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My in laws 5 year old Panasonic microwave quit working, they called a local appliance repair shop to get an estimate for fixing it. They were told it was a standard $39.95 "diagnostic fee" just to get the oven over the counter to a tech, then a minimum $39.95 fee plus parts for the first half hour of "repair" plus parts, so they were looking at at least $80 when a new oven was less than twice that much. So they went and bought a new one. Next time I visited I saw the old oven in the garage and offered to check it out. Was pretty sure it was just a blown main fuse. Took it home, the outer cover was secured by seven Torx-type screws, and the screws had a small round tab in the recess which rendered a standard type Torx driver useless.

There was a label on the back, warning: "Warning, do not remove non-removable fasteners. Shock hazard" or whatever. Umm...so how does the service shop remove "non removable fasteners" :confused2:

Anyhow, I used a small pair of Vice grips to remove 5 of the screws and had to drill out the remaining two. As I thought, the main fuse was blown...50 cents for a new one and the oven was as good as new. I replaced the Torx screws with conventional Phillips head screws.

What galls me is, they intentionally design things like this so that the majority of owners needing a new fuse will have to take it to a shop to have a 50 cent part replaced. I know there is a component inside a microwave that holds a dangerous charge even when unplugged (capacitor?) but there is no reason they cannot build the device so the fuse is easily replacable under an easy to remove cover near the power cord in the back. Such poor design only encourages a throw-away society, which is what my in-laws would have done with the microwave. Any comments?

I could not agree more. A few years ago our cooker went "bang" with a puff of smoke and stopped working. We called the repair man who took three weeks to come out to inspect it (for a fee) then told us we'd have to wait for an expensive part to be shipped from Italy! When I took a look myself (I'm not an electrician) I could see a very obvious plastic connector that had come loose leaving wires hanging. I bought another one in our local hardware store for a few pence, reconnected it myself and the cooker was fine again.

Those are 'anti tamper' security screw heads... a full set of all sizes is very inexpensive and readily available...
They actually do serve a good purpose as they do keep some 'just curious' folks from hurting themselves... but more important hurting others...
Pick up a set and life is a lot easier... :smile:KennyV

In a word "liability", ours has gotten to be a "sue happy" society! Seems like everybody wants "something for nothing", so they sue the "deep pocket" companies. In return, we all pay the price in higher prices & deal with "precautions (like "tamper-free" screws, etc.). :thumbdown: :frown: ~~ grnspot110

But while choosing to live in a society we also must be aware that there are some very devious and destructive individuals out there...
Tamper proof also gives the consumer a little protection from those types... :smile:KennyV

KennyV said:

Those are 'anti tamper' security screw heads... a full set of all sizes is very inexpensive and readily available...
They actually do serve a good purpose as they do keep some 'just curious' folks from hurting themselves... but more important hurting others...
Pick up a set and life is a lot easier... :smile:KennyV

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Kenny...I have enough tools and the skills to rebuild most small engines and I have never seen what is called an "anti tamper' Torx driver set ANYWHERE. Let me rephrase my original post...why is it so difficult for the makers of the microwaves to make it simple to replace a 50 cent fuse so people can easily replace it without a headache and go to a shop, or risk injury. I gotta wonder. :confused2:

.I have enough tools and the skills to rebuild most small engines and I have never seen what is called an "anti tamper' Torx driver set ANYWHERE.



i have here are some have used them on a few things myself

That's indeed disgusting. It's a ploy made by manufacturers to make a killing out of after sales service. Their practice is totally unfriendly both to our pockets and to earth, as you imply. The word is unethical.

P.S. I no longer use microwave ovens for health reasons.

briggs said:

i have here are some have used them on a few things myself

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Hey briggs ... I have those exact sets plus this Snap-on set...
SGDTRXL70BR, Set, Screwdriver, Torx, Tamper Proof, Long, Instinct Handle, 7 pcs.
I use the less expensive sets all the time ... The snap-on $$$ very rarely ... :smile:KennyV

JDgreen said:

Kenny...

why is it so difficult for the makers of the microwaves to make it simple to replace a 50 cent fuse so people can easily replace it without a headache and go to a shop, or risk injury. I gotta wonder. :confused2:

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Over the decades more and more consumer grade equipment is NOT designed for 'DIY' service.
It has a per unit cost increase to make it so...
On consumer grade electronics, (especially things that cost little), The margin is so small that, at the manufactures level it is going to be a nonproductive product enhancement.

Overwhelmingly you will find small appliances replaced rather than repaired.

As to why anti tamper ... like I said it is more to keep the inept or devious individuals out... :smile:KennyV

I'm not sure if a microwave can be classed as part of the 'white goods' we rely on but I have often heard that these are designed to last for a certain amount of time. There's got to be a decent job opportunity for the handy people out there. Where I live it takes months and a lot of cash to get a plumber to fix a dripping tap!

Twinkle said:

I have often heard that these are designed to last for a certain amount of time.

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Twinkle...
That is basically true... because of the variable load on the magnetron, as a result of the target object(s) in the cooking cavity, there is a wide swing in the load placed on the power supply and the reflected energy back into the magnetron.
A consumer grade microwave is not built with components that can take a LOT of hours of variable abuse...

A commercial model on the other hand is engineered to be much more robust and is very serviceable, and is often rebuilt.

BUT unfortunately you can not easily mow with either design... :smile:KennyV

KennyV said:

Those are 'anti tamper' security screw heads... a full set of all sizes is very inexpensive and readily available...
They actually do serve a good purpose as they do keep some 'just curious' folks from hurting themselves... but more important hurting others...
Pick up a set and life is a lot easier... :smile:KennyV

Click to expand...

Kenny, was at Menards yesterday and found a set of Torx insert bits, Irwin brand, for only $6. THANKS for the information about them being available I have been buying carpenter and mechanics tools for 45 years but never knew about the Torx insert bits before. THANKS.

KennyV said:

Hey briggs ... I have those exact sets plus this Snap-on set...
SGDTRXL70BR, Set, Screwdriver, Torx, Tamper Proof, Long, Instinct Handle, 7 pcs.
I use the less expensive sets all the time ... The snap-on $$$ very rarely ... :smile:KennyV

Click to expand...

lol i hear you on the snap on ones i have them to and dont use them much ..I went to princess auto(same as harbor freight ) and bought the cheap ones myself lol ...If i brake one or lose one no biggie :thumbsup:

KennyV said:

Over the decades more and more consumer grade equipment is NOT designed for 'DIY' service.
It has a per unit cost increase to make it so...
On consumer grade electronics, (especially things that cost little), The margin is so small that, at the manufactures level it is going to be a nonproductive product enhancement.

Overwhelmingly you will find small appliances replaced rather than repaired.

As to why anti tamper ... like I said it is more to keep the inept or devious individuals out... :smile:KennyV

Click to expand...

yes this is so true ....But then there is guys like us that have to see whats inside and figure out whats wrong ...I have to know whats inside lol ..:confused2:

briggs said:

yes this is so true ....But then there is guys like us that have to see whats inside and figure out whats wrong ...I have to know whats inside lol ..:confused2:

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I've got a huge magnatron on a shelf in my garage. I have no idea why...but it's there. I took apart one of those huge machines a few years back to see if I could get it going. The maganatron looked so cool I could bring myself to chuck it. I think it still works.
The microwave I am using now is kept in service with a small c-clamp.
The door works a linkage that operates 2-3 microswtiches that won't allow the unit to come on with the door open and bring the light on inside and probably a few other things. Part of this linkage broke or came loose as you kind of have to slam those doors. I fixed it a few years back and just remebered it when I saw this thread.

RobertBrown said:

I've got a huge magnatron on a shelf in my garage. I have no idea why...but it's there. I took apart one of those huge machines a few years back to see if I could get it going. The maganatron looked so cool I could bring myself to chuck it. I think it still works.
The microwave I am using now is kept in service with a small c-clamp.
The door works a linkage that operates 2-3 microswtiches that won't allow the unit to come on with the door open and bring the light on inside and probably a few other things. Part of this linkage broke or came loose as you kind of have to slam those doors. I fixed it a few years back and just remebered it when I saw this thread.

Click to expand...

lots of neat tings in there eh ..my old one was good for blowing the fuse and once one of the connectors came lose the new one no probs as of yet