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Lawnflite ride on mower belt drive

#1

H

hongwu

A new drive belt was fitted to my Lawn flite ride on mower. However when drive is engaged the mower starts to smoke. Is this because the belt is too tight ? If so how do you adjust the belt,
or is it some other problem , in which case what & how do you fix it ? The mower is the UK form so access is more difficult, than the USA version.


#2

R

Rivets

More than likely belt not routed properly. Post units number so we have an idea of what unit you have.


#3

R

Rivets

More than likely belt not routed properly. Post units number so we have an idea of what unit you have.


#4

B

bertsmobile1

A belt smokes because it is moving across something that is not moving as it should so generates enough heat to burn the rubber
or
The belt is not moving around the engine pulley which is moving
The latter type of burn is terminal as it eats a chunk out of the belt which a best will shake violently or at worst will stop at the burned spot every time it comes around to the engine pulley.

Loose belts burn

Tight belts snap

so before you go any further make sure that all of the pulleys spin freely .


#5

H

hongwu

Many thanks. The belt was replaced by a local garden machinery sale & repair specialist. It went back for repair & worked for a short time then the same problem re-occurred. Ended falling out with the repairer, so trying to sort out the problem myself. Something is clearly sticking on. but unsure as to what as yet. The machine I have, unlike it's USA version is much more difficult to access the belt & drive system.


#6

B

bertsmobile1

take the deck off
Stand the mower up on its back wheels then take a couple of photos, brake on & brake off so we can see the entire belt run
Also have a good look at the belt.
It will have a scorch mark on it
A short one on the inside = loose on engine pulley
A long one, usually on one side of the V is a jambed pulley
A long one on the back is a jambed idler or belt running on the wrong side of a belt guide


#7

H

hongwu

Rivets said:
More than likely belt not routed properly. Post units number so we have an idea of what unit you have.
Click to expand...
model is a 603. Belt looks okay & was fitted by a mower repair company.


#8

H

hongwu

bertsmobile1 said:
take the deck off
Stand the mower up on its back wheels then take a couple of photos, brake on & brake off so we can see the entire belt run
Also have a good look at the belt.
It will have a scorch mark on it
A short one on the inside = loose on engine pulley
A long one, usually on one side of the V is a jammed pulley
A long one on the back is a jambed idler or belt running on the wrong side of a belt guide
Click to expand...

Attachments











#9

H

hongwu

Many thanks. Files attached as above


#10

B

bertsmobile1

Thank you
But it is not what I asked for

I don't think you quite understood the instructions
When I said remove the deck, that was the cutting deck , not the rear mudguards
stand on the back wheels meant back wheels on the ground and front wheels in the air
We need a view of the underside so we can see the both of the drive belts plus the actions of the clutch /brake pedal as it tensions and allows the front belt to go slack.
We also need to be able to see the rear belt tension arm and springs
And we need them in a single frame so we can follow the path of the belt & see the position of the springs
IT is not anything special, just a rear catcher model so apart from the rear discharge chute is no different to a side discharge or mulching mower
Also Rivets asked for the model number which is on a decal under the seat
IT should start with 13 , then he can access the MTD tech site and get the appropriate parts diagram
When you take the photos try to leave the camera on some thing solid so it does not shake.
When you have the photos, open them in what ever photo editing app you have and resize them to be 12" along the longest edge and change the resolution to 72 dpi
The belt you have photograped in pictures 1, 3 & 4 is the blade belt, not the drive belt
The drive belts are above the deck belts and hard to see with the cutting deck on .

Sorry to be a pain but we are thousands of miles away and have nothing to work with other than what you type & photograph


#11

H

hongwu

Thanks. Apologies. I thought I could get a good picture of the belt condition by removing the cover plate. The model nmbr is 13AC458C611 & the mower a model type 603 & unlike the USA version ready access appears more difficult. Weather here currently not too good, but once clears up can try take off the blade & cover & try then to remove the cutting deck. Am I correct you do not also require the removal of the top decking ? If it is of any help, when the engine is running, the blade appears to be revolving even with the blade lowering lever in top position.


#12

B

bertsmobile1

Remove the hing pin on the rear chute at the deck
It should be held in with a split pin and I change then to R clips to make life easy
Then do the same with the 2 lift arms each side
From memory the split pins are on the inside where they are impossible to get a pair of pliers on
They get swapped for R clips for the same reason
Do one side , push the deck away from you while pulling th lift arms towards you
Do the other side the same way
You now slide the deck forward, remove the belt & disconnect the engagement mechanism.
Some are cables & some are rods .
Now you can raise the deck lift lever to the highest position and slide the deck out to the right side ( sitting on the mower )
Take photos every step of the way so you can get it back together
I slide some long 2 x 4's under the deck before I start so the deck can slide out easily .


#13

R

Rivets

Using the model number you supplied, I see that your unit uses a variable pulley drive system. One thing that the service techs have learned about these systems is you need to replace both drive belts at the the same time. We’ve learned that these systems are not the easiest ones to work on. After removing the deck, following Bert’s instructions, you’ll have better access to the system. Removing and reinstalling both belts takes an experienced tech at least an hour, so path accordingly and take your patience pill. I’ve been trying to locate an owners manual, which should have a routing diagram, but have been unable to do so. We’re hear to answer any more questions you may have.


#14

H

hongwu

Rivets said:
Using the model number you supplied, I see that your unit uses a variable pulley drive system. One thing that the service techs have learned about these systems is you need to replace both drive belts at the the same time. We’ve learned that these systems are not the easiest ones to work on. After removing the deck, following Bert’s instructions, you’ll have better access to the system. Removing and reinstalling both belts takes an experienced tech at least an hour, so path accordingly and take your patience pill. I’ve been trying to locate an owners manual, which should have a routing diagram, but have been unable to do so. We’re hear to answer any more questions you may have.
Click to expand...
Many thanks. Yes not an easy machine to work with, which perhaps explains the problems we have been facing since new belts were fitted by a local mower service company. The belts appeared to look okay, so anticipate either they were not adjusted properly ,or another as yet unidentified problem. As is, starting is not too easy & the battery requires constant recharging.


#15

H

hongwu

hongwu said:
Many thanks. Yes not an easy machine to work with, which perhaps explains the problems we have been facing since new belts were fitted by a local mower service company. The belts appeared to look okay, so anticipate either they were not adjusted properly ,or another as yet unidentified problem. As is, starting is not too easy & the battery requires constant recharging.
Click to expand...
there appear to be 3 belts on this machine


#16

R

Rivets

Yes, one for deck drive and two for unit drive.


#17

C

CraigH

Where abouts in the UK are you?


#18

R

Rivets

I’m in the USA and Bert is in Australia


#19

C

CraigH

I meant the op, lol.
I'm in the UK and if he's close enough, I'd happily go and help take the deck off a d see if I could help.


#20

B

bertsmobile1

And the other thing I forgot to mention is these systems use a special, unique to MTD belt shape.
I usually fit Stens OEM spec belts which are 1/2 the price of MTD genuine belts and supposed to be the same shape .
Lots of people ( and unfortunately mower shops ) fit standard B section belts which just do not work well & prolonged use wrecks the variable pulley which is expensive .
The system basically works like a tug -o-war between the top ( rear ) and bottom ( front belt ).
Which ever one is the tighter forces the sliding middle plate on the variable pulleyaway thus reducing the diameter that belt travels around ( pulley spins faster ) and increases the diameter the other belt recks around ( belt moves faster ) .
This is in effect the came thing as stepped pullies used on drills & lathes and it helps to visualise what is happening .
The rear pulley has a fixed spring so fixed tension and the front pulley you vary the tension with the pedal .
Now to further complicate this set up , on some models the position of the variable pully is fixed ( easy ) and on others the variable pulley moves ( gets really complicated )
I hope this explains what we need to see all of it at once


#21

G

Gord Baker

There are Deck belts which run the blades and Drive belt which move the machine. I suspect that one or more of your Deck Spindles has seized or the wrong length belt. Your photos seem to show the Deck Belt. The Drive belts is routed along with 2 Idler pulleys. It may appear to be backwards on the pulleys or one of those pulleys is seized. Unlikely. Make sure everything that needs to turn will turn. Your manual should show belt routing.


#22

S

smallenginerepairs

hongwu said:
A new drive belt was fitted to my Lawn flite ride on mower. However when drive is engaged the mower starts to smoke. Is this because the belt is too tight ? If so how do you adjust the belt,
or is it some other problem , in which case what & how do you fix it ? The mower is the UK form so access is more difficult, than the USA version.
Click to expand...
Check the routing of the belt. Many times an idler pulley or even the main pulley on the bottom of the engine, there will be a bolt or bar next to the pulley to keep the belt from jumping off the pulley. If it's in a place that's hard to see, you might have put the belt on the outside of the bolt or bar that keeps the belt on the pulley. If you have this situation, when you turn your pto, your belt will ride on the bolt or bar, instead of the pulley, and you will smoke a belt in a hurry !! Make sure your belt is on all of your pulleys. I hope this helps .


#23

K

kjonxx

a closup of rear drive pic would help, belt route looks odd but too small to tell


#24

C

Cajun power

troubleshooting:

1. make sure the belt is actually the right size...right length, correct width. take the old belt and set it next to new belt...they should be identical. Sometimes you order something and the wrong item is shipped..it happens.
2. if the old belt was worn out, maybe it is because there was a reason it was worn out?...look for a locked up belt tensioner, or a spindle that is locked up or bad corrosion that has made the bearings worn out and hard to rotate. Also look for any debris, like something wrapped around spindles, pulleys, pto's. or sticks and branches...or rope or plastic baggies, ...
3. on one of my mowers, the blade belt tensioner pulley has a spring and it would frequently put off. The first time I reattached the spring to the tensioner, I assumed it went into a nearby hole. And it did, but the spring had to be oriented in just a certain way into that hole so it would not touch the belt, so the belt was smoking off the belt tensioner spring. Make sure the blade belt tensioner spring is attached correctly and is not interfering with the blade belt.


#25

B

barny57

hongwu said:
A new drive belt was fitted to my Lawn flite ride on mower. However when drive is engaged the mower starts to smoke. Is this because the belt is too tight ? If so how do you adjust the belt,
or is it some other problem , in which case what & how do you fix it ? The mower is the UK form so access is more difficult, than the USA version.
Click to expand...


#26

B

barny57

hongwu said:
A new drive belt was fitted to my Lawn flite ride on mower. However when drive is engaged the mower starts to smoke. Is this because the belt is too tight ? If so how do you adjust the belt,
or is it some other problem , in which case what & how do you fix it ? The mower is the UK form so access is more difficult, than the USA version.
Click to expand...
Either the wrong belt, or you got it on the spring tension or wrong or you got a deck bearing out


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