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Since day one, when endeavoring to start the mower, on first try I get only a click, and on second try turns over and starts immediately. I installed a relay per the dealers instructions, but nothing changed.
Any thoughts on how to correct this would be greatly appreciated.

Our crystal balls have become very cloudy, due to the recent elections. You are not giving us much info to help you. We have no idea how old this unit is, which engine it has, or if you have done anything to solve the problem besides changing the relay? With out unit model and serial numbers, plus all engine numbers everyone here will just be guessing. My first guess is that there Is a loose or dirty connection. My second guess is that you don’t have the proper size battery. If it is a single cylinder engine, the battery should have a minimum of 300 CCA. If you have a twin, the battery should have a minimum of 350 CCA. If you want more help please provide more info.

Sorry about the lack of info.
Mower: TIGER CAT II STCII-61V-32BV Serial # 8000092
Engine: Vanguard ModelNo./Mfg No. 543777-3222-J1 Serial# 2110138781751

This was purchased a year ago, currently has 27 hours on it (medical issues have limited my mowing)
As stated earlier, the cranking issue has been there since day1, after dealing with it for a couple of months, removed the battery, had the dealer test it, and he said it tested "marginal".
At that time the battery was replaced with the Interstate SP-40 (350 CCA).

Any additional thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

The click maybe the starter solenoid not completely pulling in the bendix to engage the flywheel. My nephews starter on his 35 Vanguard on his stump grinder does the same thing on occasion since new and he is pushing 700 hours. The first start attempt doesn't allow the starter to fully engage the flywheel and energize the solenoid contacts to spin the starter. Has been an on going issue with that engine and starter setup with no known cure but various shops and Briggs tech support have tried different things over the years without complete success.

If

Wendol said:

Sorry about the lack of info.
Mower: TIGER CAT II STCII-61V-32BV Serial # 8000092
Engine: Vanguard ModelNo./Mfg No. 543777-3222-J1 Serial# 2110138781751

This was purchased a year ago, currently has 27 hours on it (medical issues have limited my mowing)
As stated earlier, the cranking issue has been there since day1, after dealing with it for a couple of months, removed the battery, had the dealer test it, and he said it tested "marginal".
At that time the battery was replaced with the Interstate SP-40 (350 CCA).

Any additional thoughts would be greatly appreciated.

Click to expand...

it is under warranty, take it to the dealer.

Strange the engine was made in 2021 so up to dealer if they want to cover an out of base warranty engine. A gray area. Only the dealer knows if the mower has been sitting for two years unused.

Wendol,
You stated the dealer suggested an additional relay. "I installed a relay per the dealers instructions"
Can you provide us with details on that?
Just curious!
Doug Lee
*

Douglas Lee said:

Wendol,
You stated the dealer suggested an additional relay. "I installed a relay per the dealers instructions"
Can you provide us with details on that?
Just curious!
Doug Lee
*

Click to expand...

That should be like the helper relay that JD used on the Kohler engines that had the solenoid shift starters. Basically it is wired as to provide much shorter trigger wire circuit.

Douglas Lee said:

Wendol,
You stated the dealer suggested an additional relay. "I installed a relay per the dealers instructions"
Can you provide us with details on that?
Just curious!
Doug Lee
*

Click to expand...

Yes helper/assist relay as StarTech describes.

Since your issue started “on day one” it may be something as simple as a faulty ground.
I am unfamiliar with Tiger Cat, however, I’ve corrected several “no-start” situations by following the battery ground wire to where it connects to the frame/chassis.

I have a motorcycle that came from the factory where the ground wire connected to the frame through the paint! Cleaned the paint off, cleaned the ground lug and put it back together… even the headlight was brighter after that…

Thanks to all for the feedback on the starter assist modification.
Doug Lee
*

Rivets said:

Our crystal balls have become very cloudy, due to the recent elections. You are not giving us much info to help you. We have no idea how old this unit is, which engine it has, or if you have done anything to solve the problem besides changing the relay? With out unit model and serial numbers, plus all engine numbers everyone here will just be guessing. My first guess is that there Is a loose or dirty connection. My second guess is that you don’t have the proper size battery. If it is a single cylinder engine, the battery should have a minimum of 300 CCA. If you have a twin, the battery should have a minimum of 350 CCA. If you want more help please provide more info.

Click to expand...

The people of America have spoken.

Rivets said:

Our crystal balls have become very cloudy, due to the recent elections. You are not giving us much info to help you. We have no idea how old this unit is, which engine it has, or if you have done anything to solve the problem besides changing the relay? With out unit model and serial numbers, plus all engine numbers everyone here will just be guessing. My first guess is that there Is a loose or dirty connection. My second guess is that you don’t have the proper size battery. If it is a single cylinder engine, the battery should have a minimum of 300 CCA. If you have a twin, the battery should have a minimum of 350 CCA. If you want more help please provide more info.

Click to expand...

The American people have spoken.

Ah I knew I save the relay wiring diagram somewhere. fuse can be smaller as it is for the relay only. Don't know who decided on the 30A one.

StarTech,
Thanks for the diagram.
Does the extra relay just parallel the original wiring
to trigger the starter relay when the starter switch is turned?
Thanks . . .
Doug Lee
*

I have used a solenoid for an inerta drive starter and wire it basically the same way. I use 10 ga wire from the engine starter solenoid and back to the exciter terminal on the engine starter. You don't have to run a ground wire from the solenoid since the solenoid grounds to the frame when you bolt it down.

What it does is to reduce the voltage drop at the starter solenoid. This why it is installed as close the starter as possible. What JD found was that the long trigger wire paths was causing large voltage drops due wiring resistance; therefore, the solenoid did not have current to fully pull in to engage the starter switch inside the solenoid. Instead of several feet of wiring wiring now there is just a few inches. Also the relay requires a lot less current so the voltage drop in the current wiring is reduce to the relay.

Another term I seen used is "helper relay". Basically comes down to you installing a switch at the solenoid to connect to battery cable at the starter instead going thru all the wiring harness. You could do the same using a screwdriver but this a lot easier. This way you can be seated ready to use the mower instead ruining your screwdriver tips.

One side note here is that the relay must be a water proof version as it is exposed to outdoor weather conditions so not just any old cheap relay can be use.

I retired from Scag(Metalcraft of Mayville)Try calling 920-387-3150.Ask for R&D.

Wendol said:

Since day one, when endeavoring to start the mower, on first try I get only a click, and on second try turns over and starts immediately. I installed a relay per the dealers instructions, but nothing changed.
Any thoughts on how to correct this would be greatly appreciated.

Click to expand...

Where did you add the relay- show photos and a diagram. Is it activated by the crank wire and bypassing that wire, with tab 87 connected to the battery and tab 30 connected to the solenoid?

Adding a relay strikes me as similar to adding a fuel filter when the original one becomes clogged.

Has anyone ever lubricated the Bendix on the starter?

To eliminate all extraneous wiring and issues, use a good voltmeter and check the cranking voltage right at the starter, and then moving both the positive and negative probes to various spots to find where you lose starting voltage. If you have full voltage at the starter [with your - probe on the starter case] during the first crank attempt, then you are losing the voltage inside the starter contact or motor brushes. If you don't have a meter, use a set of jumper cables and go from a good car battery. Attach the negative somewhere on the starter itself, then touch the positive directly to the starter positive post. That will tell you for sure if the internal starter solenoid is not making good contact until it first "loosens up" with the first start attempt. If it starts good the first time, then start going back and trying to figure out where you are losing the available start current.

Gym123 said:

Where did you add the relay- show photos and a diagram. Is it activated by the crank wire and bypassing that wire, with tab 87 connected to the battery and tab 30 connected to the solenoid?

Adding a relay strikes me as similar to adding a fuel filter when the original one becomes clogged.

Has anyone ever lubricated the Bendix on the starter?

Click to expand...

I have recently removed the relay (was wired as in Star Tech's diagram), gave the ground wires a good cleaning and unit appears to start better, (just not consistently) at this point and time.