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Hi,
I have a problem with my LX176 tractor. I took it out a couple of days ago and cut my lawn for about an hour or so. I was almost done when the tractor began to sputter and then shut off. I thought I was out of gas but that wasn't the case. I started it up again and it seemed ok, but I decided to take it back to the garage anyway. It died again about a minute later on the way back, but again it started right back up. It got progressively worse as I limped back to the garage. I messed with it a bit and found that it will turn on and run smoothly "as long as i don't release the brake"! I tried this a number of times and as soon as I start letting the brake out the tractor starts to shut off. If I push the brake in the engine continues to run. Can anyone tell me where I should be concentrating my efforts in trying to fix this problem??? Thanks goodness I got most of my lawn mowed before this happened.
I started it up again yesterday. It ran fine. I didn't move it, I just let it sit there and run at about 1/3 throttle for about 30 minutes with the brake off (disengaged). There wasn't any problem and the motor ran smoothly. I've been looking around trying to find out how the brake actually works. All of the drawings I've seen appear to show that the brake linkage goes directly into the Hydrostatic box. I looked in the User Manual and it states (emphatically) to NOT change the transmission fluid ("To prevent Contamination") which is supposed to be 10w30 oil. When I look at the transmission filler neck the oil appears to be black, which has me concerned. Does anyone think or know whether this could be the problem with the motor shutting down when the brake is released:confused2:? Should I drain and refill the transmission :confused3:???

I had something like this happen to my JD LT 166, it would run as long as i held the brake down, which is what
i have to do to start it, as soon as i would try to release/ take my foot off the brake, it would die just as if i turned of the key, turned out it was 1 of the safety switchs, there are 3 on my mower 1 on the seat, 1 on the blade clutch, and 1 on the
Brake,
not saying that this is your problem, but it sure sounds about the same

Rat

Thanks. I found the one on the seat and I've looked all over but haven't been able to find any others yet. Will keep looking though. I might have screwed up on my description of the problem making it a little mis-leading. When the problem was happening the other day, I could take my foot off of the brake and the engine would continue to run for between 5 and 15 seconds, sometimes a little longer, before stopping. If I was quick enough after hearing it start to die, I could step on the brake and the engine would pick right back up. Sorry for any confusion :ashamed:!

Look up under the mower close to where the brake linkage is, some where there you should see a awitch that the linkage works, it dont know your mower it it has a Manual blade ingauge of elect Clutch, My LT 166 has a manual clutch of such, if i remember right the safty switch on my brake is under the right hand floor board, it might be that you have a wire going to one of these saftey switchs rubbing some where

Rat

Well, I think I've got it running again. I jumpered the seat switch and that had no effect. Looked but couldn't find another switch for the brake. Mower is probably close to 20 years old and things might have changed. I took the skins off, and power washed most everything, especially the hydro. Finally found the brake switch - It's mounted on the Hydro. I could only get to the plug, the actuator is inside the Hydro, it seemed to be working ok. I could not ignore the color of the Hydro (10W30) fluid and decided to replace it. I let it drain over night and started the refilling process the next day. Put everything back together to take it for a spin. IT WOULDN'T MOVE! My heart sanK! I started searching the Net looking for a good deal on a new mower. In the process I found something from a guy who rebuilt his Hydro and referenced the Tuff Torq website. I went there and after identifying what I thought was my hydro found a bunch of info, most of which I couldn't/wouldn't use, but among the info was a procedure for purging the air out of my version of the hydro after an oil change. At first I thought it wasn't going to fix my problem because nothing happened, my heart sank even further. But after about 5 minutes or so the wheels started to move. Talk about your ray of sunshine - that was mine today! I spent the next hour performing the procedure until the wheels seemed to be responsive to the pedals. I put everything back together and cut my back lawn without incident.:cloud9:

My lessons learned - Don't drain your Hydro oil unless you know which Hydro you have. Not all Hydros are supposed to be drained. Procedures for those that can be drained are DIFFERENT! Don't mess with it unless you have a clear understanding of everything that's involved, i.e. all the procedures necessary. Finally, thanks to all who offered their input in trying to help me with my problem.:thumbsup:

grenneam said:

...I took the skins off, and power washed most everything, especially the hydro. Finally found the brake switch - It's mounted on the Hydro. I could only get to the plug, the actuator is inside the Hydro, it seemed to be working ok. ...

Click to expand...

So ... this part of grenneam's old post. Seems like the no-start issue was fixed by washing it. Wait, wut?

Anyway, I'll be looking for this brake switch on my LX176 that curiously won't juice its starter "all of a sudden," and indeed, died once or twice "without provocation" sez the wife.

I'd be happy enough just to bypass it if possible. I'm not one of those guys that gets annoyed by safety features but lordy I don't wanna have to dive into the transmission to "test" or swap out an electrical switch. Really?

The other thing I semi, sorta gleaned from this post is that there's also safety switch on the electric PTO? If so, sounds like either one could be "bad" and not causing the starter to spin with the key. (Seat switch is already bypassed.)

Please advise!

This is why the JD manuals which most seem terrified to buy are worth the few extra $ JD charge for them
View attachment lx176 switches.pdf

Thus far I've been able to confirm that both fuses are OK and that the starter solenoid's relay isn't getting 12v to it.

"Extra" is definitely correct: a typical automotive service manual costs less and contains so much more information. I'd be good with $50 or so (and printed, please, not a CD!), but the prices I'm seeing instead represent a significant portion of the machine's worth. And so, Internet.

Speaking of which, thank you very much for the diagram; it confirms the location of what I'm looking for. Now that lunch if over, I'll try to reach that area.

deckeda said:

Thus far I've been able to confirm that both fuses are OK and that the starter solenoid's relay isn't getting 12v to it.

"Extra" is definitely correct: a typical automotive service manual costs less and contains so much more information. I'd be good with $50 or so (and printed, please, not a CD!), but the prices I'm seeing instead represent a significant portion of the machine's worth. And so, Internet.

Speaking of which, thank you very much for the diagram; it confirms the location of what I'm looking for. Now that lunch if over, I'll try to reach that area.

Click to expand...

Good Luck.
In a different life I used to be involved with writing technical manuals for scientific equipment
$ 20,000 in production costs to press ready would be a cheap one .
I have never seen a better written or more comprehensive manual that those made by JD.
AS for overpriced, they would be lucky to be breaking even at the price they charge.
If it saves 1 and 1 only trip to a shop that charges std industry rate then it has paid for itself.
As for being a significant percentage of the cost of the vehicle, the LX 176 was $ 4150 list in 1998 which in today's money would be around $ 6,500
When ever I turn around a JD I always include a technical manual with the mower and one of my used mowers with technical manual will go for near twice the current price of the same used JD mower.
From my point of view $ 100 for a paper copy of a book that adds $ 300 to $ 800 to the selling price is good value to me .
Even better is I include my used copy & replace it with a new one for the workshop.
Oddly enough if I have a chat to the new owners, none of them would buy a factory manual, telling me they are all worthless trash with no useful information in them and none of them tell me they bought it because I included the manuals.
The LX manual is 660 pages and weighs near 3 lbs. Don't confuse them with owners manual which tell you to take it to an authorised service dealer.
The Kohler & Kawasaki engine sections are substantially more useful than the factory Kohler & Kawasaki engines manuals, I know as I have them all.

It's interesting that my issue with the same symptoms as the OP was caused by a different part.

When thinking about it, I realized that sometime yesterday, additionally the brake pedal stopped functioning. It just met no resistance, apart from its return spring. I forgot about it until I pulled the top deck off today, when looking for the brake's safety switch.

That's when I saw a rod headed towards the front that had nothing to do with the forward or reverse motion. So that's how the brake is applied. Pressing the brake pedal did nothing to the lever on the transmission, but moving the lever by hand let me know it was kinda connected somewhere in the middle of the machine, and a large zip tie was poking underneath the deck and wiggling, so ...

There's a rod that connects the brake linkage to another piece that goes back to the transmission. I pulled the mower deck off and saw that the zip tie had been used to secure the rod to the linkage and it had slipped off, and the rod dangled.

Seems that originally it might have been secured with a circlip or similar. And the other end of the rod looked worse, not connected to anything, just resting atop a bracket that loosened the drive belt tension (maybe?) when the brake was applied. Just a guess, I don't know what other purpose it might have. There's so much metal gone, I don't know how it was connected at that end.

The bracket it met doesn't look too great, either. This is the view of the mangled end as I found it ... heavily worn and resting atop the belt idler bracket, not the other end that came part and caused the brake and starter to both cease.



I replaced the rod (and the zip tie ...) with a small bolt and nut for now. I had the brake functioning again. And now that the brake safety switch engaged, it made the starter work, too!


Thanks again. I don't mean to quibble, but I lacked the foresight to purchase the service manual more than 20 years before picking up my mower yesterday. So yes, a $100 or so cost does give me pause, when the whole machine is worth "what I paid for it," which yesterday was a lot less that $6500 or $4000 or whatever. And I realize service manuals have value, that was never in doubt. It's worth my time ask questions on Internet forums today, which didn't exist in quite the same way when my machine was new (1992).

deckeda said:

And now that the brake safety switch engaged, it made the starter work, too!

Click to expand...

Where does the rod mechanically engage the brake safety switch?

DanKC said:

Where does the rod mechanically engage the brake safety switch?

Click to expand...

From the manual which is "not worth investing in", sorry I could just not help myself.

The switch appears to reside on top of the box.

View attachment LX 172-188 brake swich.pdf

Looks like quite a mess under there.
The parts diagrams are available from the JD web site but are not as useful as one would have hoped for.
http://jdpc.deere.com/jdpc/servlet/com.deere.u90490.partscatalog.view.servlets.HomePageServlet_Alt

Looks like you are missing everything from # 18 through to # 21 .
At a guess the rod fell off and got eaten up by the deck pulleys