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I posted earlier that the roll bar on my Kommander looked like a dangerous thing. It has the ability to catch low hanging branches and flip the mower over backwards.
To that end I chainsawed all likely looking branches that I though would pose a problem (quite a pile).
All except one !!! That sucker caught the roll bar and the mower immediately raised the front end. It kept climbing higher until I felt like the unit was vertical. I was thinking quickly as to which way the mower would land so as to be in the best possible spot. Apparently the front of the mower raised high enough that the roll bar was lowered. The bar, with the continued forward unit movement, slipped from under the branch allowing the front end to come slamming down.
That is what I had envisioned and talked about.
What idiots at Kubota thought this was a good safety feature is a wonder.
The chance of what happened to me has much higher odds of happening than a roll-over. That apparently is what other manufactures thought too.

ROPS systems are required for equipment (tractors, zero turns etc.) that may be sold to any employer. Read the regulations below. The manufacturer is not about to build two identical units, one with and one without this system for their own protection. Just like safety switches they are designed for a purpose. Blame the "I'm from the government and I'm here to help you" not the equipment manufacturers. Did you remove the seatbelt also, since you were probably not using it either.

http://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owadisp.show_document?p_table=STANDARDS&p_id=10957

That "one" overlooked or skipped branch, is exactly why the rops system was put there.
You were aware of the possible problem with branches, and even went so far as to remove most of them... but you still managed to get into a problem with a possible backwards flip as the consequence.

Safety equipment is intended to aid in the 'unnoticed' situation, when someone makes a mistake, or if an unforeseen event happens... Like a tire failure, hitting a hole or drop of a curb, less experienced operator errors like turns too sharp at too fast a speed.
You can remove any "safety" provisions you like... but you Should First recognize the Intended Purpose, before you remove them...They were Not just added as an unnecessary bells & whistles attachment... IF you understand the designed purpose you Might be able to plan for Most associated events. (while You are the only operator).
Also like Rivets mentioned... If you have removed the rops, Do Not leave the seat belt, some less experienced operator 'May' one day get seriously injured because they used a seat belt, Without the rops.... :smile:KennyV

you also should remember this and it took me awhile to figure it out myself since ZTRs are so much fun to use just because they will run 11 or 12 MPH dont mean you have to run that fast around things that can or will cause you problems i went just the other way my ZTR didnt come with the ROPS so get Exmark to send it to the dealer and had it put on and now even though i have all my trees trimed up not to cause problems i never run as hard as it will go unless im on flat unobstructed ground

Kubota chose to add the roll bar to consumer mowers, not the government. It is held on by 4 accessible bolts. To add it for commercial or employer sales is a minor deal.
There are many things to cause a roll over (although, unlikely) and a roll bar would be good to have in place. However, roll bars are much more likely to CAUSE an accident.
My attention will be focused on staying safe and the roll bar is the first to go. And yes, the seat belt is a hazard.

Fish...I was thinking of doing the same thing. It does look easy to take off.

I personally drive mine fast...I can almost get it into a power slide when I hit some good mud. That being said I can "feel" the ability for the mower to lift and have had some minor second thoughts in doing it. Plus taking it off would make putting a cover over it a lot easier.

fishbone said:

There are many things to cause a roll over (although, unlikely) and a roll bar would be good to have in place. However, roll bars are much more likely to CAUSE an accident.
My attention will be focused on staying safe and the roll bar is the first to go. And yes, the seat belt is a hazard.

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How is Kubota supposed to know if the unit is being used residentially or commercially? Plus, most accidents occur to residential operators. The ROPS SYSTEM (roll bar seatbelt) will not cause an accident. The accident will be caused by an inexperienced and nonobservant operator, which the ROPS is designed to protect. You blaming the manufacturers is passing the buck and not taking the responsibility for your actions. I never do anything wrong, someone else is causing my problems and is to blame. Also, you now will have to do ALL your own maintainence and repairs on this unit, because any honest dealer or repair shop will know that they must reinstall the ROPS, as it is a mandated safety system and can't go out of the shop until all safety systems are working properly. We have to work by these rules and our liability insurance does not cover us if we don't. We're not going to take the chance that nothing will go wrong. Those are the rules we must live by, even though at times we don't like it either. Maybe if you look at it from the other side of the fence you might understand why things are done for a reason.

Yes, I did make a mistake. When first looking at the mower, I determined that the roll bar was an accident waiting to happen. My mistake was not removing it first off.
Just looking up for branches and looking down as to where the mower is cutting goes counter to safety.
Mowing around overhead growth with a roll bar is just stupid. A back-flip is just a matter of time.

I removed my ROPS a couple days ago. I figure I could live without it give my yard being mostly flat, several trees with low branches presenting hazards, and the fact that the Gravely ZT HD 48 I was considering (or anything else I was considering) didn't even come with one.

Heck, I can always put it back on if I need...

HOLY FREAK'N COW... I found out what you guys are talking about.

So I am getting around the edges of the field a little closer than normal and all of all of the sudden the front of the mower raises up, I mean like a dragster off the starting line...bout had to change my pants. It's weird...you don't know what to do with the controls...go forward-go backward then bang it was over.

My land is totally flat...that thing is coming OFF...END OF STORY.

That bar is a major hazard. Insane.
Looking at the front wheels at eye level takes the starch out of ya. Need a few minutes to gather up your stuff after one of those.

The answer to the question of how to get the bar off is elbow grease.
I used an adjustable on the nut (because it was handy) and a socket on the bolt. A large box wrench looped on the socket wrench handle gave me the leverage needed. A pipe would have been better. Those suckers are tight. The fine thread makes it very tight.
Now if my shed rolls over, I'll be in good shape because it has a roll-over-bar in it.:laughing:
Let us know how you make out with yours, Duckman.

fishbone said:

The answer to the question of how to get the bar off is elbow grease. I used an adjustable on the nut (because it was handy) and a socket on the bolt. A large box wrench looped on the socket wrench handle gave me the leverage needed. A pipe would have been better. Those suckers are tight. The fine thread makes it very tight. Now if my shed rolls over, I'll be in good shape because it has a roll-over-bar in it.:laughing: Let us know how you make out with yours, Duckman.

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I had the very disturbing sight of seeing a man laying dead earlier this year because of not having rops and seatbelt he worked for five star lawn and was mowing goodlettsville,Tn off ramp on i-65 you can google and read channel 5 news reports on such he was 24 i think and had a young son. We had a second man killed same week worked for Franklin,TN parks dept was on a small hill rolled mower over and died no rops no seatbelt and he was 25 year operator. You guys make your own decision but i make all wear seatbelts and rops locked. Walk behinds are for under trees and pond banks.

Mid TN Lawn said:

I had the very disturbing sight of seeing a man laying dead earlier this year because of not having rops and seatbelt he worked for five star lawn and was mowing goodlettsville,Tn off ramp on i-65 you can google and read channel 5 news reports on such he was 24 i think and had a young son. We had a second man killed same week worked for Franklin,TN parks dept was on a small hill rolled mower over and died no rops no seatbelt and he was 25 year operator. You guys make your own decision but i make all wear seatbelts and rops locked. Walk behinds are for under trees and pond banks.

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Thank's for the PM Mid TN Lawn. You'll find Like Rivets said most ZTR accidents will be caused by an inexperienced and non-observant operator and it can be a commercial operator as well as a residential operator, just because we are so called professionals doesn't give us an edge on the mowing game. However I believe like some here that seat belts and the Rops can be and are dangerous and I believe should be left up to the person buying the machine if he wants the things or not.
You mention all these accidents with people dying and I'm sorry to hear that but I'd be willing to bet that the greatest majority of those where cause by putting the mower into a position or cutting somewhere the mower should have never been in the first place, like on your off ramp incident which was likely more than the mowers recommended 15 degree capability. Again probably caused by an inexperienced and non-observant operator like Rivets said. The biggest suggestion That I can tell or give to people and that 90% never do when they but A ZTR is Know your mower inside and out before you ever sit down on the seat and start that engine. It will save you a lot of heartaches. BTW if you don't want seat belts and a Rops on your ZTR and you want a commercial mower they do make them without, There called s Stander.

Amazing just a few years ago I bought my 2 zero turns new and they were fine without a ROPS bar, now those same machines are dangerous! I understand tractors needing them, they have the weight to kill someone easily..but a zero turn mower? They are more likley to cause a roll over than to save you in the event of one.What's the world coming to..next thing you know shopping carts will need flashing lights and a ROPS bar and seat belt for your toddler ....the average shopping Cart can weigh hundreds of pounds easily..

Raw Dodge said:

Amazing just a few years ago I bought my 2 zero turns new and they were fine without a ROPS bar, now those same machines are dangerous! I understand tractors needing them, they have the weight to kill someone easily..but a zero turn mower? They are more likley to cause a roll over than to save you in the event of one.What's the world coming to..next thing you know shopping carts will need flashing lights and a ROPS bar and seat belt for your toddler ....the average shopping Cart can weigh hundreds of pounds easily..

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Shopping carts do have seat belts for the toddler... I use it all the time mostly to hold them down

Raw Dodge said:

I understand tractors needing them, they have the weight to kill someone easily..but a zero turn mower? .

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My Kubota ZD326 Zero Turn weight is over 1700lbs... just saying.

My Dixie Chopper XXWD 5000 is 1870lbs..bought it new..no ROPS
.

It's been nice knowing you

I grew up without a seat belt and car seat..amazingly I'm still alive.. I think I'll take my chances the first 8 seasons I managed to not flip it..

fishbone said:

Kubota chose to add the roll bar to consumer mowers, not the government. It is held on by 4 accessible bolts. To add it for commercial or employer sales is a minor deal.
There are many things to cause a roll over (although, unlikely) and a roll bar would be good to have in place. However, roll bars are much more likely to CAUSE an accident.
My attention will be focused on staying safe and the roll bar is the first to go. And yes, the seat belt is a hazard.

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Its dangerous either way with, or without it. You can snag a limb with it, and flip, or roll down a hill, and get crushed without it.

wjjones said:

Its dangerous either way with, or without it. You can snag a limb with it, and flip, or roll down a hill, and get crushed without it.

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Exactly... All my friends with Kubota Zds remove the bar upon taking delivery it's the first thing they do...put it back on when trading or selling...