The insanity of battery incompatibility

[exotion]

Eventually, they will get this figured out and probably the government will pass some sort of laws standardizing things. Given the problems with ethanol, etc. I would really like to see commercial grade battery powered handhelds, especially trimmers.

This is a long long way off. We would need to have battery run time of at least 4-6 hrs. And possibly 6-9 hrs on the mowers. There are a few companies that run battery operated equipment but its a real pita and mostly a sellig gimmick

 

[Robbgroovy]

The batteries are wired completely differently. Also, the interface is different to prevent accidental insertion of a Gen1 battery in a Gen2 tool or vice versa.

Thanks MM. Sounds like a hassle to hack. I am set up with a full 4 piece suite of 40v Gen1 yard tools with 3 batteries and 2 chargers. They are too cheap now to resist. I'll just hope my Gen1 batteries and chargers last as long as the tools.

 

[piloto]

I've been bothered by this forever. The industry and the consumer would both be in better shape if the manufacturers were not focusing their income streams on string spools and batteries. Finally, Ryobi has departed from the string spools with their attachment capable 40v trimmer, but are firmly in the battery game. Too bad that major battery manufacturers don't take it upon themselves to solve this. I think they could. It is just a matter of voltage and AH, after all, plus connector adaptors, which could be sold separately.

 

[Willyvon]

I agree with you....

And now Greenworks has their 80 volt "Pro" lineup of tools. The battery packs(80 volt, 2 AH which is same watthours of energy storage as their G-Max 40 volt batteries) charge up in 30 min. supposedly. originally, pre-release they posted a proposed array of "Pro" line battery packs ranging from the above 2 AH 160 watt-hour battery to a backpack carried 11 AH pack for the system, clearly aiming it at all cordless electric lawn services market. Basically one must evaluate how soon you'll be replacing which device, replace it with one from the biggest array of common battery system devices and go from there, replacing the lot one by one as appropriate. Let's not get started on the "Ego" products at 56 volt battery system(also recharge in 30 min.). I'm thinking 80 volts myself. Probably the Greenworks pro mower, then snow blower maybe in a year or 2 thereafter. For the time being it's a Neuton EM 4.1 24v (SLA battery pack) mower, a 12v integrated SLA battery B&D string trimmer, and a Snow Joe 40v Ion snow blower in my cordless electric yard equipment "stable". Snow Joe's CEO sent me their 16" Ion 40v mower but it arrived poorly packed and cracked just in front of where the front axle mounts. They don't have the best put together corporate operation in this market. Besides it only has bagging clippings management, no side or rear discharge or mulching mode option. Go figure, they obviously didn't. I have issues with their Ion snow blower's design as well, the one I bought last Oct. ~ 2 weeks before Greenworks and their cloned (Craftsman) marks introduced their 40v G-Max and 80 volt Pro models ( The 2 Greenworks and Craftsman machines look almost identical). Here's my blog post reviewing what was available in cordless electric snow blowers just before I bought one in Oct.
Bill's Will: Misc Musings of a Techie: Small snow blowers: Be happy, Go cordless electric

 

[timtim2008]

the same could be said for electric cars, and cell phones, and electronics.

if everyone could agree to a few sizes. and storage capacity.

life could be a LOT simpler



watch this

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sW_7i6T_H78

 

[timtim2008]

or we all could use this backpack battery.

21amp hour

$999

 

[macktyner]

One of the biggest problems with battery powered electric tools is the total incompatibility between brands and even within brands. Here is my ridiculous situation with the many different batteries I am currently using:

Greenworks 40V original Li-Ion battery
Greenworks 40V new G-MAX Li-Ion battery
Greenworks 20V Li-Ion battery
Black & Decker 18V NiCd battery
Black & Decker 36V Li-Ion battery
Ryobi 24V Li-Ion battery
WeedEater 20V Li-Ion battery (compatible with Greenworks and Troybilt 20V tools)
Bosch 18V Li-Ion battery
Remington 18V NiCd battery

Of course all these unique batteries require their own specific charger unit, which doubles the problem. The only cross-compatibility is between the WeedEater and Greenworks 20V Li-Ion batteries/chargers, such that I can use the WeedEater batteries in the Greenworks tools and charge the Greenworks battery in the WeedEater charger.

Wouldn't it be great if there were some type of universal industry standard for batteries. Pie in the sky, I guess.

I have similar issues. I had the entire series of Black and Decker 18 volt NiCd tools, and accumulated quite a pile of free batteries from special deals. As you probably know, the problem with NiCd is low cell voltage (1.2) and so each battery has 15 cells! As soon as one shorts out, then the others begin to get a higher charging voltage and current and quickly also begin to cook while charging, and fail. The slow 9 hour charger was the most kind. The fast chargers are lethal. So I would take the packs apart, and replace the individual shorted cells.... quite a labor of love or stupidity. When lithium came on the scene, I quickly learned that the best deal on batteries was the Lowe's Kobalt 24 volt 2.5 AH which is only $20 !!!! I modified my electric bicycles to use these (I have a youtube video on how to do it) and was quite happy with that idea. Then I thought, why not try the lithium batteries on the B&D tools? The tools work fine.... but I can't any longer pay $35 for a B&D NiCd when I can get the lithium batteries for $20. Of course they dont fit without an adapter. But I had a whole load of dead 18 volt NiCds, each with the charger plug on them, so I just took the batteries apart and used the plate for the adapter. I have several youtube videos on how to do this. Takes a little time and some gorilla glue, and of course the polarity is backwards so beware you have to switch the wires. And the drill goes a little faster on 24 volts, but not a real problem for me.

The 40 bolt lithium tool series from Kobalt is pretty good, and the 5 year no questions asked warranty is insane! As I told the salesman, there is not a chainsaw made that I cannot destroy in a year.... and they warranty it for 5 ??!! So far I have swapped out 3 of them.... the oilers are less than ideal. I am currently trying the Lynx 40 volt chainsaw from Harbor Freight..... it is $20 cheaper, and the warranty only 90 days. But how do I solve the battery compatibility problem? The Lynx battery is $59.... similar to the Lowe's but I have four of the Lowe's ones.

 

[macktyner]

I have similar issues. I had the entire series of Black and Decker 18 volt NiCd tools, and accumulated quite a pile of free batteries from special deals. As you probably know, the problem with NiCd is low cell voltage (1.2) and so each battery has 15 cells! As soon as one shorts out, then the others begin to get a higher charging voltage and current and quickly also begin to cook while charging, and fail. The slow 9 hour charger was the most kind. The fast chargers are lethal. So I would take the packs apart, and replace the individual shorted cells.... quite a labor of love or stupidity. When lithium came on the scene, I quickly learned that the best deal on batteries was the Lowe's Kobalt 24 volt 2.5 AH which is only $20 !!!! I modified my electric bicycles to use these (I have a youtube video on how to do it) and was quite happy with that idea. Then I thought, why not try the lithium batteries on the B&D tools? The tools work fine.... but I can't any longer pay $35 for a B&D NiCd when I can get the lithium batteries for $20. Of course they dont fit without an adapter. But I had a whole load of dead 18 volt NiCds, each with the charger plug on them, so I just took the batteries apart and used the plate for the adapter. I have several youtube videos on how to do this. Takes a little time and some gorilla glue, and of course the polarity is backwards so beware you have to switch the wires. And the drill goes a little faster on 24 volts, but not a real problem for me.

The 40 bolt lithium tool series from Kobalt is pretty good, and the 5 year no questions asked warranty is insane! As I told the salesman, there is not a chainsaw made that I cannot destroy in a year.... and they warranty it for 5 ??!! So far I have swapped out 3 of them.... the oilers are less than ideal. I am currently trying the Lynx 40 volt chainsaw from Harbor Freight..... it is $20 cheaper, and the warranty only 90 days. But how do I solve the battery compatibility problem? The Lynx battery is $59.... similar to the Lowe's but I have four of the Lowe's ones.

Perhaps I will try to make an adaper..... but the Lowe's battery is wider and longer than the Lynx, and will not fit.... so I am looking for other candidates. The Ryobi is compact like the Lynx, and so might fit. I do like the Lynx motor better, as it is brushless and so there are no brushes to burn out and fail. It has a cheaper look than the Kobalt, like all Harbor Freight tools do, but so far it works pretty well for made in China.

Maybe we should call our congresspeople, and ask them to pass legislation about battery compatibility, like they did with cell phones..... remember when each cell phone had a different charger plug? Now at least we have the Android standard and the Apple standard. Guess that will never change.
Mack

 

[John Fitzgerald]

If the industry won’t do it, we need legislation to force a standard. A backpack or waistpack battery with an optional choice of plug adapters for different brands would be a start.

 

[Boobala]

All the reasons I will not buy ANY battery powered lawn equipment, selections are equal to a women's shoe store.. and about as functional as a pair of "Stiletto-Heels" .. :laughing: