be able to make honest posts that kind of like make sense. In 40+ years you'll kind of like know what I am talking about.

Rivets said:

WHAT?????? Stick to cutting the lawns and stop commenting on the equipment. Kind of like you know what you are talking about and kind of like you want people to think you know what you are talking about. Sounds to me like you are the second kind of. Those kind of posts do more harm than good, and are the reason many people come here looking for help and end up frustrated. If you ever worked on the engines and knew how they worked, not just read things on the internet, you would be able to kind of like be able to make honest posts that kind of like make sense. In 40+ years you'll kind of like know what I am talking about.

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I was just stating what a user on another forum said to prove why exactly the OP is saying residential and commercial. 38" Walk Behind Mower - John Deere - Page 2

Passing on that type of bad info is not going to help anyone. Make sure your info is good before passing it along. Your habit of posting links without checking accuracy does not help anyone. Stick to what you know and can backup through experience. Don't worry about reaching 5000 posts with meaningless information and cute pics/posts. You are not impressing the members who know what they are talking about.

Rivets, do you have advice/opinions on my original question: Is the line of Kohler engines that John Deere puts on their "commercial" mowers different/better than the line of Kohlers that JD puts on their 'residential' mowers?

In my opinion, which you will see is not worth much to many on this forum, if both units have the same engine series there is no difference. A Kohler Command is a Command engine, period. Now if you are asking if there is a difference between a Command, Courage, Magnum, Command Pro, Courage Pro, Aegis, Triad, K-series, yes there is a difference. Simple answer, you get what you pay for in the different series. It would take way to long to try to explain the differences. I would be more concerned who build the mower than who built the engine. John Deere is going the route of many of the equipment manufactures and having MTD build their low end mowers. Take a look at JD, CUB, TORO, they all look the same, except for the color of paint. Those of us who have been working on small engines for more than 20 years, would love to see the old John Deere, Toro/WheelHorse, Cub Cadet, Bolens units come back. They all built quality units, with transmissions, drives and engines that are 1000 times better than what they are putting out today. Don't know if this answers your question, but it's the best I can do without a longer disortation.

Rivets said:

In my opinion, which you will see is not worth much to many on this forum, if both units have the same engine series there is no difference. A Kohler Command is a Command engine, period. Now if you are asking if there is a difference between a Command, Courage, Magnum, Command Pro, Courage Pro, Aegis, Triad, K-series, yes there is a difference. Simple answer, you get what you pay for in the different series. It would take way to long to try to explain the differences. I would be more concerned who build the mower than who built the engine. John Deere is going the route of many of the equipment manufactures and having MTD build their low end mowers. Take a look at JD, CUB, TORO, they all look the same, except for the color of paint. Those of us who have been working on small engines for more than 20 years, would love to see the old John Deere, Toro/WheelHorse, Cub Cadet, Bolens units come back. They all built quality units, with transmissions, drives and engines that are 1000 times better than what they are putting out today. Don't know if this answers your question, but it's the best I can do without a longer disortation.

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It answers my question to a certain extent. I have an older JD Hydro 175 mower right now, and when I bought it I specifically searched out an older JD model for the reasons that you listed - I knew the older mowers were better than their newer ones, especially the junk Sabres sold at Home Depot at the time, and I'd heard that the Kohler engines had a lot of problems so I specifically wanted an older one with a Kawasaki engine and that's what I bought. I did not realize there are so many different Kohler engines being used, and it obviously stands to reason that quality will (or at least should) improve with price. Do you know which Kohlers John Deere uses on their residential/commercial walk behind mowers? Is there any easy way of figuring out which engine a particular JD mower has if I find one listed for sale?

Rivets said:

In my opinion, which you will see is not worth much to many on this forum, if both units have the same engine series there is no difference. A Kohler Command is a Command engine, period. Now if you are asking if there is a difference between a Command, Courage, Magnum, Command Pro, Courage Pro, Aegis, Triad, K-series, yes there is a difference. Simple answer, you get what you pay for in the different series. It would take way to long to try to explain the differences. I would be more concerned who build the mower than who built the engine. John Deere is going the route of many of the equipment manufactures and having MTD build their low end mowers. Take a look at JD, CUB, TORO, they all look the same, except for the color of paint. Those of us who have been working on small engines for more than 20 years, would love to see the old John Deere, Toro/WheelHorse, Cub Cadet, Bolens units come back. They all built quality units, with transmissions, drives and engines that are 1000 times better than what they are putting out today. Don't know if this answers your question, but it's the best I can do without a longer disortation.

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Rivets, you come out strong against the comments about differences among engine lineups, and then say "it would take a long way ...to explain the differences" Try us if you know the differences. For instance , I have asked members if the Briggs "Platinum" series is really improved or just "badge" engineering. Since no one responded it appears to be "distancing" from the Intek label. It does not take long to list improvements like hardened crank, revised air flow, oil feed to rocker, oil jets to piston bottom, etc. Please inform us. I would like to hear it. motoman

lawn mower fanatic said:

Well like how the Courage is kind of residential and the Command Pro is kind of commercial.

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Yes this is how many look at them

(( racing is the only sport that you need two balls ))

Rivets said:

WHAT?????? Stick to cutting the lawns and stop commenting on the equipment. Kind of like you know what you are talking about and kind of like you want people to think you know what you are talking about. Sounds to me like you are the second kind of. Those kind of posts do more harm than good, and are the reason many people come here looking for help and end up frustrated. If you ever worked on the engines and knew how they worked, not just read things on the internet, you would be able to kind of like be able to make honest posts that kind of like make sense. In 40+ years you'll kind of like know what I am talking about.

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Why you need to be a dick all the time
You act like you know it all but all you really know is what you can look up with a model number and then follow the steps. Anyone can do that.

I have yet to see you walk someone threw a repair when they have never worked on a mower.

The kid was just asking a question So he can learn more

(( racing is the only sport that you need two balls ))

Cars & Moto, I've been around too long into being suckered into painting myself into a corner, so the two of you can pick away at my posts. As you said, anyone can look up two different lines and compare the differences.

If you really want to see how well my posts on repair are received, you can view my activity, I have nothing to hide. Bet you'll find a few "thank you's" in there. I'll even bet that I can find a few where you agree with me.

Never saw a question ask, only a statement made, which I commented on. Do I know everything, NO, never said I did, even admit it when I'm proven wrong. I have even asked for help on this forum. As I posted awhile back, I respect members like Reynoldson, ILengine, Kenny V, EngineMan, Robert@Honda, etc. who post from experience and knowledge that goes back many years. Those I don't respect don't post from experience, but from what they think is right or worked one time on a specific engine. I have never asked anyone to like or respect me and will continue to call out anyone who gives one-sided or misinformation. As I say in my signature, it's only an opinion and many say it ain't worth a darn.

Dear Mr Rivets, Your posts are almost always helpful, but you seem to be defensive and think everyone is critical of you. I don't see that. I see a man very helpful with many thanking him. Your vast experience shows and is the equivalent of an academic degree. So lighten up and know you're among friends. Consider removing your mantra in bold caps at the bottom of your posts. When I ask you something it is not to trap you. Human nature IMO is that about 80% of us are takers, the rest givers. You are the latter. Most of the 80% won't even say thanks. Keep up the good work and stop saying "...but what do I know." You know a lot. regards, motoman

Motoman, What looks like defense to you is offense to me. Putting people on the defense makes them think about what I post and if they have any knowledge about the subject they understand what is being said. I will continue to call out those that post info that makes no sense or may cause harm in some way. Don't feel people are critical of me, because they have never walked in my shoes and don't know me. At my age and in my career I have been called a lot worse than what is posted here. If I really wanted to be a jerk, it would be so easy to answer a lot more posts than I do now, with many bad but truthful comments. I won't reveal that is said about many of the wannabes on this forum by those of us who post from experience, if I did you could then call me a dick. My matra won't change, because that is me, never said anyone had to agree with any or all of it. Just part of my "offensive" nature.

Rivets, I do not want to change or rearrange you. After several years on the forum I note a strong domination by professionals which is understandable, I guess. But it does intimidate newbies and does not provide an educational atmosphere for homeowners and potential diy'ers. I realize that trade secrets are important and are won the hard way, but there is some resistance in this forum to sharing and newbies are probably scared. The state of the US trades is a sad mess due to globalization and widespread default to immigrants who seem to have taken shops skills away from the little guy. IMO the low end tractors and lawnmowers are a perfect area for the tinkerer to expand skills beyond use of a dremel tool. Teachers are best when they tolerant and not dictators. Most here are very polite , but not patient. Perhaps the administrators should consider a newbie sub forum where anything goes. If I read you correctly there are backstage PMs and dialogue about postings. This is not good. It further dampens open discussion. Reminds me of conspiracy theory and snooping. A final thought. To understand is best, but the overwhelming tone here is "accept these machines as they are and don't try to understand, just fix 'em- over and over and over. motoman