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zero turn for sloping land
#1
T
tuckler
T
tuckler
I've been told that a zero turn with steering wheel is the best mower for sloping land. A neighbors lawn service owner has commercial grade cub cadets, but says that if Toro made a commercial zero turn with wheel, he would buy it in a heart beat. His cubs are in the shop quite often. I have a 15 year old cub lawn tractor, 42" that has served me well, but is not enough for my 6 acres of mowing, much of it on a gentle slope. S o the question is: would the Toro homeowner grade work well for me or would I be better off with a commercial cub. I can't see beating my machine up like a business owner would.
#2
Ric
For 6 acres I think I'd go to the low end commercial mower. Do you know what the degree the slopes are ?
Ric
I've been told that a zero turn with steering wheel is the best mower for sloping land. A neighbors lawn service owner has commercial grade cub cadets, but says that if Toro made a commercial zero turn with wheel, he would buy it in a heart beat. His cubs are in the shop quite often. I have a 15 year old cub lawn tractor, 42" that has served me well, but is not enough for my 6 acres of mowing, much of it on a gentle slope. S o the question is: would the Toro homeowner grade work well for me or would I be better off with a commercial cub. I can't see beating my machine up like a business owner would.
For 6 acres I think I'd go to the low end commercial mower. Do you know what the degree the slopes are ?
#3
S
Shughes717
How gentle a slope are you talking about? Commercial ztr mowers can handle 15% slopes according to manufacturers.
S
Shughes717
I've been told that a zero turn with steering wheel is the best mower for sloping land. A neighbors lawn service owner has commercial grade cub cadets, but says that if Toro made a commercial zero turn with wheel, he would buy it in a heart beat. His cubs are in the shop quite often. I have a 15 year old cub lawn tractor, 42" that has served me well, but is not enough for my 6 acres of mowing, much of it on a gentle slope. S o the question is: would the Toro homeowner grade work well for me or would I be better off with a commercial cub. I can't see beating my machine up like a business owner would.
How gentle a slope are you talking about? Commercial ztr mowers can handle 15% slopes according to manufacturers.
#5
Ric
You can use any ZTR on a slope it doesn't necessarily need to be one with a steering wheel. Most manufacturers recommend no more than 15 degrees and they can handle that plus a little. If you decide to buy he ztr I'd use it a while on the flats before attempting grades or slope and I also recommend reading the manual front to back as they say to get familiar with the machine.
Ric
I've been told that a zero turn with steering wheel is the best mower for sloping land. A neighbors lawn service owner has commercial grade cub cadets, but says that if Toro made a commercial zero turn with wheel, he would buy it in a heart beat. His cubs are in the shop quite often. I have a 15 year old cub lawn tractor, 42" that has served me well, but is not enough for my 6 acres of mowing, much of it on a gentle slope. S o the question is: would the Toro homeowner grade work well for me or would I be better off with a commercial cub. I can't see beating my machine up like a business owner would.
You can use any ZTR on a slope it doesn't necessarily need to be one with a steering wheel. Most manufacturers recommend no more than 15 degrees and they can handle that plus a little. If you decide to buy he ztr I'd use it a while on the flats before attempting grades or slope and I also recommend reading the manual front to back as they say to get familiar with the machine.
#6
Carscw
Carscw
The steering wheel does a little better on hills/ slopes.
The reason is the front wheels turn when you turn the wheel.
With lap bars the front wheels are coasters.
If you are trying to spend a lot of money I would get the toro ss5000
It is a good residential mower. But really not made for 6 acres. You really need to be looking at a low to mid level commercial mower.
The reason is the front wheels turn when you turn the wheel.
With lap bars the front wheels are coasters.
If you are trying to spend a lot of money I would get the toro ss5000
It is a good residential mower. But really not made for 6 acres. You really need to be looking at a low to mid level commercial mower.
#7
T
tuckler
T
tuckler
Most of the slope I would be mowing is about 10%, close to 2 acres worth. I've got a 34H Kabota with a 72" deck that I'm using on some pasture areas and the yard, but on the yard it is slow and beats up the ground too much and that needs to stop. Would the homeowner Toro 60" hold up on those six acres like the commercial cub? I really think the wheel would do best on slopes and since Toro does not have the commercial grade, I'm just concerned that it wouldn't hold up. I actually did those acres with the 42" cub garden tractor for two years before I got the Kabota and it held up well, but was quite a physical workout. I'm assuming the zero turns would have a lot more speed for cutting over the Kabota.
#8
T
tuckler
Then since the Toro does not have the wheel in a commercial I would have to go with the cub?
T
tuckler
The steering wheel does a little better on hills/ slopes.
The reason is the front wheels turn when you turn the wheel.
With lap bars the front wheels are coasters.
If you are trying to spend a lot of money I would get the toro ss5000
It is a good residential mower. But really not made for 6 acres. You really need to be looking at a low to mid level commercial mower.
Then since the Toro does not have the wheel in a commercial I would have to go with the cub?
#9
Carscw
With the slope you have I would not get the steering wheel. But a do like cub cadet.
I feel the toro would hold up better for you.
The steering wheel has its good and bad.
The big bad is the front wheels. When you are going fast and hit a hole the linkage bends.
Carscw
Then since the Toro does not have the wheel in a commercial I would have to go with the cub?
With the slope you have I would not get the steering wheel. But a do like cub cadet.
I feel the toro would hold up better for you.
The steering wheel has its good and bad.
The big bad is the front wheels. When you are going fast and hit a hole the linkage bends.
#10
W
whelch1
W
whelch1
I would see if a dealer would let you demo a zero turn with lap bars. I have taken mine on some pretty good slopes without any problems. Look for one with a low center of gravity and a wider wheelbase. My father in law has a cub with a steering wheel. He likes it, but I think if he was to do it again he would get the lap bars.
#11
KrashnKraka
And take that statement for what it is... garbage.
It is about center of gravity, for any machine... mower/tractor/ship
For mowers on slopes it is also about traction and horsepower, remembering ZTR
is virtually a "skid steer" system and so waaaay more versatile and controllable.
There isn't a rider made that will match a ZTR around slopes and acute grades.
Take that to the Bank.
The ZTR's with s/wheels I am familiar with are virtually a rider with hydro drives,,
for the purpose of considering CoG.
Get a demo..or get shown one working on similar country to yours.
KrashnKraka
I've been told that a zero turn with steering wheel is the best mower for sloping land.......
And take that statement for what it is... garbage.
It is about center of gravity, for any machine... mower/tractor/ship
For mowers on slopes it is also about traction and horsepower, remembering ZTR
is virtually a "skid steer" system and so waaaay more versatile and controllable.
There isn't a rider made that will match a ZTR around slopes and acute grades.
Take that to the Bank.
The ZTR's with s/wheels I am familiar with are virtually a rider with hydro drives,,
for the purpose of considering CoG.
Get a demo..or get shown one working on similar country to yours.
#12
Carscw
I disagree a riding mower is a lot better on slopes then a ztr
Carscw
And take that statement for what it is... garbage. It is about center of gravity, for any machine... mower/tractor/ship For mowers on slopes it is also about traction and horsepower, remembering ZTR is virtually a "skid steer" system and so waaaay more versatile and controllable. There isn't a rider made that will match a ZTR around slopes and acute grades. Take that to the Bank. The ZTR's with s/wheels I am familiar with are virtually a rider with hydro drives,, for the purpose of considering CoG. Get a demo..or get shown one working on similar country to yours.
I disagree a riding mower is a lot better on slopes then a ztr
#13
M
Mad Mackie
M
Mad Mackie
I agree with Carscw, ZTRs have a strong tendency to slide sideways on hills as there is no control over the front wheels and ridged suspension on most. Where I mowed for years with GTs with no problem, I now have to turn the ZTR around on the level area, back it down the hill and mow up the hill. 20 plus degree hills however.
#14
Carscw
I still carry a GT with me for hill 20 plus degrees.
And for cutting brush.
The ZTRs with the steering wheel really do good on hills. Because you have control of the front wheels.
Best mower I have ever used for hills. Is a snapper RER.
Carscw
I agree with Carscw, ZTRs have a strong tendency to slide sideways on hills as there is no control over the front wheels and ridged suspension on most. Where I mowed for years with GTs with no problem, I now have to turn the ZTR around on the level area, back it down the hill and mow up the hill. 20 plus degree hills however.
I still carry a GT with me for hill 20 plus degrees.
And for cutting brush.
The ZTRs with the steering wheel really do good on hills. Because you have control of the front wheels.
Best mower I have ever used for hills. Is a snapper RER.
#15
G
gainestruk
G
gainestruk
OP said 10 degree slope, just about any z-turn will handle that, with 6 acres you will need more than a residential mower if you want it to last more than a few years.
If you have a Husqvarna dealer you might look at MZ52, it's low to medium commercial.
It starts at $4199.95 to $4999.95 depending on engine and stamped or fabricated deck, they have Hydro-Gear zt3100 commercial drives.
Go to URL Found to see them.
After you run a z-turn for a while yo will get pretty good on slopes, I have a small slope the width of the house top to bottom around 30' it measures out at 16 degrees, I mow it across with no problem now.
At first if not sure mow up and down slope till you get comfortable.
If you have a Husqvarna dealer you might look at MZ52, it's low to medium commercial.
It starts at $4199.95 to $4999.95 depending on engine and stamped or fabricated deck, they have Hydro-Gear zt3100 commercial drives.
Go to URL Found to see them.
After you run a z-turn for a while yo will get pretty good on slopes, I have a small slope the width of the house top to bottom around 30' it measures out at 16 degrees, I mow it across with no problem now.
At first if not sure mow up and down slope till you get comfortable.
#16
S
Shughes717
Husqvarna, like snapper pro, are more affordable than most other brands with similar specs. A consumer can get more bang for their buck so to speak. The mz would be considered low end commercial/high end residential. The mzt is a mid level commercial mower. It is offered with the fs series Kawi engine, zt3400 hydros and a fabricated deck.
I do agree that the op should be at least looking into a low end commercial mower for the amount of acrage he is mowing, but it sounds as though his options are either cub cadet, or toro. I haven't priced many low end commercial cub cadet ztr mowers, but I know toro gets pretty pricey once you get into their commercial line.
S
Shughes717
OP said 10 degree slope, just about any z-turn will handle that, with 6 acres you will need more than a residential mower if you want it to last more than a few years.
If you have a Husqvarna dealer you might look at MZ52, it's low to medium commercial.
It starts at $4199.95 to $4999.95 depending on engine and stamped or fabricated deck, they have Hydro-Gear zt3100 commercial drives.
Go to URL Found to see them.
After you run a z-turn for a while yo will get pretty good on slopes, I have a small slope the width of the house top to bottom around 30' it measures out at 16 degrees, I mow it across with no problem now.
At first if not sure mow up and down slope till you get comfortable.
Husqvarna, like snapper pro, are more affordable than most other brands with similar specs. A consumer can get more bang for their buck so to speak. The mz would be considered low end commercial/high end residential. The mzt is a mid level commercial mower. It is offered with the fs series Kawi engine, zt3400 hydros and a fabricated deck.
I do agree that the op should be at least looking into a low end commercial mower for the amount of acrage he is mowing, but it sounds as though his options are either cub cadet, or toro. I haven't priced many low end commercial cub cadet ztr mowers, but I know toro gets pretty pricey once you get into their commercial line.
#17
T
tuckler
My budget is under 7 grand and the low commercial cubs are in that range with a 60" deck. But the problem remains: Toro does not make a commercial ZT with a steering wheel and most people are saying a commercial is what I should be looking at. I tend to agree......I couldn't find a steering wheel on most brands of ZT's. I've loved my cub garden tractor, I think I'm just going to have to go with the CC. Just sure would like to do some comparisons...but in commercial with S wheel....where?
T
tuckler
Husqvarna, like snapper pro, are more affordable than most other brands with similar specs. A consumer can get more bang for their buck so to speak. The mz would be considered low end commercial/high end residential. The mzt is a mid level commercial mower. It is offered with the fs series Kawi engine, zt3400 hydros and a fabricated deck.
I do agree that the op should be at least looking into a low end commercial mower for the amount of acrage he is mowing, but it sounds as though his options are either cub cadet, or toro. I haven't priced many low end commercial cub cadet ztr mowers, but I know toro gets pretty pricey once you get into their commercial line.
My budget is under 7 grand and the low commercial cubs are in that range with a 60" deck. But the problem remains: Toro does not make a commercial ZT with a steering wheel and most people are saying a commercial is what I should be looking at. I tend to agree......I couldn't find a steering wheel on most brands of ZT's. I've loved my cub garden tractor, I think I'm just going to have to go with the CC. Just sure would like to do some comparisons...but in commercial with S wheel....where?
#18
Ric
Have you ever used a ztr with lap bars? The lap bars are less work and a lot easier to use in my opinion. I guess it may be all in what your use to.
Ric
My budget is under 7 grand and the low commercial cubs are in that range with a 60" deck. But the problem remains: Toro does not make a commercial ZT with a steering wheel and most people are saying a commercial is what I should be looking at. I tend to agree......I couldn't find a steering wheel on most brands of ZT's. I've loved my cub garden tractor, I think I'm just going to have to go with the CC. Just sure would like to do some comparisons...but in commercial with S wheel....where?
Have you ever used a ztr with lap bars? The lap bars are less work and a lot easier to use in my opinion. I guess it may be all in what your use to.
#19
S
Shughes717
I agree. A ztr with a steering wheel isn't a must have for property with a 10% slope or less. A low end commercial mower with lap bars should suit you well. Personally, I enjoy mowing with my current ztr mower much more than I ever did with a mower that utilized a steering wheel. If you don't like lap bars there is another option. Country clipper, for instance, offers their mowers with a single joystick control. They are comfortable to operate, because there is an arm rest located behind the joystick for your right arm. Your left arm is free. That is considering there is a country clipper dealer near your area.
S
Shughes717
Have you ever used a ztr with lap bars? The lap bars are less work and a lot easier to use in my opinion. I guess it may be all in what your use to.
I agree. A ztr with a steering wheel isn't a must have for property with a 10% slope or less. A low end commercial mower with lap bars should suit you well. Personally, I enjoy mowing with my current ztr mower much more than I ever did with a mower that utilized a steering wheel. If you don't like lap bars there is another option. Country clipper, for instance, offers their mowers with a single joystick control. They are comfortable to operate, because there is an arm rest located behind the joystick for your right arm. Your left arm is free. That is considering there is a country clipper dealer near your area.
#20
KrashnKraka
who by their own tap tapping away have clearly communicated their owned barriers.
There is any number of demo videos illustrating ZTR CoG over riders,, so trolling the OP
with information he/she can easily disprove is beyond stooopid.
Then there is the learning.
I have yet to make use of the tip-over wheels on my ride. I am a "big guy", which
helps the CoG, and regularly do 45deg. I have one small section I weedwhack...it's
around 60deg.
One day....
KrashnKraka
I have already commented (at length) on the operational ability of some 'professionals'[...]
After you run a z-turn for a while yo will get pretty good on slopes, I have a small slope the width of the house top to bottom around 30' it measures out at 16 degrees, I mow it across with no problem now.
At first if not sure mow up and down slope till you get comfortable.
who by their own tap tapping away have clearly communicated their owned barriers.
There is any number of demo videos illustrating ZTR CoG over riders,, so trolling the OP
with information he/she can easily disprove is beyond stooopid.
Then there is the learning.
I have yet to make use of the tip-over wheels on my ride. I am a "big guy", which
helps the CoG, and regularly do 45deg. I have one small section I weedwhack...it's
around 60deg.
One day....
#21
S
Shughes717
Hills pose risks for some lawn tractors and riders
Rather than rant about how what other members are saying can be proven wrong by looking online and calling them stupid, I thought I would post a link to a consumer reports article concerning this very topic to help prove Carscw's point. Feel free to post a link to your proof of the contrary.
S
Shughes717
I have already commented (at length) on the operational ability of some 'professionals'
who by their own tap tapping away have clearly communicated their owned barriers.
There is any number of demo videos illustrating ZTR CoG over riders,, so trolling the OP
with information he/she can easily disprove is beyond stooopid.
Then there is the learning.
I have yet to make use of the tip-over wheels on my ride. I am a "big guy", which
helps the CoG, and regularly do 45deg. I have one small section I weedwhack...it's
around 60deg.
One day....
Hills pose risks for some lawn tractors and riders
Rather than rant about how what other members are saying can be proven wrong by looking online and calling them stupid, I thought I would post a link to a consumer reports article concerning this very topic to help prove Carscw's point. Feel free to post a link to your proof of the contrary.
#22
Carscw
So disprove me.
Carscw
I have already commented (at length) on the operational ability of some 'professionals' who by their own tap tapping away have clearly communicated their owned barriers. There is any number of demo videos illustrating ZTR CoG over riders,, so trolling the OP with information he/she can easily disprove is beyond stooopid. Then there is the learning. I have yet to make use of the tip-over wheels on my ride. I am a "big guy", which helps the CoG, and regularly do 45deg. I have one small section I weedwhack...it's around 60deg. One day....
So disprove me.
#23
T
tuckler
That link sure confirms for me the importance of steering with the front wheels. The couple lawn maintenance people I talked to said that for the hills we have here (Asheville NC) the all round best mower has a steering wheel...or the one that you stand behind. I see the point of the caster wheels not cooperating as well when going sideways on a hill. I would think they would tend to want to turn down the hill and you'd be fighting that pull.
T
tuckler
Hills pose risks for some lawn tractors and riders
Rather than rant about how what other members are saying can be proven wrong by looking online and calling them stupid, I thought I would post a link to a consumer reports article concerning this very topic to help prove Carscw's point. Feel free to post a link to your proof of the contrary.
That link sure confirms for me the importance of steering with the front wheels. The couple lawn maintenance people I talked to said that for the hills we have here (Asheville NC) the all round best mower has a steering wheel...or the one that you stand behind. I see the point of the caster wheels not cooperating as well when going sideways on a hill. I would think they would tend to want to turn down the hill and you'd be fighting that pull.
#24
Carscw
You are correct the front wheels want to always turn down the hill.
Carscw
That link sure confirms for me the importance of steering with the front wheels. The couple lawn maintenance people I talked to said that for the hills we have here (Asheville NC) the all round best mower has a steering wheel...or the one that you stand behind. I see the point of the caster wheels not cooperating as well when going sideways on a hill. I would think they would tend to want to turn down the hill and you'd be fighting that pull.
You are correct the front wheels want to always turn down the hill.
#25
Ric
That article is so of base it's ridiculous. They talk about driving a ztr up and down hills when 90% of all manufactures tell you in the manual they provide the correct way to use and drive a ztr on slopes. If you care to read the manual it will tell to you to never drive up and down a slope and always drive across the slope and you should always start at the bottom of the slope moving across the slope always turning up the slope to make a return pass. You'll never lose control of a ZTR on a slope if your turning up the slope.
Ric
That link sure confirms for me the importance of steering with the front wheels. The couple lawn maintenance people I talked to said that for the hills we have here (Asheville NC) the all round best mower has a steering wheel...or the one that you stand behind. I see the point of the caster wheels not cooperating as well when going sideways on a hill. I would think they would tend to want to turn down the hill and you'd be fighting that pull.
That article is so of base it's ridiculous. They talk about driving a ztr up and down hills when 90% of all manufactures tell you in the manual they provide the correct way to use and drive a ztr on slopes. If you care to read the manual it will tell to you to never drive up and down a slope and always drive across the slope and you should always start at the bottom of the slope moving across the slope always turning up the slope to make a return pass. You'll never lose control of a ZTR on a slope if your turning up the slope.
#26
S
Shughes717
I sprayed a co worker's lawn with my ztr mower last season, and the slopes were too steep to go across. We had to go up and down, and slide to a stop at the bottom. I asked him how he mowed that slope with his hustler x one. He said he had to mow it the same way. His mower couldn't hold the slope going across. The slope is probably too steep to mow safely with a ztr mower, but he has been mowing it for 4 seasons. He mowed it the first season with a residential john Deere ztr mower and only put it in his pond twice before figuring it out. Lol
S
Shughes717
That article is so of base it's ridiculous. They talk about driving a ztr up and down hills when 90% of all manufactures tell you in the manual they provide the correct way to use and drive a ztr on slopes. If you care to read the manual it will tell to you to never drive up and down a slope and always drive across the slope and you should always start at the bottom of the slope moving across the slope always turning up the slope to make a return pass. You'll never lose control of a ZTR on a slope if your turning up the slope.
I sprayed a co worker's lawn with my ztr mower last season, and the slopes were too steep to go across. We had to go up and down, and slide to a stop at the bottom. I asked him how he mowed that slope with his hustler x one. He said he had to mow it the same way. His mower couldn't hold the slope going across. The slope is probably too steep to mow safely with a ztr mower, but he has been mowing it for 4 seasons. He mowed it the first season with a residential john Deere ztr mower and only put it in his pond twice before figuring it out. Lol
#27
Ric
A good rule of thumb is if you can't back up a slope with your mower/ztr you have no business being on the slope. I prefer mowing slopes with the Grandstand.
Ric
I sprayed a co worker's lawn with my ztr mower last season, and the slopes were too steep to go across. We had to go up and down, and slide to a stop at the bottom. I asked him how he mowed that slope with his hustler x one. He said he had to mow it the same way. His mower couldn't hold the slope going across. The slope is probably too steep to mow safely with a ztr mower, but he has been mowing it for 4 seasons. He mowed it the first season with a residential john Deere ztr mower and only put it in his pond twice before figuring it out. Lol
A good rule of thumb is if you can't back up a slope with your mower/ztr you have no business being on the slope. I prefer mowing slopes with the Grandstand.
#28
S
Shughes717
We use what we have. I understand that a stand on mower is better on slopes than a ztr mower, but so are lawn tractors. I have experience using both on slopes, and the lawn tractor did make it a little easier than the ztr. The problem the op faces is the acrage he is mowing. A ztr mower will get the job done much faster. As I said in an earlier post he should be fine with a low end commercial ztr mower if the slope is no more than 10% as he mentioned. My co worker has a large lawn and would have probably been better off with a stand on, but he wanted a ztr mower.
S
Shughes717
A good rule of thumb is if you can't back up a slope with your mower/ztr you have no business being on the slope. I prefer mowing slopes with the Grandstand.
We use what we have. I understand that a stand on mower is better on slopes than a ztr mower, but so are lawn tractors. I have experience using both on slopes, and the lawn tractor did make it a little easier than the ztr. The problem the op faces is the acrage he is mowing. A ztr mower will get the job done much faster. As I said in an earlier post he should be fine with a low end commercial ztr mower if the slope is no more than 10% as he mentioned. My co worker has a large lawn and would have probably been better off with a stand on, but he wanted a ztr mower.
#29
Carscw
That would rule out 95% of my slopes.
There are some driveways I can not back up. Without spinning the tires.
I try to mow side to side as much as possible. Some hills I drive up and back down.
Carscw
A good rule of thumb is if you can't back up a slope with your mower/ztr you have no business being on the slope. I prefer mowing slopes with the Grandstand.
That would rule out 95% of my slopes.
There are some driveways I can not back up. Without spinning the tires.
I try to mow side to side as much as possible. Some hills I drive up and back down.
#30
R
RaptorSDer
R
RaptorSDer
There's a fairly long and detailed YouTube video showing a Hustler vs a standard rider on wet slopes. It's really a Hustler infomercial but I would assume it applies to most ZTRs.
Here's the link:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O3ixg_yhEiA
Here's the link:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O3ixg_yhEiA
#31
KrashnKraka
Yeh,,, there are plenty around.....especially Euro uploads where those guys
have man-size "slopes".
.......but....
But the kiddies chanting believe the front wheels on a ZTR are there for
steering,, maintaining direction, like.
As said, best to drive or be shown how to. End of.
OP..take note of the conduct of some on this forum when contradicted with what
they are forced to read,, that which does not make their buying descision look good.
I didn't get my first buy right...half got the second right, and am working through fixing
the third - not a mower problem. And I had the benefit of some years on "borrowed rides"
prior to going ZTR.
We are human we make mistakes...but somehow these blessed Interwebs paint
those mistakes over...if it is said (posted) enough.
Leave yer tuit, brother... I am off this thread.
/out
KrashnKraka
There's a fairly long and detailed YouTube video showing a Hustler vs a standard rider on wet slopes. It's really a Hustler infomercial but I would assume it applies to most ZTRs.
Here's the link:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O3ixg_yhEiA
Yeh,,, there are plenty around.....especially Euro uploads where those guys
have man-size "slopes".
.......but....
But the kiddies chanting believe the front wheels on a ZTR are there for
steering,, maintaining direction, like.
As said, best to drive or be shown how to. End of.
OP..take note of the conduct of some on this forum when contradicted with what
they are forced to read,, that which does not make their buying descision look good.
I didn't get my first buy right...half got the second right, and am working through fixing
the third - not a mower problem. And I had the benefit of some years on "borrowed rides"
prior to going ZTR.
We are human we make mistakes...but somehow these blessed Interwebs paint
those mistakes over...if it is said (posted) enough.
Leave yer tuit, brother... I am off this thread.
/out
#32
Carscw
This is a joke.
We all know that the rider can mow that hill with no problems.
Carscw
There's a fairly long and detailed YouTube video showing a Hustler vs a standard rider on wet slopes. It's really a Hustler infomercial but I would assume it applies to most ZTRs. Here's the link: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O3ixg_yhEiA
This is a joke.
We all know that the rider can mow that hill with no problems.
#33
Carscw
Carscw
I truly believe that if you do not have more then 500 hours on a mower then you can not say how it performs.
I have been cutting 50 to 100 yards da a week for years. I have used every type of mower.
I know what works best for every type of terrain.
Trust me when I say a ZTR will slide or flip on a hill before a rider will.
I have been cutting 50 to 100 yards da a week for years. I have used every type of mower.
I know what works best for every type of terrain.
Trust me when I say a ZTR will slide or flip on a hill before a rider will.
#34
Ric
I realy don't see how lawn Tractors can be better on a slope than a ztr. The ztr will have a wider wheel track and a lower center of gravity than a lawn tractor and will out preform that LT hands down. How in the world is it better? I'm sorry but to me it just doesn't make sense.
Ric
We use what we have. I understand that a stand on mower is better on slopes than a ztr mower, but so are lawn tractors. I have experience using both on slopes, and the lawn tractor did make it a little easier than the ztr. The problem the op faces is the acreage he is mowing. A ztr mower will get the job done much faster. As I said in an earlier post he should be fine with a low end commercial ztr mower if the slope is no more than 10% as he mentioned. My co worker has a large lawn and would have probably been better off with a stand on, but he wanted a ztr mower.
I realy don't see how lawn Tractors can be better on a slope than a ztr. The ztr will have a wider wheel track and a lower center of gravity than a lawn tractor and will out preform that LT hands down. How in the world is it better? I'm sorry but to me it just doesn't make sense.
#35
T
tuckler
T
tuckler
Thanks for all the great info folks. Looks like my only option is a cubby ZT with a 60" deck. The Toro sounds appealing but the consensus on this thread is that I should have a commercial grade for my 6 acres. I could whittle that down to 4 acres if I did some with the Kabota, but that sounds like a cop out. Get what will do the entire thing. One question I do have: Why aren't more companies making the s. wheel models in a commercial grade? Is it that commercial lawns are usually flat and the need isn't there?
#36
S
Shughes717
There are 4 wheels helping it hold the hill instead of 2. 4 wheels get better traction than 2. Simple math. Not to mention the weight is distributed much different than on a ztr mower. With a lawn tractor the engine is over the front wheels and the rider is over the back wheels. Weight is distributed better.
S
Shughes717
I realy don't see how lawn Tractors can be better on a slope than a ztr. The ztr will have a wider wheel track and a lower center of gravity than a lawn tractor and will out preform that LT hands down. How in the world is it better? I'm sorry but to me it just doesn't make sense.
There are 4 wheels helping it hold the hill instead of 2. 4 wheels get better traction than 2. Simple math. Not to mention the weight is distributed much different than on a ztr mower. With a lawn tractor the engine is over the front wheels and the rider is over the back wheels. Weight is distributed better.
#37
S
Shughes717
As said before ztr mowers can mow slopes up to 10 to 15%. If commercial lawn care companies have a lot of slopes to mow most will either have a stand on or a walk behind for those jobs.
S
Shughes717
Thanks for all the great info folks. Looks like my only option is a cubby ZT with a 60" deck. The Toro sounds appealing but the consensus on this thread is that I should have a commercial grade for my 6 acres. I could whittle that down to 4 acres if I did some with the Kabota, but that sounds like a cop out. Get what will do the entire thing. One question I do have: Why aren't more companies making the s. wheel models in a commercial grade? Is it that commercial lawns are usually flat and the need isn't there?
As said before ztr mowers can mow slopes up to 10 to 15%. If commercial lawn care companies have a lot of slopes to mow most will either have a stand on or a walk behind for those jobs.
#38
S
Shughes717
I posted a link to an article posted by a magazine who actually tests products and report to consumers their findings. They have no vested interest in which mower the consumer buys, instead of a video advertisement done by a company trying to get consumers to purchase their mower over every other brand. You know there are going to be things done to make their mower look much better than the other mower. They are not going to make it an even playing field, nor would they.
S
Shughes717
There's a fairly long and detailed YouTube video showing a Hustler vs a standard rider on wet slopes. It's really a Hustler infomercial but I would assume it applies to most ZTRs.
Here's the link:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O3ixg_yhEiA
I posted a link to an article posted by a magazine who actually tests products and report to consumers their findings. They have no vested interest in which mower the consumer buys, instead of a video advertisement done by a company trying to get consumers to purchase their mower over every other brand. You know there are going to be things done to make their mower look much better than the other mower. They are not going to make it an even playing field, nor would they.
#39
KrashnKraka
"Trust me".. a Life Insurance agent's line.
You, bloke, are a joke. An idiot of pantagruelistic form, I do appreciate
every forum has it's clown. HTF you got your post count without someone
kicking yer freckle* in has me beat.
Then again, every time these days I take community posters at their word
I face massive disappointment. You, bud, are no exception.
Happy with your troll?
* freckle [colloquial .au] polite reference to the
brown passage/ring gear/brown eye/date/bunghole/arsehole (USA-a55h0le)
KrashnKraka
I truly believe that if you do not have more then 500 hours on a mower then you can not say how it performs.
I have been cutting 50 to 100 yards da a week for years. I have used every type of mower.
I know what works best for every type of terrain.
Trust me when I say a ZTR will slide or flip on a hill before a rider will.
"Trust me".. a Life Insurance agent's line.
You, bloke, are a joke. An idiot of pantagruelistic form, I do appreciate
every forum has it's clown. HTF you got your post count without someone
kicking yer freckle* in has me beat.
Then again, every time these days I take community posters at their word
I face massive disappointment. You, bud, are no exception.
Happy with your troll?
* freckle [colloquial .au] polite reference to the
brown passage/ring gear/brown eye/date/bunghole/arsehole (USA-a55h0le)
#40
Ric
Check out this video if your liking the CC I think you'll like it.:wink:
https://youtu.be/Ub5zhteH73Y
Ric
Thanks for all the great info folks. Looks like my only option is a cubby ZT with a 60" deck. The Toro sounds appealing but the consensus on this thread is that I should have a commercial grade for my 6 acres. I could whittle that down to 4 acres if I did some with the Kabota, but that sounds like a cop out. Get what will do the entire thing. One question I do have: Why aren't more companies making the s. wheel models in a commercial grade? Is it that commercial lawns are usually flat and the need isn't there?
Check out this video if your liking the CC I think you'll like it.:wink:
https://youtu.be/Ub5zhteH73Y
#41
M
Mad Mackie
M
Mad Mackie
A ZTR steers with the rear wheels by one turning faster or slower than the other. When either of the rear wheels looses traction even for a short period, then steering control is also lost during that same period of time. Granted that the CG is lower, however no benefit to the situation when steering control is lost.
With a ZTR, I have reduced mowing time by 50% over mowing the same places with a GT, however, I have lost control of a ZTR three times due to it sliding sideways uncontrollably, two times out into the street and one time into the woods on the down side of a hill lawn. Never did this on my GTs.
When the ZTR slides it reminds me of when I was taking flying lessons and letting the aircraft go into a stall and recovering from it. During that period, both the aircraft and a ZTR will do as gravity dictates regardless of the operators control input!!!
I'm going out to do the hilly customers place shortly, knowing that I will have to back down the hill and mow up, it will take me longer to do this place, 20 to 25 degrees in several spots and I need to use my collection system this time.
With a ZTR, I have reduced mowing time by 50% over mowing the same places with a GT, however, I have lost control of a ZTR three times due to it sliding sideways uncontrollably, two times out into the street and one time into the woods on the down side of a hill lawn. Never did this on my GTs.
When the ZTR slides it reminds me of when I was taking flying lessons and letting the aircraft go into a stall and recovering from it. During that period, both the aircraft and a ZTR will do as gravity dictates regardless of the operators control input!!!
I'm going out to do the hilly customers place shortly, knowing that I will have to back down the hill and mow up, it will take me longer to do this place, 20 to 25 degrees in several spots and I need to use my collection system this time.
#42
Ric
I can't see where weight distribution will or would make a difference if you have a lower center of gravity and wider wheel track. You have less chances of turning over a ztr than a lawn tractor.
I mow in one sub-division where the homes are built on tiered lots and there are 20% slopes between lots and I mow them with the ztr all the time and never have an issue and I wouldn't dare try those on a lawn Tractor. The Grandstand which in reality is a ztr difference is your standing instead of sitting is rated for 20 degree slopes and the Kawasaki engine is rated for 25 degrees in any direction.
Ric
There are 4 wheels helping it hold the hill instead of 2. 4 wheels get better traction than 2. Simple math. Not to mention the weight is distributed much different than on a ztr mower. With a lawn tractor the engine is over the front wheels and the rider is over the back wheels. Weight is distributed better.
I can't see where weight distribution will or would make a difference if you have a lower center of gravity and wider wheel track. You have less chances of turning over a ztr than a lawn tractor.
As said before ztr mowers can mow slopes up to 10 to 15%. If commercial lawn care companies have a lot of slopes to mow most will either have a stand on or a walk behind for those jobs.
I mow in one sub-division where the homes are built on tiered lots and there are 20% slopes between lots and I mow them with the ztr all the time and never have an issue and I wouldn't dare try those on a lawn Tractor. The Grandstand which in reality is a ztr difference is your standing instead of sitting is rated for 20 degree slopes and the Kawasaki engine is rated for 25 degrees in any direction.
#43
KrashnKraka
Buy one, any.... and find out.
Mowers aint motorcars friend, which is the mentality some showrooms cater to
and some riders after "Church on Sunday" pride themselves displaying.
OTOH.. us ZTR heathens have mowed the grass, cut the short shrub around Venus,
AND had a ballgame with the kids,, to go chew the fat with the Brothers down
the shed (garage) before wandering back to the bedroom for another launch at Venus!
All this while your s/wheel types are uttering "Holy Marys" and praying a likeminded
bored bud on a lawn forum will pull your ego up and lash yer back on the s/wheel..cos
yer bogged down with a bent arm (idler).
No amount of text beats suckin' down lost hours on riders, ZTR enabled or whatever.
More than 6 acres the story changes. That area of mow...?..the best advice comes from
examples of utility services ,,, not online forums.
Now..done. Enuph time wasted on this thread.
KrashnKraka
[...]
*One question I do have: Why aren't more companies making the s. wheel models in a commercial grade? Is it that commercial lawns are usually flat and the need isn't there?
Buy one, any.... and find out.
Mowers aint motorcars friend, which is the mentality some showrooms cater to
and some riders after "Church on Sunday" pride themselves displaying.
OTOH.. us ZTR heathens have mowed the grass, cut the short shrub around Venus,
AND had a ballgame with the kids,, to go chew the fat with the Brothers down
the shed (garage) before wandering back to the bedroom for another launch at Venus!
All this while your s/wheel types are uttering "Holy Marys" and praying a likeminded
bored bud on a lawn forum will pull your ego up and lash yer back on the s/wheel..cos
yer bogged down with a bent arm (idler).
No amount of text beats suckin' down lost hours on riders, ZTR enabled or whatever.
More than 6 acres the story changes. That area of mow...?..the best advice comes from
examples of utility services ,,, not online forums.
Now..done. Enuph time wasted on this thread.
#44
S
Shughes717
The reason you wouldn't dare try it on a lawn tractor is that you probably haven't tried using a lawn tractor on slopes like that. I, like mad Mackie have had a ztr mower slide down hills on me that I was able to stay on with a lawn tractor. Don't get me wrong, I am a big fan of ztr mowers. I will never own another lawn tractor, but it doesn't change the fact that they are a little better on hills. I realize that ztr mowers have a wider wheel base and the center of gravity is lower, but as I said before, having 4 wheels with traction on the side of a hill is better than 2.
As for weight distribution making a difference, just look at the stand on as an example. Yes, it is also a ztr mower, but it's much more compact with the engine, and rider over the drive tires. Where as a regular ztr mower has the engine behind the tires. The change in weight distribution makes a difference on slopes. Also, with a stand on mower the rider has more freedom of motion to shift his/her weight to assist the side that is losing traction which changes weight distribution.
S
Shughes717
I can't see where weight distribution will or would make a difference if you have a lower center of gravity and wider wheel track. You have less chances of turning over a ztr than a lawn tractor.
I mow in one sub-division where the homes are built on tiered lots and there are 20% slopes between lots and I mow them with the ztr all the time and never have an issue and I wouldn't dare try those on a lawn Tractor. The Grandstand which in reality is a ztr difference is your standing instead of sitting is rated for 20 degree slopes and the Kawasaki engine is rated for 25 degrees in any direction.
The reason you wouldn't dare try it on a lawn tractor is that you probably haven't tried using a lawn tractor on slopes like that. I, like mad Mackie have had a ztr mower slide down hills on me that I was able to stay on with a lawn tractor. Don't get me wrong, I am a big fan of ztr mowers. I will never own another lawn tractor, but it doesn't change the fact that they are a little better on hills. I realize that ztr mowers have a wider wheel base and the center of gravity is lower, but as I said before, having 4 wheels with traction on the side of a hill is better than 2.
As for weight distribution making a difference, just look at the stand on as an example. Yes, it is also a ztr mower, but it's much more compact with the engine, and rider over the drive tires. Where as a regular ztr mower has the engine behind the tires. The change in weight distribution makes a difference on slopes. Also, with a stand on mower the rider has more freedom of motion to shift his/her weight to assist the side that is losing traction which changes weight distribution.
#45
T
tuckler
Thats got to be a 15 or 20 % grade and the cub seems to handle it great. I've got one small area like that thats about 60' deep. sideways with the Kabota or the GT was not an option, unless with the GT I was sitting on the fender. I take all the safeties off and if I flip, that blades going to keep on spinning. Not a pretty picture
T
tuckler
Check out this video if your liking the CC I think you'll like it.:wink:
https://youtu.be/Ub5zhteH73Y
Thats got to be a 15 or 20 % grade and the cub seems to handle it great. I've got one small area like that thats about 60' deep. sideways with the Kabota or the GT was not an option, unless with the GT I was sitting on the fender. I take all the safeties off and if I flip, that blades going to keep on spinning. Not a pretty picture
#46
Carscw
Carscw
My reason for liking a lt over a ZTR on very steep hills. Is not because of flipping or rolling over.
It's sliding.
When mowing side to side the rider for me does not slide.
As I have said before what works for one does not work for everyone.
For me I just fell more comfortable on the rider.
It's sliding.
When mowing side to side the rider for me does not slide.
As I have said before what works for one does not work for everyone.
For me I just fell more comfortable on the rider.
#47
G
gainestruk
I do somewhat agree, I've never had lawn tractor slide like I've had z-turn slide on my slope, but now that I've been using my z-turn for 2 years I'm getting much better and haven't slid this year.
I have 2 road signs and telephone service box on slope and it was easer to use lawn tractor to turn and cut around all three, with z-turn it works better to go from down slope and cut up, with tractor I could mow down slope or up slope the same.
As earlier posted once rear tires on zero turn start to slide you are pretty much along for the ride, on steep grades I would still feel more comfortable on lawn tractor.
With the slope and ditch I have my zero turn works fine and I don't think I would ever go back to lawn tractor.
G
gainestruk
My reason for liking a lt over a ZTR on very steep hills. Is not because of flipping or rolling over.
It's sliding.
When mowing side to side the rider for me does not slide.
As I have said before what works for one does not work for everyone.
For me I just fell more comfortable on the rider.
I do somewhat agree, I've never had lawn tractor slide like I've had z-turn slide on my slope, but now that I've been using my z-turn for 2 years I'm getting much better and haven't slid this year.
I have 2 road signs and telephone service box on slope and it was easer to use lawn tractor to turn and cut around all three, with z-turn it works better to go from down slope and cut up, with tractor I could mow down slope or up slope the same.
As earlier posted once rear tires on zero turn start to slide you are pretty much along for the ride, on steep grades I would still feel more comfortable on lawn tractor.
With the slope and ditch I have my zero turn works fine and I don't think I would ever go back to lawn tractor.
#48
R
RaptorSDer
Sorry, I didn't realize you were so passionate and defensive about this. I simply found the video interesting and didn't think you'd object to me sharing it.
You may be right, though, it's possible that entire video is photoshopped.
R
RaptorSDer
This is a joke. We all know that the rider can mow that hill with no problems.
Sorry, I didn't realize you were so passionate and defensive about this. I simply found the video interesting and didn't think you'd object to me sharing it.
You may be right, though, it's possible that entire video is photoshopped.
#49
S
Shughes717
I, for one, didn't have a problem with the video. At least you were trying to show some proof to the contrary. The only issue I had with it was that it was produced by a company who makes only ztr mowers. There is incentive for them to try to make them look better than a lawn tractor. I chose the consumer reports article because they don't sell mowers, so there would be no reason to give one or the other an advantage when testing them.
S
Shughes717
Sorry, I didn't realize you were so passionate and defensive about this. I simply found the video interesting and didn't think you'd object to me sharing it.
You may be right, though, it's possible that entire video is photoshopped.
I, for one, didn't have a problem with the video. At least you were trying to show some proof to the contrary. The only issue I had with it was that it was produced by a company who makes only ztr mowers. There is incentive for them to try to make them look better than a lawn tractor. I chose the consumer reports article because they don't sell mowers, so there would be no reason to give one or the other an advantage when testing them.
#50
Carscw
Sorry did not mean to come off like that.
I will say the same thing I said a couple years ago when he his came out.
Do they really think no one has used a rider?
They made it look stuck on a bump.
Was not getting on to you for posting it.
Carscw
Sorry, I didn't realize you were so passionate and defensive about this. I simply found the video interesting and didn't think you'd object to me sharing it. You may be right, though, it's possible that entire video is photoshopped.
Sorry did not mean to come off like that.
I will say the same thing I said a couple years ago when he his came out.
Do they really think no one has used a rider?
They made it look stuck on a bump.
Was not getting on to you for posting it.
#51
M
Mad Mackie
M
Mad Mackie
The 5th page on GTs verses ZTRs!!!! WOW!!!!
I have two ZTRs and what they are intended for, they do a great job!!! Mowing only!!!!
I also have a large GT, it mows with or without collection, it plows with a 54" blade, it operates a 48" single stage snow blower, it hauls my cargo trailers around my place, it hauls logs out of the woods, it hauls my wagon with whatever is in it, rocks, fire wood, wood chips, it just happens to be a little slower mowing than my ZTRs, but I can put it where no ZTR will go and get out!!!
I worked on a farm when I was a kid and mowed the orchards with a Farmal Cub that towed three sets of 3 30" gang reel mowers, ain't no ZTR gonna do that!!
Some of us have been around since long before the ZTR was ever thought of, for whatever this is worth and I wish that I still had my 1950 Oldsmobile Super 88 hardtop!!!! Yellow roof, black body!!!!
I have two ZTRs and what they are intended for, they do a great job!!! Mowing only!!!!
I also have a large GT, it mows with or without collection, it plows with a 54" blade, it operates a 48" single stage snow blower, it hauls my cargo trailers around my place, it hauls logs out of the woods, it hauls my wagon with whatever is in it, rocks, fire wood, wood chips, it just happens to be a little slower mowing than my ZTRs, but I can put it where no ZTR will go and get out!!!
I worked on a farm when I was a kid and mowed the orchards with a Farmal Cub that towed three sets of 3 30" gang reel mowers, ain't no ZTR gonna do that!!
Some of us have been around since long before the ZTR was ever thought of, for whatever this is worth and I wish that I still had my 1950 Oldsmobile Super 88 hardtop!!!! Yellow roof, black body!!!!
#53
Ric
Definitely a Tragic Accident. Just wish we could get the complete story so it could help others. I think there a lot of things or points being left out.
Ric
Definitely a Tragic Accident. Just wish we could get the complete story so it could help others. I think there a lot of things or points being left out.
#54
ztrjim
Hustler, Toro, Ariens and Bobcat to name a few residential models have a good lower center of gravity and perform well on slopes. Also Consider front steering controlled zero turns with Steering Wheels. Such as Exmark Quest-S Series or Cub Cadet RZT-S.
ztrjim
Heres a link to a detailed review of that same mower: Hustler Raptor 42 inch Review | Top Rated Zero Turn Mower ReviewsThere's a fairly long and detailed YouTube video showing a Hustler vs a standard rider on wet slopes. It's really a Hustler infomercial but I would assume it applies to most ZTRs.
Here's the link:
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=O3ixg_yhEiA
Hustler, Toro, Ariens and Bobcat to name a few residential models have a good lower center of gravity and perform well on slopes. Also Consider front steering controlled zero turns with Steering Wheels. Such as Exmark Quest-S Series or Cub Cadet RZT-S.
#55
R
RaptorSDer
R
RaptorSDer
And here's a video showing how NOT to mow a hill on a ZTR. This guy is extremely lucky he didn't kill himself.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fX2RYPPZEb0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fX2RYPPZEb0
#56
Carscw
He got lucky.
It not even a bad hill. Lack of Experience kicked his azz.
Carscw
And here's a video showing how NOT to mow a hill on a ZTR. This guy is extremely lucky he didn't kill himself. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fX2RYPPZEb0
He got lucky.
It not even a bad hill. Lack of Experience kicked his azz.