Export thread

how do you remove flywheel on Honda H2113HDA rider mower

#1

R

Ron Beard

I have a starter that is not engaging-just spinning. I wanted to take the starter off and replace, but one of the bolts is under the flywheel, so I tried to remove the flywheel. I cannot break it loose. First question-there are four phillip head screws that are countersunk and screw through the outside diameter edge of the flywheel and are located 90 degrees from each other. What are these? Do I need to take these out and what do they hold inside? Second question-I inserted a 3/8" rod into a hole located next to one of the above phillip screws, and put a 3' cheater on my ratchet and only succeeded in bending the rod. OK-the rod was a Harbor Freight pry bar that I cut the end off, so probably not the hardest steel, but still, how do I break the flywheel loose? Or is there another way to fix this starter without taking the flywheel off?


#2

M

motoman

I can't help you with the Honda specifics, but learned long ago that breaker bars must be RIGID. The best I have is the Craftsman with an "H" beam confiuration . You can put pipe extensions over it and do real damage. Another thread in this forum recently recommended "good" air hammers.

Also sounds like you're having trouble holding the flywheel during nut loosening. Either take the time to make yourself a holding tool (this forum) or go the air hammer route.


#3

R

Ron Beard

Thanks. My compressor is down and I have no air tools, but an impact would be better than my piece of pipe. I will check out the forum on holding tools. Thanks for taking the time to reply.


#4

lawn mower fanatic

lawn mower fanatic

Ron Beard said:
Thanks. My compressor is down and I have no air tools, but an impact would be better than my piece of pipe. I will check out the forum on holding tools. Thanks for taking the time to reply.
Click to expand...

WELCOME TO LMF!
If you want some specifics for Honda mowers, there is a user than works at Honda and might reply on Monday.
Good luck! :smile:


#5

bwdbrn1

bwdbrn1

I haven't worked on anything that large, but I do know that the shop manuals for the smaller walk behind engines cautions against prying them, or striking them with a hammer.


#6

R

Ron Beard

Yes, I don't want to hit it with a hammer either. I have the type of impact tool that you strike with a hammer to break something loose, but I was afraid to use that type of impact. Does anyone know if a hammer impact is a valid option? The flywheel is steel, not aluminum, so I can be a little rougher than normal, but don't want to push what little luck I do have.


#7

bwdbrn1

bwdbrn1

There's two recommended methods for removing the flywheels on the walk behinds I've worked on. One involves using a harmonic puller. Like these.
harmonic puller - Google Search

The flywheel is on an electric start engine, and the flywheel has the teeth around the outer edge to engage the starter. It might be a lot like yours. The flywheel has threaded holes around the PTO. Thread the right sized bolts into them, then pulling pressure is applied by the center bolt in the puller. This kind of puller is used so as not to damage the teeth for the starter.


The other method is for rope start engines that don't have the toothed flywheel. That method involves using a two jawed jaw puller. The jaws go under the edges of the flywheel, and again the upward force is applied by the center bolt of the puller against the PTO shaft.
http://www.google.com/search?client=safari&rls=en&q=jaw+puller&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8

I don't believe I'd go banging on anything just yet. I can only imagine how much it would cost to replace your flywheel. Worse yet, you bugger up the end of the PTO! It might pay to pick up a copy of the shop manual for your mower to learn the recommended method. Or, wait an maybe the Honda guy will be around to answer your question.


#8

R

Ron Beard

Thanks, but I am not that far yet. I have both type of gear pullers, and the top is threaded for a harmonic pulley. My first problem (and I am sure there will be more) is I cannot break the nut loose on top of the flywheel so I can pull the flywheel off. I have not been able to break it using a three foot cheater pipe, do not think I should resort to a hammer struck impact tool yet, and have no pneumatic access outside of loading it up and hauling a dead mower somewhere. Does anyone know the best way to hold the flywheel to try to break it loose, or does anyone know what the four phillip screws on the outside edges actually screw into? I looked at a schematic, but could not see anything. I am taking this as a personal challenge that I can get this thing off, which probably means I will end up breaking something.


#9

bwdbrn1

bwdbrn1

O.K., I've got a better picture now. I have used the hammer blow impact tool that you're talking about on these things myself. Like this?
http://www.hayabusa.org/forum/attac...-fused-starter-clutch-cover-impact-driver.jpg

I'm going to guess the nut has a flange on the side that comes into contact with the flywheel.

So the flywheel is turning as you try to turn the nut. One trick I've used for holding them in place is to take the spark plug out, turn the engine to get the piston down a ways, then thread a length of nylon rope into the cylinder. In fact, that method is described in the shop manual for the Kawasaki engine on a John Deere 14SB mower I have for doing just that sort of thing. Then as you turn the flywheel, the piston moves up against the rope and it cushions the piston while preventing it from turning past Top Dead Center. Then you might go ahead and use the impact tool on it. Just remember, as I tend to forget sometimes depending on my orientation to the nut, lefty loosey.

So far as the phillips screws, I've no idea what they really hold. The same sort of thing is on the flywheels I've dealt with, and they have nothing to do with holding the flywheel onto the engine.


#10

bwdbrn1

bwdbrn1

Looking at this parts diagram, parts 1, 2 and 6 are all held on with the nut, #12. The key #13, is what makes the connection between the flywheel and the end of the crankshaft, and insures proper timing of the ignition. Get the nut off, 1 and 2 should just lift off, then you can put your puller onto the flywheel and get it off. If it's like the ones I've removed, it'll seem like your putting a lot of pressure on the puller, and the flywheel will just sort of pops. Sometimes I swear I just broke something.

http://www.boats.net/images/diagrams/honda/147710/ILLUST/7714E/1900A.png

Those phillips screws you're talking about are in that little square looking part on the side of the flywheel.. Those have to do with the magnets that make your spark through the coils. They don't come off.


#11

M

motoman

Ron, look at the thread in this forum for diy tool simple , I made it to remove my Intek fly nut of "1-1/4" ,(tightening @ 125 ft lbs). I know you know breaking torque is a lot more.

The tool you make should have a handle as long as your breaker handle . I have found that rather than arm and shoulder input two hand squeeze at end of the long lever arms works best to break loose. Don't get frustrated. We're all pulling with you. (Rigid Rigid, NO flex, No flex) :drink:


#12

R

Ron Beard

I never heard of the rope trick, but I like it. I will have to get me some rope tomorrow and give that one a go. On the phillip screws, I see the magnet on the one screw, but there are four other ones spaced 90 degrees from each other on the same surface as the magnet. I can see what they are once I get the flywheel off -I was just wondering out of curiosity what they were. This is a great site, I appreciate all the support everyone is giving me.

I work at a manufacturing facility building class 7+8 trucks (semi and large straight trucks). We have all type of tricks to assemble them, and unless you have five foot long arms, some of the stuff would be almost impossible to work on out in the field. EPA laws have really made diesel engines more difficult-it can take up to two hours to change a fan belt. Anyway, I have not tried it yet, but I really like the rope trip.


#13

R

Ron Beard

How do I get to the DIY tool forum portion? I did a search on flywheel tool, but did not come up with anything. I am new on this site, so don't know my way around it yet. Thank you.


#14

lawn mower fanatic

lawn mower fanatic

Ron Beard said:
How do I get to the DIY tool forum portion? I did a search on flywheel tool, but did not come up with anything. I am new on this site, so don't know my way around it yet. Thank you.
Click to expand...

Motoman will have to confirm this, but I think this is the thread you are looking for: http://www.lawnmowerforum.com/small-engine-mower-repair/10143-two-way-tractor-tool-simple-diy.html.
The key to doing a search on here is changing the settings down at the bottom so it searches by relevance, not one of the other options. See picture:
arrow.gif searching.jpg

Tell me if you think that is the thread you were looking for! :smile:


#15

R

Ron Beard

Thanks-another good idea-I can get my 4" grinder out, put a cutting wheel in it, and hack something out like that. I would have not figured out the "relevance" search thing, so appreciate that too. It seems to me if I was doing a search, that would be relevant enough, but I am too old to think like a computer.


#16

M

motoman

lawn mower fanatic , thanks,I was about to upload the pics for ron

Re rope trick... I have used it on my chainsaw and trimmer ,but the torques were low. I hope compression of the rope stops enough for you to direct all the breaking torque into the Honda.


#17

M

motoman

Ron Beard said:
Thanks-another good idea-I can get my 4" grinder out, put a cutting wheel in it, and hack something out like that. I would have not figured out the "relevance" search thing, so appreciate that too. It seems to me if I was doing a search, that would be relevant enough, but I am too old to think like a computer.
Click to expand...

don't feel bad . the only way I can review my old threads is to go to tools, my subscribed threads:confused2:


#18

bwdbrn1

bwdbrn1

Those other screws might be to magnets on the inside of the flywheel that work the charging and lighting coils.


#19

R

Ron Beard

magnets make sense. I started to back out one of the phillip screws, but it was backing out hard like there was a spring or something giving tension to it so I stopped and retightened. I wondered about the torque and rope thing, but it is worth a try-definitely sounds good for smaller engines.


#20

C

chance123

motoman said:
Ron, look at the thread in this forum for diy tool simple

Where is that thread?
Click to expand...


#21

lawn mower fanatic

lawn mower fanatic

chance123 said:
Where is that thread?
Click to expand...

Right here: http://www.lawnmowerforum.com/small-engine-mower-repair/10143-two-way-tractor-tool-simple-diy.html. I posted a link to it in post #14 of this thread.


#22

robert@honda

robert@honda

To remove and install the flywheel, three special special tools are required.

A strap wrench is necessary to hold the flywheel so the large 16mm nut can be removed.
Once the large nut is off, a flywheel puller (3-bolt) is needed to pull the flywheel off the crankshaft. When installing the flywheel back, use a torque wrench set to 79.5~87.0 lb.ft and the strap wrench to properly tighten the 16mm nut.

flywheelrampr_zpsd828851c.jpg


#23

M

motoman

robert, way to go...just what ron needed

ron, looks like the diy tool would need a spacer to clear the fins...


#24

R

Ron Beard

WOW!! I want to thank everyone for their help. I am going to try to rope trick and if that does not work, see if I can locate where to buy a strap wrench. I have tried other forums before for appliances, cars, etc and had little success. This is an absolutely great site and I truly appreciate everyone's help.


#25

R

Ron Beard

I want to thank everyone for their help. I could not find a strap wrench, so ended up making one. I thought I would pass on how I made the wrench in hopes it may help someone else. (I also stuck about 3' of nylon rope into the piston chamber, just to be on the safe side).
This is how I made my strap wrench. I took a 42" piece of 1-1/2" inch wide nylon strap (almost too short-48" would be better), looped each end, and stuck the ends through the slot of a 1/2" socket that has a slot cut out of the side to remove temperature sensors on heavy equipment. My socket is 7/8" so enough room for the nylon loops, but I think an auto oxygen sensor socket would also work-it is made the same concerning the slot. Usually you can borrow an oxygen sensor socket from the major auto parts stores at no charge, so it is worth a try. When I stuck the folded ends of the nylon strap through the slots, I stuck a bolt in the fold of the nylon, so the ends would not pull out, but do not know if that really helped. A regular oxygen sensor socket may not have enough room. Anyway, with the strap wrench and rope-in-the-piston-chamber, it broke loose with little effort. Again, I thank everyone for their help.


#26

S

struckus

robert@honda said:
To remove and install the flywheel, three special special tools are required.

A strap wrench is necessary to hold the flywheel so the large 16mm nut can be removed.
Once the large nut is off, a flywheel puller (3-bolt) is needed to pull the flywheel off the crankshaft. When installing the flywheel back, use a torque wrench set to 79.5~87.0 lb.ft and the strap wrench to properly tighten the 16mm nut.

flywheelrampr_zpsd828851c.jpg
Click to expand...


Can someone tell me exactly what flywheel puller (3-Bolt) to get to pull this? I keep searching and I am not sure. There seem to be many different pullers.


Footer Links 1

Top