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I have a Murray Sentinel with a retro fitted Zhongchen XP 620 17.5hp Briggs copy

Ran great first 18 months.

The problem I have is that it starts and runs fine for 20 mins then completely and abruptly cuts out.
I restart it and is it starts surging, (governor doesn't know what to do) and the revs go up and down, up and down.

After totally disassembling and cleaning Carburetor, total disassembling and clean out of fuel pump,
and draining fuel tank and drying, adding new fuel filter. Checking all wiring.

AND after I watched this brilliant video----



which made total sense and I performed the jet mod.... but it hasn't fixed my problem.

Runs perfectly for up to 20 minutes then does the same surging song and dance.

While the engine is still hot I drain the float bowl and blow out the fuel line with the air compressor, seems to fix it again for 20 minutes.


I'm not sure if draining the float bowl is actually doing anything because sometimes I have just let it sit and idle and play around with the throttle then it settles down and I can mow for another 5 minutes then again cuts out....same story. Driving me crazy, spring is here, grass is growing fast and I'm fighting a losing battle.

Any ideas?

Are you sure it is a carb problem and not possibly a spark plug problem (see plugs do weird things) or possibly loosing spark because of a faulty ignition module. Other than that I would be thinking that for some reason you are loosing fuel flow to the carb, or possibly the fuel is heating up maybe in the carb bowl causing a somewhat vapor lock issue. I have seen both conditions so don't rule out anything.

Time to spend a little money.
Get an inline spark tester & a can of carb cleaner.
Fit the tester and run the mower .
When it stops crank the engine.
If the tester flashes then spray some carb cleaner down the crab and crank the engine.
if it fires right up you have a fuel supply problem.
If there is no flashes then the coil is dud.

Those trash engine use rubbish fuel lines that go soft inside and block off the fuel supply.
The junk fuel caps have very poor vents that block if the cap has not already fallen apart.
Good luck trying to find parts to fit.
While they look like a B & S engine, very few B & S parts will fit apart from the air filter.

IF it has a rubber float needle seat, these are also made from the wrong grade of rubber and go sticky preventing the float needle opening fully so eventually the carb runs out of fuel.

Don't know how you cleaned out the fuel pump as it is a sealed unit.
The discharge end has a non return valve so if you blew high pressure air backwards through the outlet you will have damaged the valve which could also be causing you problems.
The diaphragms are also made from the wrong grade of rubber and are prone to falling apart.
If you remove the fuel pipe from the carb and turn it upwards, cranking the engine should send a spurt of fuel higher than the top of the carb if the pump is in a good condition.

If I sound a little dismissive , I am not trying to rubbish you but those engines are total junk bought in by the container load and foistered off onto unsuspecting public as a "quality product" by a cartel of Toorak Terrorist & Potts Point Pirates who right now are laughing at you while they sip their $ 1000/ bottle champers.
You were probably told by the lieing sales person that it was the same as a B & S engine and B & S parts will fit.
Well they don't and it isn't.
The Magic Pudding is a children's fairy story and you will never get more than you paid for.

The last one of them I fixed, was the last one I will ever fix as the bill including labour came to the same as the owner paid for the engine in the first place.
That ended up in the courts, yet to be determined & I have better things to do that chase people who have been made fools of for money that would have been better spend on a 1/2 decient engine in the first place.
Yours outlived the 12 month warranty and that is all the retailer is obliged to cover, after that you are on your own.

Thanks, I watched a few more vids and realised I haven't properly cleaned out all the jets.

I did at one point pull off the spark lead and wiggled it back on and it ran fine for a few more minutes, but I can't rule out chance as I tried the next time it did it but wiggling the plug lead did nothing.

My mind is thinking there is a stray bit of debris somewhere in the carb that blocks and unblocks randomly which I have missed..

Runs perfect for up to 20 minutes.

When it cuts out it usually shuts down like unplugging the fuel solenoid, which just to confuse me shuts down the same way as if you just switch the key off.
BUT sometimes is cuts out like it can't make up its mind to keep going for about 3 seconds then the rpms just drop till its completely still.

Then when I restart, it immediately does the surging.

Draining the float bowl and blowing compressed air down the fuel line, which takes me less than 3 minutes always fixes it for another 20 minutes.
I'm guessing that the engine sitting for 3 minutes while I do the fix is not cooling down enough to relate it to being a heat issue. I might be wrong though. But the weather is mild at the moment (under 20 C) and Ive had it running perfectly in over 30 degrees.

I will go through the carby one more time and make sure I check all the jets and remove any welch plugs and give it a good blow out.

Is carby cleaner essential ?

Electrical components can cool enough is a very short period of time sometimes to go from not working to working. Had a fuel solenoid issue on a Kohler command a few years ago with a bad fuel solenoid. Engine dies, shut key off, on, off, on, off, on/click all in about 4 seconds.

bertsmobile1 said:

Don't know how you cleaned out the fuel pump as it is a sealed unit.
The discharge end has a non return valve so if you blew high pressure air backwards through the outlet you will have damaged the valve which could also be causing you problems.
The diaphragms are also made from the wrong grade of rubber and are prone to falling apart.
If you remove the fuel pipe from the carb and turn it upwards, cranking the engine should send a spurt of fuel higher than the top of the carb if the pump is in a good condition.

Click to expand...

Pump has a few phillips screws holding both halves together , Just prise it apart, careful not to lose the spring and stainless cap that goes over the spring.
Diaphragm seemed in good condition, no gummy bears, felt a little gritty in there, My new fuel filter is pre pump. Pump assembled like new and squirts like an 18 year old.

Also I know that no Briggs parts fit, it's not a clone...

Since my Enduro days I've serviced and rebuilt my carbs...actually before my enduro days, when I was 12 and had to put new rings in my dad's embarrassing 100cc road bike.

Oh yeah and the Rochester Quadrajet from the GS 455 on the Rivieara , and the Gas research carby on my Studebaker with the 327 and the Windsors and Cleavlands in my stupid Ford days, and yeah The KTM 495 and the RG500 square 4 2 stroke that I completely rebuilt when my mate put the rod through the crankcase at Phillip Island. I don't want to talk about the Monaro and the 253 days OK? It's just too sad a story.

So I can spot junk and sub standard parts and so far this Chinese engine, luckily has ok fuel lines that still look and feel newish.
And it doesn't come with a fuel tank. I'm using the standard Murray Sentinel fuel tank. USA USA :banana:

Don't get me started about the pure prejudice against Chinese Chainsaws and the misinformation the main dealerships crank out about "you'll never find parts" to gullible baby boomers who want to spend $1700 on a saw , and hundreds of dollars in service fees because everyone knows that the more you spend... the better it is...right? Gotta find some way to spend your super and fortnightly pension cheques.

And please I refuse to get into debates about Chinese made Large Diaphragm Valve Condenser Microphones....

ILENGINE said:

Electrical components can cool enough is a very short period of time sometimes to go from not working to working. Had a fuel solenoid issue on a Kohler command a few years ago with a bad fuel solenoid. Engine dies, shut key off, on, off, on, off, on/click all in about 4 seconds.

Click to expand...

Thanks, Yes, I guess I'm in denial. I can't remember why but imprinted in my mind is the knowledge that things that happen when everything is warmed up is usually an electrical problem.

I might just put a fuel tap and temporarily take out the solenoid and put a bolt in the hole and test it.

But just so it doen't play on my mind I am going to go over the carby again. Then I may surrender to the fact that it just might be ignition related.

bertsmobile1 said:

Yours outlived the 12 month warranty and that is all the retailer is obliged to cover, after that you are on your own.

Click to expand...

Not 100% accurate. Consumer law says that a product should last as long as normal person would expect it to last.

For instance If you by a refrigerator with a 12 month warranty and it breaks down in 2 years, most people would agree that a refrigerator should last around 10 years and that would be a reasonable expectation.

In Australia consumer law goes beyond the warranty. That's why companies that sell you extended warranties are charging you for something that is already covered by consumer law. If you have an extended warranty go back to the store and say you want to give it back and they will most likely refund you the money of the extended warranty. All you have to say to them is that you were misled that you were getting protection that didn't exist under consumer law.

Unfortunately, if you tried to return something after the warranty, some retailers don't know consumer law and would rather cut their right arm off than be wrong and you'd have to go through the crap of getting ACCC to go into bat for you.

zenchopper said:

Not 100% accurate. Consumer law says that a product should last as long as normal person would expect it to last.

For instance If you by a refrigerator with a 12 month warranty and it breaks down in 2 years, most people would agree that a refrigerator should last around 10 years and that would be a reasonable expectation.

In Australia consumer law goes beyond the warranty. That's why companies that sell you extended warranties are charging you for something that is already covered by consumer law. If you have an extended warranty go back to the store and say you want to give it back and they will most likely refund you the money of the extended warranty. All you have to say to them is that you were misled that you were getting protection that didn't exist under consumer law.

Unfortunately, if you tried to return something after the warranty, some retailers don't know consumer law and would rather cut their right arm off than be wrong and you'd have to go through the crap of getting ACCC to go into bat for you.

Click to expand...

This only applies to products that are made in Australia and not to temporary diverted land fill that is brought in by trash merchants under WTO regulations that are only required to be of "servicable quality" when purchased.
Thus a lawn mower sold at Aldi for $ 175 is not expected to last for the same time as one bought from a mower shop for $ 750.
And just so you know, I am an independent mower technician so there is no turf protection written into the response.
There was talk about a mandated service life which went nowhere & the EU tax on short lived consumer durable items just vanished along with the tax on no recyclables .
I think the end of life disposal tax is still there but am not sure.

I but some parts from China. China now has more satelities in orbit than any other country despite the USA, the EU & Russia having a 40 year head start.
Just like factories any where else in the world, Chinese factories can make good stuff or they can make junk.
Chinese factories make what we ask them to make so if we order garbage that looks like a quality product to sell in our chain of shops that is what we get sold.
I have nothing against a lot of good quality engines that come out of China other than there is little to no service information available and no spares.
The same for a lot of whole good.

However it is greedy selfish wealthy Australians who seek to steal money from their fellow Australians by importing garbage that is unfit for it's intended use that is the problem.
Under WTO rulings, if the product is sold in other WTO countries then the Australian government can not prevent it being sold here except under a very limited and specific set of circumstances, containing asbestos is an example.
People continually bring me junk they have bought at a tool store ( mostly ) or a hardwear store that is out of warranty.
I have repaired 4 Ross chainsaws all fitted with neoprene fuel lines so they leaked like a sieve after 18 to 24 months. You can check this problem by looking at the posts on Not Good Enough or Product Review.
Three of them had a chain that was bent at the joining link, ( defective from new ) thus the chain ( counterfeit Oregon) , bar ( suspect counterfeit Oregon) & sprocket were all trashed, the carb can not be cleaned because the solvent to remove the rubber will also wreck the check valve which is not available.
Certified parts to repair the saw plus my labour at $ 60/hr for the scheduled service time ( a lot less than actual service time ) in most cases exceeds the original purchase price.
And don't start me on all of the "ebay only" brands of chain saws.

There are a dozen chippers, compressors & generators with Chonda engines that have come in for new starters because the original ones , melted , metal cracked through, drive pins bent backwards or cords broke.
Most can be repaired with a Honda pull start but it has to be modified to fit .
So do I do it for free for the $ 10 mark up on the $ 40 starter or expect the customer to pay for the 1/2 hr I spend modifing the starter that the counter staff would "bolt strait on" ?

Then you get the strait out & out criminals who send an item to China with the instruction to "make 10,000 that look exactly like this as cheap as possible " then sell the defective products door to door generally using back packers as the sales people.
A lot of this stuff is both defective & dangerous, as an example, I had a customer with a problem Honda/Onga fire pump.
The Honda was actually a H.Onda and the governor was nothing more than a shaft ( no seal) through the crankcase internally bent over and secured with a spring on a self tapper, thus when a load was put on the engine it just stalled.
The generator engine was the same story. Honda was aware of the counterfeits and Onga was aware of the counterfeits , three container loads of them but no one had been prosecuted over them.

IT takes the same amount of energy to make junk as it does to make a quality product and the extra cost of better materials is minute.
The logistical costs are identical between a quality product knocked down & junk
If we could stop trash being made & sold then we would not have to worry about Carbon pollution because it would be reduced by 30% overnight .
And this goes for anything from a cloths peg to a motor car.
Using raw materials of which there is a finite amount of to make land fill is just about the most destructive thing we can do to the planet shot of a nuclear war.

bertsmobile1 said:

T
And this goes for anything from a cloths peg to a motor car.
Using raw materials of which there is a finite amount of to make land fill is just about the most destructive thing we can do to the planet shot of a nuclear war.

Click to expand...

Agree with a lot of what you're saying. Still the original Briggs motor needed at least $500 worth of work and couldn't really grantee how long that would last so I took the punt on a $550 motor. I'm sure there's been many $8k mowers that had a faulty ignition, or bad fuel gummed things up..I'm sure that if this happened to a new mower 6 months after the warranty ran out it would still cost you hundreds to get repaired.



Totally agree with the rip off copies that are inferior and badly designed.
There are some diamonds in the rough, this motor does all the right things and I think the probability of something going wrong is not too different from new brand name mowers who's manufacturers also get components made in China.

And preventing things from going to landfill is what I'm all about. That's the reason I haven't thrown it out and WILL get it fixed. (i've kept the old Briggs, dropped a valve, and one day if i'm bored I'll fix it with second hand bits and have it as a spare.).


Also before I bought my Chinese chainsaw ,with "Oregon chain and bar" I googled Oregon Counterfeit chains, and Fake Carlton chains, and I couldn't find one story with any credible evidence. Some typical "everything from china is bad "comments but nothing substantial, no consumer authority investigations, no " man to loose more than tree limbs from fake chainsaw chain"...


******UPDATE *****

Pulled off the carb this morning, cleaned out every jet with tip cleaners,(paying attention to not enlarge them), Checked float, needle and seat, working perfectly no visible signs of anything worn out, Pulled out main jet and ran tip cleaners gently through any tiny holes..
I felt pretty stupid as everything is so clean and residue free.

Assembled it, Ran perfectly, I even fooled myself into believing that it had more power. Then same thing, Dead stall....restart, surging.

Don't have any carb cleaner so when it was idling and surging I sprayed couple a tiny puff of WD 40 In the air cleaner hole and made no difference at all. Please tell me if that was dumb, but I wasn't going to use hair spray. :wink: I think that a mist of wd 40 would at least have had some effect...

To rule out operating heat effecting anything I just let it sit for 15 minutes, started it and still the same surging...

The stupid paradox is that I know if I drain the bowl and blow air down the fuel line it works good again.

Tomorrow I'll try to test the coil and ignition module, any tips on what to look for with a multi-meter??

And just for fun , I'll drain the bowl and blow it out and mow for another 10 minutes. jeez the grass is growing fast.

Ok ..... I'll jump in this issue ....... Just change the fuel line..... They will flap on the inside...... Blowing in them does not do any good.....

The only way to know is to put a new one on and line is way cheaper than a carb...........

You can check the secondary windings, ground to spark plug with a multimeter but not the primary because it is in series with a Hall Effect trigger chip.
As they can not be repaired without destroying the chip it is a moot point.
Some of the metal cased plug caps have been known to short out the HT lead.
Check by looking at it running some where dark.

Other than that simply pull off the kill wire as the coil is shut down by grounding.
This bypasses all of the mowers electrics.
IF it sparks both hot & cold then the coil ( magneto really ) could be considered as OK.

Yes WD 40 as dumb and carb cleaner is just as dumb.
A lot of us use it in place of starter fluid as it is a lot softer on the engines.
You really only use it to clean out jet holes in the carbs & clean the exteriour surfaces before pulling them off.

As for the dead stop, I assume you can tell the difference between a flooding stop and lean stop & an electrical stop.
Dead stops are generally electric and tested by removing the kill wire.
The ire just sits on top of the cylinder and melted insulation of a chaffing ground short is not uncommon.

As for fake chain.
Professionals can tell the difference.
In the case of Ross the chain they are fitting had genuine Oregon cutters but fake side plates and drive links.
RGS used to be the Aust distributor for Oregon so their catalogue had all of the parts, you can buy individual Oregon chain parts to repair genuine Oregon chains.
When you look at the way the pins are riveted the difference is quite obvious and in the case of Ross, the chain was hand made, link by link as all of the pins were spun & not riveted.
Oregon continually change the logo & designs on the sides of their bars so when you see a saw with a paint scheme that is 2 years old you know it is fake.
Then when you look at the code stamped into the side of the bars, a lot are not Oregon codes or the 20" bar codes out as 14".

RGS who is one of my wholesale suppliers used to be the distributor for Oregon but Briggs took over as of October 1.
Currently they are selling off all of the bar & chain very cheap but even the sell out wholesale price of the bars is still more than the retail price of no name saws supposedly fitted with an Oregon bar.
Nothing sold by Bunnings has less than a 100% mark up, so a $ 90 retailed chain saw would have a cost price no more than $ 45 by the container load add $ 5 for freight China to Aust which leaves the factory with no higher price than $ 40 at the despatch dock.
The OEM factories will wholesale me a complete saw in parts without either chain or bar for around that price as part of a $ 50,000 order.
So there is no way that saw could have been fitted with a chain & bar made in the USA then exported to China.
Very shortly you will see Oregon in the major retail stores and when that happens Briggs will start to crack down on the counterfeits . They have the resources to go into chain stores buy products then check them for counterfeit parts and take legal actions. RGS did not have that sort of clout. The down side is none of the Australian retailers buy direct from China ( or any other country ) they all buy through local importers even if the importer gets told what to buy from who. Thus the company that ends up being sued is Fred & Sons imports , not the real criminals.
Stihl have just cracked down on one of their suppliers in China preventing them from selling aftermarket parts for Stihl products that are Stihl orange and Husqvarna is following suit.
So expect to see a lot of Stihl & Husqvarna clones in funny colours like Victa blue & JD green . I buy parts direct from these OEM suppliers and got some appologies because the parts supplied were different colours.

As for the quality of the chain & bar, most Ozzies would not have a clue.
People come in with Baumr chain to get sharpened a lot as one of the importers is just down the road.
Nearly all of them leave with new Carlton , Stens or Oregon chain because I will not sharpen a chain that has excessive side plate wear.
Many of these chains have only been used once and the owners jaws drop when I show them how much play there is in the side plates.
The average user will run a sprocket till it has nearly been cut in 1/2 because of excessive chain wear.

And as ot has not been mentioned, get a short bolt to replace the solenoid 7/16" UNF usually but as that is a Chinese motor, could be metric.
Fit the bowl bolt in place of the solenoid, it could have a bad connection or be faulty.
Down here they are not manditory yet.

bertsmobile1 said:

And as ot has not been mentioned, get a short bolt to replace the solenoid 7/16" UNF usually but as that is a Chinese motor, could be metric.
Fit the bowl bolt in place of the solenoid, it could have a bad connection or be faulty.
Down here they are not manditory yet.

Click to expand...

Thanks so much for your input.

I will replace the solenoid with a bolt before I buy a new $20 coil...

this morning I started it and it still was surging, I manually closed the choke slowly and all it does is stall, The revs did not increase at all as i slowly closed the choke...

I removed the coil and tested it , the resistance values seem OK I have no Manufacturer spec But both Spark lead to metal body and Kill switch to spark lead were exactly the same so I assume that's right
and the kill to the body was 1kohm. I saw a video of someone testing one and it was the same shape and appearance so When he said 1kohm was right I think thats ok...The old briggs one off the old engine measures the same, different mount so couldn't successfully try it out.

Ill try to start it tonight in the dark and see if I can see any spark jumping.

So when i eliminate the fuel solenoid as the issue it's pointing to a coil that tests ok but at operating temperature fails...???

I may just foot the $20 to rule it out...

All very frustrating while watching the grass grow and a very fast pace.

zenchopper said:

Thanks so much for your input.

I will replace the solenoid with a bolt before I buy a new $20 coil...

this morning I started it and it still was surging, I manually closed the choke slowly and all it does is stall, The revs did not increase at all as i slowly closed the choke...

I removed the coil and tested it , the resistance values seem OK I have no Manufacturer spec But both Spark lead to metal body and Kill switch to spark lead were exactly the same so I assume that's right
and the kill to the body was 1kohm. I saw a video of someone testing one and it was the same shape and appearance so When he said 1kohm was right I think thats ok...The old briggs one off the old engine measures the same, different mount so couldn't successfully try it out.

Ill try to start it tonight in the dark and see if I can see any spark jumping.

So when i eliminate the fuel solenoid as the issue it's pointing to a coil that tests ok but at operating temperature fails...???

I may just foot the $20 to rule it out...

All very frustrating while watching the grass grow and a very fast pace.

Click to expand...

A lot of what you see on boob tube is nothing more than shaved monkeys performing.
The gear you need to test the primary runs to around $ 20,000 down here.
Most of the single wire coils can not be tested with a multimeter and in fact a lot of cheap ones will bugger the chip.
You can test the coils used with points using a multimeter.

SOLVED

SOLVED ! ! !


FIRST
I removed the solenoid and blocked the hole with a piece of rubber and a clamp. ( I couldn't find a bolt with the same thread) Still did the same stall and surge routine.
replaced the solenoid.

I called the place that sells the 17.5HP XP 620, Not where I bought it from, but their competitor.

The place I actually got it from are arrogant and rude, I won't name them, and I will never go back there again.

... actually just another place that assumes that everyone is a two bit amateur and never think that in a million years that you may actually have more experience than them.

But the really nice knowledgeable people who respect you as an equal human I will name because they always go above and beyond their duty to help you with your dumb questions.
Thanks :thumbsup:Jonno and Johno:thumbsup:

I asked if he sells many replacement coils which he said, "yes".

I asked, "is it because they fail?"

He said that they sell a lot because people wire them incorrectly and fry them he couldn't recall a case where he sold a coil which had failed. That was nice to hear.

OK so I wasn't going to order the coil.

We went through a few other possibilities, all things pretty much discussed here.

Then he said that a few times they made the fuel inlet hole a bit bigger with a 5/16th drill bit.

Maybe I misheard him about the 5/16" bit. I didn't really go into great detail of what he was saying. I thought that I'll work it out when I look at it.
So the 5/16" thing might be an entirely different mod.

Before I did anything I started it up and as expected it was surging. As I have the air cleaner box off (filter still attaches) and the cowl off, I had easy access to the choke and throttle
so I very very slowly closed the choke and I got it to stablise for a few seconds. I then did it again, then after three times I was sure it wasn't chance.
.
.

I pulled off the carb again
.
.


.
.
.
saw that the inlet has a JET in it?
So I removed the inlet elbow.
I made the jet a little bigger with a 1.4mm drill bit
You can't quite see the jet hole in the pic but I only made it a little larger
of course, Blew it out with air.
.
.
.

.
.
.
Then in the hole, where the inlet elbow is pressed into, I could see what looked like a black piece of foam.
I got a tiny bit of wire to see if it was a filter or just dirt.

IT WAS DIRT

I blowered it out, and discovered there is a tiny metal mesh grille in there WT ?
,
,
,



Assembled and Works Awesome
.........................................WOO HOOO

I am sort of happy, it was a very frustrating but rewarding journey.

You could say a sweet and sour victory.

This year I am defiantly going to put a blower, nitro, roller cam and rockers on this Chinese Engine and go to the yearly mower races and whip their racist arses....

A mechanic would have charged you for the coil,

because, when it didn't fix the problem and not being able to return electrical components,

would have just put it on your bill and then charged you to clean the carby, check the valve clearances,
drain your fuel tank, new spark plug and oil and filter etc etc just to cover the 5 hours it took to work it out.

I know because the mechanic who had a shop next to me used to do it all the time....

..sometimes mechanics are not honest because they plainly can not afford to be honest 100% of the time, you'd go broke.

Someone has to pay for the wasted hours.....

bertsmobile1 said:

A lot of what you see on boob tube is nothing more than shaved monkeys performing.

Click to expand...

TARYL is no Shaved Monkey...he is my hero and brains trust for mower repairs and I will defend him, because I love him

zenchopper said:

My mind is thinking there is a stray bit of debris somewhere in the carb that blocks and unblocks randomly which I have missed..

Click to expand...

I was right but can't understand why the WD 40 didn't at least smooth it out a little when sprayed int the air cleaner manifold.
Light sprays did nothing, a heavy spray made it rich stall.

I should get some "start ya bastard" for future diagnosis.

Also closing the choke only smoothed it out the very last time I tried it. All other attempts just made it stall.
Maybe I wasn't closing the choke slowly enough to find the sweet spot.

zenchopper said:

A mechanic would have charged you for the coil,

because, when it didn't fix the problem and not being able to return electrical components,

would have just put it on your bill and then charged you to clean the carby, check the valve clearances,
drain your fuel tank, new spark plug and oil and filter etc etc just to cover the 5 hours it took to work it out.

I know because the mechanic who had a shop next to me used to do it all the time....

..sometimes mechanics are not honest because they plainly can not afford to be honest 100% of the time, you'd go broke.

Someone has to pay for the wasted hours.....

Click to expand...

Well I for one do not do that.
And FWIW charge out scheduled hours not actual hours.
And no not a millionaire but I can sleep at night and have an ever growing list of very loyal customer.

zenchopper said:

TARYL is no Shaved Monkey...he is my hero and brains trust for mower repairs and I will defend him, because I love him
View attachment 40910View attachment 40910View attachment 40910View attachment 40910View attachment 40910View attachment 40910View attachment 40910View attachment 40910View attachment 40910View attachment 40910View attachment 40910View attachment 40910

Click to expand...

And I did not mention Taryl at all.
He is one of the people I suggest people look at.
However he can be just as wrong as any body else, myself included.
The Hall Effect trigger module was designed & patiented by Atom Industries ( google them if you must ) who were one of my customers in a previous life.
As such I did learn a few things about Hall Effect Triggers and most will give a false reading from a resistance test.
Thus the comment stands.
You test the coil by removing the kill wire.
Regardless of weather the primary , secondary or trigger is at fault, apart from reconnecting a broken wire or replaceing a shotring plug cap, they can not be repaired so it is a case of it works or it gets replaced.

In the first response you were given the options including insufficient fuel and in the second you were given a method to isolate it to electrical or Fuel problems.

Glad you got it sorted, however have a good look at the debris.
There should never be anything in the fuel lines apart from fuel so have a good think about where that plug of dirt could have come from cause good chance there will be more of it just waiting to ruin your day.
Once fuel elbows are pulled out they have a bad habit of falling so usually get replaced out so keep an eye on it

For kicks and giggles I would Amazon search your make/model to check cost of a new carburetor. Often the Chinese aftermarket engines which you have employ a decent carburetor but with poor machine tolerances and materials (rubber). I would suspect that in disassembly something in the main jet emulsion tube was damaged or o-ring is not sealing. May be worth your time and aggravation to throw on a "should be good" out of the box carb. I have replaced similar ones for $20

bertsmobile1 said:

Well I for one do not do that.
And FWIW charge out scheduled hours not actual hours.
And no not a millionaire but I can sleep at night and have an ever growing list of very loyal customer.

Click to expand...

Thanks for all your input and I appreciate that you didn't take my taunts personally. You're a top bloke.

Glad you do honest work. After a career change from Smash repairs, I made myself into a sound engineer and music producer.

The amount of time I work on other people's music to make it as close to what I perceive as perfect, is probably double of what I get paid for,
But I love making music so much that it doesn't really matter. I started charging "per song" rather than hourly rates, that way I can achieve
great results that don't rely on the financial status of the customer. I got so tired of "it's good enough because we cant afford to make it better".
I no longer wanted to have music out there with my name on it that was a compromise that made me look like an amateur.

That mechanic that was next door to my Smash repair shop was a BMC service agent so most of his customers
had deep pockets and yachts. Once a 40 series Jag came in which had rouge adjustable shock absorbers, he ordered 4 new shockers at $4k, then realised it didn't fix it. He could not return them because they were classified as an electrical component. After calls to England they found out it was a $40 part that caused the issue and you guessed it...All charged to the customer plus labour...

Thanks for your advice.
I think the crap in the inlet could have been from the original red 20 year old Briggs filter that I later replaced...
But I will change the fuel lines in case it is some stray bits of rubber from crappy fuel lines..But on visual inspection, they look and feel ok. Small price for insurance.

The rubber on the float needle looks band new , no swelling of gumminess.

IN the recording studio, if a channel is not working I start at the beginning, the microphone , then the lead, then the preamp, then the software...a linear path of diagnosis..

Next time I'm going to vigilantly check the path from start to finish...but I now I know to look under the elbow as part of the flow.

Thanks again

Be careful with that elbow.
On Brigg engines they are a shrink fit so once remover can not be replaces and pulled out a few times the carb is toast.
Most technical things are the same, just a matter of working through them in a logical order.
I started in metals, morphed into transport and post GFC ended up repairing mower.
There is no way any one can insult me. although a few have given it a good go.

Go out & have fun.
Johno & Johno are reasonable to work with.
They have been importing parts for decades and most of what they bring in is reasonable quality.