Is the Kohler Courage really that bad?

[Scrubcadet10]

?

Sir, would you like to supersize that?

 

[Rivets]

I guess we agree on one thing, you are qualified to have your opinion. That opinion is based on two Courage engines and what you read on the internet. My limited qualifications are working on small engines for over 50 years and working in the industry for over 40 years. At one time I held manufacturer certifications from Briggs, Tecumseh, Kohler, Wisconsin and Onan. Taught small engine repair at both the high school and tech school level for 25+ years. While teaching and in retirement I’ve worked for dealerships to keep up with the changes in the industry. Have I worked on Courage engines, YES. Have I seen Courage engine failures, YES. Have I worked with Kohler and customers to resolve problems, YES. Does this make me, with my limited experience, qualified to disagree with your opinion and agree with those of other service technicians on this form. MAYBE, depending on who you listen to. Sorry, I could have just said my user namer is Rivets and that makes me qualified to list my opinions, but that would have made me look incompetent in giving my opinion. Now that you’ve seen this on the Internet it must be true. Pass the popcorn, with a cold one. Haven’t had this much fun since trying to measure internal battery resistance.

 

[Hammermechanicman]

Sir, would you like to supersize that?

Oh yeah. And a six pack.

 

[ChrisBFRPKY]

my name's Travis I'm also qualified to give an opinion as i also have a kohler courage 19, I've had the great running kohler courage experience 280 odd hours and fires up with the touch of the key, my valve cover does not leak, my starter has not gone bad (original) my camshaft hasn't gone out, my balancer hasn't kapooted, my top cover bolts haven't loosened up nor has the block cracked due to the bolts coming loose, and from the 1 kohler Courage i've opened up, the block seems to be as thick as an Briggs Opposed twin i opened up just a few months ago. i know one other guy on here who has 800 hours on his. only problem i have had was the carb needle failing, (walbro's issue not kohler's).

I think it depends on which batch you get. Kohler had issues during the R&D of their early balance system. This issue was definitely seen in the 2010 and some 2011 Courage engines as per Kohler. There was an investigation and it was determined there were different reasons for the failures. Some blocks being cast too thin to support the harmonics caused by the balance weights was one issue as in my engine's situation. Low oil of course could cause the balance weights to fail but that's a end user issue and no fault of the engine. After all, even if the engine had loose cover bolts and leaked oil the end user should still be checking that oil level before starting. The engine design still continues, according to their website the "Courage" has been discontinued yet in truth it's only the name "Courage" they retired due to the bad rep the engines have.

There is no shame in having issues with a new design. All of the engine makers mess up from time to time. Heck I'll bet the guy who created the first Briggs Intek head gasket design still has bad dreams about it. My gripe is merely that if they knew what batch had the earlier design that failed they could have recalled them, installed a new balance system and Robert's your uncle. But it wasn't limited to just the balance system....and there's the real reason they left them in service to fail.

 

[ChrisBFRPKY]

I guess we agree on one thing, you are qualified to have your opinion. That opinion is based on two Courage engines and what you read on the internet. My limited qualifications are working on small engines for over 50 years and working in the industry for over 40 years. At one time I held manufacturer certifications from Briggs, Tecumseh, Kohler, Wisconsin and Onan. Taught small engine repair at both the high school and tech school level for 25+ years. While teaching and in retirement I’ve worked for dealerships to keep up with the changes in the industry. Have I worked on Courage engines, YES. Have I seen Courage engine failures, YES. Have I worked with Kohler and customers to resolve problems, YES. Does this make me, with my limited experience, qualified to disagree with your opinion and agree with those of other service technicians on this form. MAYBE, depending on who you listen to. Sorry, I could have just said my user namer is Rivets and that makes me qualified to list my opinions, but that would have made me look incompetent in giving my opinion. Now that you’ve seen this on the Internet it must be true. Pass the popcorn, with a cold one. Haven’t had this much fun since trying to measure internal battery resistance.

I don't understand something. Are you disputing my claim that there was an issue with the previous design of the Courage engine balance system and block? Do you dispute my claim that cub cadets are available in every US city on craigslist with blown Courage engines? It's really great you have all the experience you volunteered and that leads to an important question. In your professional opinion was there a problem with the Kohler Courage engines mfg'd in 2010 and 2011? If you think there were no problems with the design, by all means just say so. It's just a conversation not a court case.

 

[ChrisBFRPKY]

Apparently you haven't seen the Briggs 09P series. Their crankcase are very thin too. I got a few in the recycle bin due to holes in the sides.

As for the Kohler Courage it appears to be replaced by another bucket engine design, The 5400 series.

The Briggs likely didn't fail for the same reason the Kohler did. The Kohler Courage had some thin castings that failed because they could not stand the harmonics of the balancer. I know they've all made some errors and nobody is exempt.

It's the same engine, they just changed the name.

 

[Rivets]

Mr. Trump, Oh sorry Chris, I asked you three questions and instead of answering them you keep reverting to your opinions and not scientific evidence or facts. I answered your question on how I get my qualified opinion, would you please factually answer the questions I posed to you, if you can. It might help to reread the posts by other service techs to your first rant and you will find what I think of the Courage engine, by those I like.

 

[slomo]

This is better than the old Dexcool coolant debates.

slomo

 

[slomo]

What do you guys think about Slick 50? Best oil on the market. Extra 40hp with zero friction. Now my engines won't shut off they are so slick. Don't even have to gas them up.

slomo

 

[Scrubcadet10]

I think it depends on which batch you get. Kohler had issues during the R&D of their early balance system. This issue was definitely seen in the 2010 and some 2011 Courage engines as per Kohler. There was an investigation and it was determined there were different reasons for the failures. Some blocks being cast too thin to support the harmonics caused by the balance weights was one issue as in my engine's situation. Low oil of course could cause the balance weights to fail but that's a end user issue and no fault of the engine. After all, even if the engine had loose cover bolts and leaked oil the end user should still be checking that oil level before starting. The engine design still continues, according to their website the "Courage" has been discontinued yet in truth it's only the name "Courage" they retired due to the bad rep the engines have.

There is no shame in having issues with a new design. All of the engine makers mess up from time to time. Heck I'll bet the guy who created the first Briggs Intek head gasket design still has bad dreams about it. My gripe is merely that if they knew what batch had the earlier design that failed they could have recalled them, installed a new balance system and Robert's your uncle. But it wasn't limited to just the balance system....and there's the real reason they left them in service to fail.

My Cub Cadet is 2010 year model,