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External Fuel Filter on a Duraforce
#1
dewguy1999
dewguy1999
External Fuel Filter on a Lawn-Boy Duraforce?
Over the last few days while looking for fuel shut-off valves I've run across forum posts (can't remember if they were here or not) that advocate installing an inline fuel filter between the shut-off valve and the carb. Various types were mentioned. Well, I ran across this in the the "E Engine Service Manual":
So is it necessary to add an inline fuel filter when there's one already built-in to the fuel tank?
Over the last few days while looking for fuel shut-off valves I've run across forum posts (can't remember if they were here or not) that advocate installing an inline fuel filter between the shut-off valve and the carb. Various types were mentioned. Well, I ran across this in the the "E Engine Service Manual":
The E engine uses a plastic fuel tank with a non-replaceable 75 micron in-tank filter screen. The filter is welded in the bottom of the tank over a sediment reservoir.
So is it necessary to add an inline fuel filter when there's one already built-in to the fuel tank?
#2
BlazNT
BlazNT
I would put a 50 micron in so I did not have to replace a carb.
#3
dewguy1999
I'm assuming that 50 micron is smaller than the 75 micron filter that's built-in. Is it common for gas to be "dirty"?
dewguy1999
I would put a 50 micron in so I did not have to replace a carb.
I'm assuming that 50 micron is smaller than the 75 micron filter that's built-in. Is it common for gas to be "dirty"?
#4
BlazNT
BlazNT
I don't really know if gas is dirtier that is used to be but I know there are more problems with carbs than before. Some carbs are cheep and some are not so I ere on the side of caution.
#5
dewguy1999
That sounds like a good idea, but looking at the 3 most common Briggs & Stratton fuel filters (or clones) that I've seen mentioned the only one that is smaller than the 75 micron internal one is the Briggs & Stratton #691035 (5065K) that's 60 microns and says it's for tractors with fuel pumps, which doesn't seem to me to be a good match for a lawnmower engine without a fuel pump.
dewguy1999
I don't really know if gas is dirtier that is used to be but I know there are more problems with carbs than before. Some carbs are cheep and some are not so I ere on the side of caution.
That sounds like a good idea, but looking at the 3 most common Briggs & Stratton fuel filters (or clones) that I've seen mentioned the only one that is smaller than the 75 micron internal one is the Briggs & Stratton #691035 (5065K) that's 60 microns and says it's for tractors with fuel pumps, which doesn't seem to me to be a good match for a lawnmower engine without a fuel pump.
#6
BlazNT
BlazNT
Well I would not do it then. If you ever have to rip out the filter then you can put an external filter on.
#7
qd-16
qd-16
I'd say the fuel shut off is more important than the inline filter. I would think One filter would be enough.....using fresh fuel and trying to avoid / eliminate ethanol in the fuel should keep you running like a top.
Since I resolved the lean surging issue on my duraforce and added a fuel shut-off nothing can stop it!
Since I resolved the lean surging issue on my duraforce and added a fuel shut-off nothing can stop it!
#8
dewguy1999
I think the internal filter is permanent and is only replaced when the gas tank is replaced.
I try to use fresh fuel, but having a small lawn and not always having to mow makes that rather difficult to achieve and it usually takes me much longer than 30-days to use 2-gallons. Until I started researching fixing my Lawn-Boy and/or new mowers I didn't even know that ethanol was a problem. How does one know if the gas they're buying has ethanol in it and in what percentage? Knock on wood my Lawn-Boy doesn't surge (I don't think it ever has) and I'm apprehensive that if I do anything to the carb it will start doing so.
dewguy1999
Well I would not do it then. If you ever have to rip out the filter then you can put an external filter on.
I think the internal filter is permanent and is only replaced when the gas tank is replaced.
I'd say the fuel shut off is more important than the inline filter. I would think One filter would be enough.....using fresh fuel and trying to avoid / eliminate ethanol in the fuel should keep you running like a top.
Since I resolved the lean surging issue on my duraforce and added a fuel shut-off nothing can stop it!
I try to use fresh fuel, but having a small lawn and not always having to mow makes that rather difficult to achieve and it usually takes me much longer than 30-days to use 2-gallons. Until I started researching fixing my Lawn-Boy and/or new mowers I didn't even know that ethanol was a problem. How does one know if the gas they're buying has ethanol in it and in what percentage? Knock on wood my Lawn-Boy doesn't surge (I don't think it ever has) and I'm apprehensive that if I do anything to the carb it will start doing so.
#9
P
Phototone
All Lawnboy 2-cycle mowers have not only a screen in the gas tank, but also a screen in the carb. Generally (on plastic carbs) this screen is slipped over the main jet in the center of the float-bowl, but on some of the metal carbs it is inside the fuel inlet nipple on the exterior of the carb. But, in any case, they have one.
As far as getting non-ethanol gas. There is a free app for the iPhone (and possibly a similar app for other brands of smartphones) called PureGas that utilizes the GPS tracking of the phone to identify your location and list the nearest gas stations offering non-ethanol fuel. My closest station offers non-ethanol Premium, and that is what I buy.
P
Phototone
I think the internal filter is permanent and is only replaced when the gas tank is replaced.
I try to use fresh fuel, but having a small lawn and not always having to mow makes that rather difficult to achieve and it usually takes me much longer than 30-days to use 2-gallons. Until I started researching fixing my Lawn-Boy and/or new mowers I didn't even know that ethanol was a problem. How does one know if the gas they're buying has ethanol in it and in what percentage? Knock on wood my Lawn-Boy doesn't surge (I don't think it ever has) and I'm apprehensive that if I do anything to the carb it will start doing so.
All Lawnboy 2-cycle mowers have not only a screen in the gas tank, but also a screen in the carb. Generally (on plastic carbs) this screen is slipped over the main jet in the center of the float-bowl, but on some of the metal carbs it is inside the fuel inlet nipple on the exterior of the carb. But, in any case, they have one.
As far as getting non-ethanol gas. There is a free app for the iPhone (and possibly a similar app for other brands of smartphones) called PureGas that utilizes the GPS tracking of the phone to identify your location and list the nearest gas stations offering non-ethanol fuel. My closest station offers non-ethanol Premium, and that is what I buy.
#10
dewguy1999
I forgot about the filter in the carb on the high speed jet/nozzle, I wonder how many micron that screen is. Believe it or not I don't have a cellphone, but I found that there's a website pure-gas.org that will do the same thing. I was surprised to see that there are only 2 stations that are local for me (but not as convenient as the BP down the street) and both are marine stations. Does that mean that all the other gas sold elsewhere has ethanol in it?
dewguy1999
All Lawnboy 2-cycle mowers have not only a screen in the gas tank, but also a screen in the carb. Generally (on plastic carbs) this screen is slipped over the main jet in the center of the float-bowl, but on some of the metal carbs it is inside the fuel inlet nipple on the exterior of the carb. But, in any case, they have one.
As far as getting non-ethanol gas. There is a free app for the iPhone (and possibly a similar app for other brands of smartphones) called PureGas that utilizes the GPS tracking of the phone to identify your location and list the nearest gas stations offering non-ethanol fuel. My closest station offers non-ethanol Premium, and that is what I buy.
I forgot about the filter in the carb on the high speed jet/nozzle, I wonder how many micron that screen is. Believe it or not I don't have a cellphone, but I found that there's a website pure-gas.org that will do the same thing. I was surprised to see that there are only 2 stations that are local for me (but not as convenient as the BP down the street) and both are marine stations. Does that mean that all the other gas sold elsewhere has ethanol in it?
#11
P
Phototone
More or less, YES, if it isn't listed on the Pure Gas website, it contains ethanol. If I were you, I would get a 5-gal. container and get enough for a few months. Without ethanol the gas lasts much longer in good condition. As you may know a great percentage of outboard motors are 2-cycle (or used to be), and smaller than car engines. These smaller engines (and this includes motorcycles) benefit greatly from non-ethanol fuel.
P
Phototone
I forgot about the filter in the carb on the high speed jet/nozzle, I wonder how many micron that screen is. Believe it or not I don't have a cellphone, but I found that there's a website pure-gas.org that will do the same thing. I was surprised to see that there are only 2 stations that are local for me (but not as convenient as the BP down the street) and both are marine stations. Does that mean that all the other gas sold elsewhere has ethanol in it?
More or less, YES, if it isn't listed on the Pure Gas website, it contains ethanol. If I were you, I would get a 5-gal. container and get enough for a few months. Without ethanol the gas lasts much longer in good condition. As you may know a great percentage of outboard motors are 2-cycle (or used to be), and smaller than car engines. These smaller engines (and this includes motorcycles) benefit greatly from non-ethanol fuel.
#12
dewguy1999
I wouldn't be able to use 5-gallons in a season, would it still be good the following season? The 2-gallon fuel mix I'm using right now I bought in May, yeah I know it's no longer fresh but I don't really have anything else I can do with it and it still starts on the 1st or 2nd pull (when I can get it to start and I'm hoping the shut-off valve will eliminate that problem).
dewguy1999
More or less, YES, if it isn't listed on the Pure Gas website, it contains ethanol. If I were you, I would get a 5-gal. container and get enough for a few months. Without ethanol the gas lasts much longer in good condition. As you may know a great percentage of outboard motors are 2-cycle (or used to be), and smaller than car engines. These smaller engines (and this includes motorcycles) benefit greatly from non-ethanol fuel.
I wouldn't be able to use 5-gallons in a season, would it still be good the following season? The 2-gallon fuel mix I'm using right now I bought in May, yeah I know it's no longer fresh but I don't really have anything else I can do with it and it still starts on the 1st or 2nd pull (when I can get it to start and I'm hoping the shut-off valve will eliminate that problem).
#13
BlazNT
BlazNT
No it just means they know that those station do not have it in one of the grades of gas they sale. Most BP's 91 or 93 does not have it.
#14
dewguy1999
In Michigan they don't require labeling at the pump and I wish they did.
dewguy1999
No it just means they know that those station do not have it in one of the grades of gas they sale. Most BP's 91 or 93 does not have it.
In Michigan they don't require labeling at the pump and I wish they did.
#15
reynoldston
reynoldston
I install a in line fuel filter on all my gas engines with a fuel line. I replace the all filters once a year, air and fuel. New filters are very cheap insurance and very easy job to replace.
#16
J
jp1961
J
jp1961
The fuel line on a Duraforce is only about 6" long (if even that long), so your options are either a fuel shutoff OR a filter (unless somebody makes a unit that's both). Being there are two filters already, I'd go with the shutoff.
Jeff
Jeff
#17
BlazNT
That is absolutely not true. No BP in Springfield Mo has ethanol in the 91 or 93 octane. It is not listed on that site. Not everything on the internet is true.
If you want your gas to last a long time put fuel stabilizer in it.
BlazNT
More or less, YES, if it isn't listed on the Pure Gas website, it contains ethanol. If I were you, I would get a 5-gal. container and get enough for a few months. Without ethanol the gas lasts much longer in good condition. As you may know a great percentage of outboard motors are 2-cycle (or used to be), and smaller than car engines. These smaller engines (and this includes motorcycles) benefit greatly from non-ethanol fuel.
That is absolutely not true. No BP in Springfield Mo has ethanol in the 91 or 93 octane. It is not listed on that site. Not everything on the internet is true.
If you want your gas to last a long time put fuel stabilizer in it.
#18
reynoldston
I guess you have me confused. You are saying it has two fuel filters already? Yes I agree it sure doesn't need a third. I guess its not for everybody but I just like a fuel filter that I can replace yearly.
reynoldston
The fuel line on a Duraforce is only about 6" long (if even that long), so your options are either a fuel shutoff OR a filter (unless somebody makes a unit that's both). Being there are two filters already, I'd go with the shutoff.
Jeff
I guess you have me confused. You are saying it has two fuel filters already? Yes I agree it sure doesn't need a third. I guess its not for everybody but I just like a fuel filter that I can replace yearly.
#19
dewguy1999
The Duraforce engines have a non-replaceable 75 micron filter built into the fuel tank and there is also a replaceable filter in the carb on the high speed jet/nozzle.
dewguy1999
I guess you have me confused. You are saying it has two fuel filters already? Yes I agree it sure doesn't need a third. I guess its not for everybody but I just like a fuel filter that I can replace yearly.
The Duraforce engines have a non-replaceable 75 micron filter built into the fuel tank and there is also a replaceable filter in the carb on the high speed jet/nozzle.
#20
Mystik2stroke
Mystik2stroke
Some people choose to leave off the internal carb filter (over main jet nozzle inside float bowl), and add an inline filter, so that if anything gets by the in-tank filter the inline filter will catch it and that is easy to change.
Otherwise you would need to take off the whole carb to access the float bowl to clean the carb internal filter. So it can make servicing easier if you set up the filters this way.
Otherwise you would need to take off the whole carb to access the float bowl to clean the carb internal filter. So it can make servicing easier if you set up the filters this way.
#21
P
Phototone
P
Phototone
Yes, it varies by state, here in Arkansas the gas pumps say "may" contain ethanol. The Pure Gas app, or the website tries to list every gas station that has at least one choice of non-ethanol fuel. For me, it is a Premium octane grade at a local Phillips 66 station. They label their pump to indicate the Premium is ethanol-free. Another nearby station sells a "pure gas" as one of their selections, which is regular grade but Ethanol free. For my use in my Lawnboy mowers and my 2-cycle weedeater and hedgetrimmer and chainsaw applications, I have never had gas "go bad" in a season. I regularly use up last seasons gas in the spring of each year in my equipment. I store gas in 2, and 5 gallon plastic fuel containers. I keep 5 gallons of straight gas, and decant into 2 gallon container with 2-cycle oil for use.
All LawnBoy mowers since at least the 1980's have had a filter screen in the gas tank, and another one in the carb. with 2 screens, I hardly think you need to add another external one.
All LawnBoy mowers since at least the 1980's have had a filter screen in the gas tank, and another one in the carb. with 2 screens, I hardly think you need to add another external one.
#22
dewguy1999
Is it common for the high speed jet/nozzle filter to become clogged? I can see where having an external, easily replaceable fuel filter would be convenient, but, the only filters I could find online that specified the micron rating and were smaller than what's in the Lawn-Boy fuel tank were made by Briggs & Stratton and said they were for tractors with fuel pumps. Since I don't really know anything about this kind of stuff I would assume that these filters wouldn't work on a gravity fed system like on the Lawn-Boy, am I wrong in that assumption?
I will probably do this next spring, but, since I'm still using the fuel from this spring and we've only got a couple of months left I think I'll continue with the BP gas (which I assume has 10% Ethanol) to finish out the season.
dewguy1999
Some people choose to leave off the internal carb filter (over main jet nozzle inside float bowl), and add an inline filter, so that if anything gets by the in-tank filter the inline filter will catch it and that is easy to change.
Otherwise you would need to take off the whole carb to access the float bowl to clean the carb internal filter. So it can make servicing easier if you set up the filters this way.
Is it common for the high speed jet/nozzle filter to become clogged? I can see where having an external, easily replaceable fuel filter would be convenient, but, the only filters I could find online that specified the micron rating and were smaller than what's in the Lawn-Boy fuel tank were made by Briggs & Stratton and said they were for tractors with fuel pumps. Since I don't really know anything about this kind of stuff I would assume that these filters wouldn't work on a gravity fed system like on the Lawn-Boy, am I wrong in that assumption?
For my use in my Lawnboy mowers and my 2-cycle weedeater and hedgetrimmer and chainsaw applications, I have never had gas "go bad" in a season. I regularly use up last seasons gas in the spring of each year in my equipment. I store gas in 2, and 5 gallon plastic fuel containers. I keep 5 gallons of straight gas, and decant into 2 gallon container with 2-cycle oil for use.
I will probably do this next spring, but, since I'm still using the fuel from this spring and we've only got a couple of months left I think I'll continue with the BP gas (which I assume has 10% Ethanol) to finish out the season.
#23
qd-16
qd-16
I experienced my first problem with ethanol last summer. I had problems with some mixed gas I was using in two of my lawnboys.....fuel had been mixed well over a month
in a plastic fuel container. Both mowers ran as if their carbs. were out of adjustment and would stall and difficult to restart, after mixing fresh fuel the problem with both
LB's disappeared. I now use a product called "Startron" mixed in my small engine fuel that removes ethanol.....works great for me!
in a plastic fuel container. Both mowers ran as if their carbs. were out of adjustment and would stall and difficult to restart, after mixing fresh fuel the problem with both
LB's disappeared. I now use a product called "Startron" mixed in my small engine fuel that removes ethanol.....works great for me!
#24
P
Phototone
Wouldn't it be better (and cheaper) to just source gas without ethanol, rather than treat ethanol "enhanced" fuel? The Pure Gas website, or app for iPhone makes it easy to find a station. I think it would be foolish to remove the filter in the carb of lawnboy mowers. Take it off, to clean it, YES, but leave it off? NO!
Also, in regards the addition of a fuel shut-off. If the needle and seat and float of a Duraforce (or any Lawnboy) carb are good, there is no need for an external fuel shut off. There won't be any seepage. Why add a part to compensate for a carb issue that should be fixed?
P
Phototone
I experienced my first problem with ethanol last summer. I had problems with some mixed gas I was using in two of my lawnboys.....fuel had been mixed well over a month
in a plastic fuel container. Both mowers ran as if their carbs. were out of adjustment and would stall and difficult to restart, after mixing fresh fuel the problem with both
LB's disappeared. I now use a product called "Startron" mixed in my small engine fuel that removes ethanol.....works great for me!
Wouldn't it be better (and cheaper) to just source gas without ethanol, rather than treat ethanol "enhanced" fuel? The Pure Gas website, or app for iPhone makes it easy to find a station. I think it would be foolish to remove the filter in the carb of lawnboy mowers. Take it off, to clean it, YES, but leave it off? NO!
Also, in regards the addition of a fuel shut-off. If the needle and seat and float of a Duraforce (or any Lawnboy) carb are good, there is no need for an external fuel shut off. There won't be any seepage. Why add a part to compensate for a carb issue that should be fixed?
#25
Mystik2stroke
For gravity LB fuel system you need to use the RED briggs "pancake" style filter(150 microns), (not the semi-clear white ones, or any that have a paper element. Those type are too restrictive for a gravity feed system).
Also the 90 degree briggs plastic inline fuel shutoff is a must to avoid flooded crankcase from a leaky carb needle valve, this should have been done at lawn boy.
Mystik2stroke
Is it common for the high speed jet/nozzle filter to become clogged? I can see where having an external, easily replaceable fuel filter would be convenient, but, the only filters I could find online that specified the micron rating and were smaller than what's in the Lawn-Boy fuel tank were made by Briggs & Stratton and said they were for tractors with fuel pumps. Since I don't really know anything about this kind of stuff I would assume that these filters wouldn't work on a gravity fed system like on the Lawn-Boy, am I wrong in that assumption?
I will probably do this next spring, but, since I'm still using the fuel from this spring and we've only got a couple of months left I think I'll continue with the BP gas (which I assume has 10% Ethanol) to finish out the season.
For gravity LB fuel system you need to use the RED briggs "pancake" style filter(150 microns), (not the semi-clear white ones, or any that have a paper element. Those type are too restrictive for a gravity feed system).
Also the 90 degree briggs plastic inline fuel shutoff is a must to avoid flooded crankcase from a leaky carb needle valve, this should have been done at lawn boy.
#26
dewguy1999
Since the Briggs & Stratton Fuel Filter 298090S (5018K) is 150 micron and the fuel tank already has a "finer" non-replaceable 75 micron filter built in how would the Briggs being used as an external do any good?
Last week I installed a new CDI as well as a new fuel hose and 90 degree shut-off valve.
dewguy1999
For gravity LB fuel system you need to use the RED briggs "pancake" style filter(150 microns), (not the semi-clear white ones, or any that have a paper element. Those type are too restrictive for a gravity feed system).
Also the 90 degree briggs plastic inline fuel shutoff is a must to avoid flooded crankcase from a leaky carb needle valve, this should have been done at lawn boy.
Since the Briggs & Stratton Fuel Filter 298090S (5018K) is 150 micron and the fuel tank already has a "finer" non-replaceable 75 micron filter built in how would the Briggs being used as an external do any good?
Last week I installed a new CDI as well as a new fuel hose and 90 degree shut-off valve.
Attachments
#27
Mystik2stroke
Hi-
The external filter acts as a backup to the in-tank filter, in case that filter was to break or come loose, you have the back up external filter, and it doesn't restrict normal fuel flow. You can remove the fuel tank with the fuel line and back flush to clean both filters as needed.
Mystik2stroke
Since the Briggs & Stratton Fuel Filter 298090S (5018K) is 150 micron and the fuel tank already has a "finer" non-replaceable 75 micron filter built in how would the Briggs being used as an external do any good?
Last week I installed a new CDI as well as a new fuel hose and 90 degree shut-off valve.
Hi-
The external filter acts as a backup to the in-tank filter, in case that filter was to break or come loose, you have the back up external filter, and it doesn't restrict normal fuel flow. You can remove the fuel tank with the fuel line and back flush to clean both filters as needed.
#28
L
LB8210
L
LB8210
I use both the filter and shut off valve on both of my 10525 mowers. And have not had any issues since they were installed. No carb flooding and no plugged jets.