Repairs broken frame issues on Scag rider

[Muddermucker]

Need to here from anyone who had issues with a broken frame rail on either side of seat. see attached photo

 

[bertsmobile1]

Need to here from anyone who had issues with a broken frame rail on either side of seat. see attached photo

That looks like a brittle failure starting from the welds.
It is exactly what happens when you electric weld very cold steel without any post weld heat treating.
Was discovered during WWII by your mates north of the border who sleep in igloos.

Using slightly under spec cheap Chinese steel does not help.

It is a manufacturing fault and should be repaired under warranty but as that looks like an old machine, don't hold your breath.
If you have to weld it yourself ( or get it welded yourself ) weld the crack all the way round then heat the entire weld about 0.5 to 1 " either side to dull red.
On the inside grind the welds flat then brace it with some heavy angle on the side & bottom.
Weld along the corner bend of the existing tube and not directly across.
It would be better if you could get some hollow section a close fit over the existing channel then cut the top off so it makes a U shape and weld along the top sides

 

[mhavanti]

To follow up on Bert's suggestions. This is how we build extended truck frames or repair broken truck and trailer frames. I made a fairly quick and not so pretty example drawing for you. However, this will stop your future breaks unless you're really good at breaking frames. lol

The two holes shown are for making welds closer to the welded break seems. It will help solidify the frame and diamond support plate.

Good luck,

Max

 

[bertsmobile1]

Not quite what I had in mind but you can probably weld a lot better than me.
Difference between those who know why & those who do.

 

[mhavanti]

Bert,

Your way is absolutely fine and will work as long as there are long enough pieces of angle laid inside and holes drilled or blown that are close to the crack and the entirety is welded around the outside of the angle, the holes are welded and the original crack is repaired first. Otherwise, there is still a weakness both vertically and horizontally if the holes are not put into place to keep the original frame and the angle from trying to separate during operations.

Having welds X-Rayed due to building Department of Transportation Over the Road Heavy Load Rigs with modified frames, NHRA & IHRA sanctioned drag racing vehicles, IMSA & NASCAR circle track race cars will make you weld the way they want it regardless of how we want to weld. lol.

Didn't mean to imply my example is any better.

Always a pleasure to hear and see your comments, Sir.

Max

 

[bertsmobile1]

Bert,

Your way is absolutely fine and will work as long as there are long enough pieces of angle laid inside and holes drilled or blown that are close to the crack and the entirety is welded around the outside of the angle, the holes are welded and the original crack is repaired first. Otherwise, there is still a weakness both vertically and horizontally if the holes are not put into place to keep the original frame and the angle from trying to separate during operations.

Having welds X-Rayed due to building Department of Transportation Over the Road Heavy Load Rigs with modified frames, NHRA & IHRA sanctioned drag racing vehicles, IMSA & NASCAR circle track race cars will make you weld the way they want it regardless of how we want to weld. lol.

Didn't mean to imply my example is any better.

Always a pleasure to hear and see your comments, Sir.

Max

No problems Max,
I was one of those men with the ultrasound & X-ray machine giving you a hard time, even though they could not do 1/2 the welds themselves.
Always favoured full length welds along the edges so you have a lot of cross section taking tensile loads remembering ( what most don't realise ) that a weld is a casting thus has a much lower tensile strength than the parent steel section.
And being my welding is not all that good, a much longer stitch plate than is necessary which tends me towards recommending the proverbal sledge to crack a walnut as most handyman welding is not particularly good cause they don't do enough to acquire the skills and modern machines can produce excellent looking welds that are not much stronger than soldering.
You know how it goes.
If you can't make the quality compensate with quantity.

 

[mhavanti]

Bert,

Amen brother.

It is another eye opener once your welds begin going through stretch tests, then another x-ray, then a second stress and stretch test and you see where the metals begin suffering disconnects. You continue to strive to bring in differing materials to encompass better structural stability so that failure on the connections are much less often. There is no such thing as perfect, however us old OCD (cubed) machinists are always striving for it.