Export thread

2009 Lightning BadBoy with 32 hours on it. Yes really only 32 hours.

Mowed and worked fine last time I used it, a week ago. Now when I start the engine and then pull the switch to engage the blades the engine dies like a kill switch has been tripped.

The brake is off, the handles are in centered or even I am moving forward and the engine stops immediately. Engine RPM 3300. So there should be enough power to keep it running.

How I locate and test the safety switches or better, can I bypass then to verify them.

Thank you,

Sounds like a safety switch , you'll need to bypass at least the blade engagement switch -

Thank you, can you post or PM the way to to that, please?

I imagine its still under warranty if you have one. sounds a like a problem for the dealer to me. don't start bypassing stuff if it is under warranty.
You'll either get hurt or void the warranty. or both.

It would be great if it was under warranty but itis a 2009 model.

Oh darn, somehow i read right over the 2009 part.

TH switch is under the seat
If it is a 2 pin switch then either it needs to be jumped or unpluged
If it is a 4 pin flat plug then it can not be bypassed so you buy a new one, clamp it down & plug it in
Problem goes away = bad switch
Problem stays = bad wirings & you now have a spare switch .

Here is my final post concerning this issue.

After it was all said and done. it was the battery!! Go figure!!! how could the battery cause it? Well it turns out the the PTO has to have constant 12v running thru it to keep it engaged.

I thought that I would past this on hoping that it will help others fighting the same issue.

I will say the battery was totally off of my radar!

Hardluck said:

2009 Lightning BadBoy with 32 hours on it. Yes really only 32 hours.

Mowed and worked fine last time I used it, a week ago. Now when I start the engine and then pull the switch to engage the blades the engine dies like a kill switch has been tripped.

The brake is off, the handles are in centered or even I am moving forward and the engine stops immediately. Engine RPM 3300. So there should be enough power to keep it running.

How I locate and test the safety switches or better, can I bypass then to verify them.

Thank you,

Click to expand...

I would first try to see if the brake switch is sticky by spraying with WD40, or something similar, then pushing the switch with your finger a few times. If that didn't help, I would check the switch with a multi meter. To check the switch, you would need to follow the wires or find a schematic. Another way is to disconnect the switch and try two things. One is to let it stay open (no switch connected), and the second is to close the circuit with a wire directly from on input to another. One should allow the blades to work and the other would not. That would at least verify the switch.

It was the battery. The switch needs 12 volt to stay engaged

Well I am back with the same or similar issue.
Battery is new and good.LOL

Mower set all winter , aft erht eleaf season.
Started up an ran for about 5 seconds.
I engaged the PTO...it died. Restarted ran a bout 3 seconds and engaged the PTO ..it died. Now it doesn't start or even try to start at all. The engine does turn over.
Any new ideas or ways for me to trouble shoot everything.

Tested The PTO switch , brake and lever steering stiches by engaging or disengaging each and the engine would not turn over if not n the proper position.

Seat switch appeared to work as it is not what made it die.

Thank. I need to to get running pretty quick and am about 60 miles from a dealer and not way to load or haul the mower.

HELP!!!

The seat switch is a two wire , but I can not get it unplugged. There doesn't seem to have any type of safety clasp but I have pulled with pliers on both sides if the plastic plug but i didn't want to break it.

Any idea?

The engine turns over like there may be a kill switch stuck!

Here is an update to my stupid posts.

I did get the seat switch plug unplugged, and the engine started with the jumper wire but.... as soon as I engaged the PTO the engine dies again.

How could it be several issues all at the same time. What could it be now?

Also just for the record in case I posted that it was a KOHLER engine, it is not it is a KAWASAKI 26HP

Thank you.

Look at the wiring for the PTO , from your description it dies as soon as you engage the clutch, Pull the plug off the pto and engage it again , if it kills the machine there is a short to ground from that switch and not the PTO assembly. If it kills the machine start chasing wires and see where the problem may be.

Hardluck said:

Thank you, can you post or PM the way to to that, please?

Click to expand...

You should have the manual the it came with. If, not, find one online. Mine shows all the parts and where they are located, however yours is 15 years old.

Does that have a "mow in reverse" cut out switch? Just a thought.

When will mower owners learn that there is many different mowers out there and many different ways of wiring them? We must have the equipment make and model at least. And please be aware some of us don't the time to dig your old posts just to guess what mower you currently working on.

Yes multiple failures can happen at the same time or cascade failures.

Just to give an idea here is what is currently in my small shop for repairs.

And Yes I know a Z925A has been in the shop for a long time. At least the customer has two other ZTRs that are his primaries mowers. Weather and health has delayed getting it out but it should out in a week. Nearly fully reassembled but rain is holding me off now.

And it appears the new style ignition JD is using has a high failure rate. I done found two in less than a year. This AUC18708 switch is expensive too from JD @ over $85. Anyway I ordered two this time so one be on the shelf for the next failure.

bnicol456 said:

You should have the manual the it came with. If, not, find one online. Mine shows all the parts and where they are located, however yours is 15 years old.

Click to expand...

Let me do an update,

I have been out of service (personally) since my last post. But here is my latest.

I have down loaded the lightning 2009 manual but it does not have , or I can not locate it. The PTO switch assy or fasteners that hold the plate. I have tried all of the torx and drivers that I have and nothing fits the screws. Can you get me the correct tool that I need to take of the plate that has the PTO ,deck and ignition switch on it.
Or some other way to get to it so I can test it.
The manual sucks and BAD BOY never called me back. Surprise surprise.
I have bypassed the seat switch and it starts and runs fine, like I said until I pull the PTO switch.

Just another comment from my last event like this.
The same thing but the battery was low on voltage and that prevented the PTO switch from working properly. NEW battery fixed the issue. Not the issue now, (wish it was that was an easy fix).

StarTech said:

When will mower owners learn that there is many different mowers out there and many different ways of wiring them? We must have the equipment make and model at least. And please be aware some of us don't the time to dig your old posts just to guess what mower you currently working on.

Yes multiple failures can happen at the same time or cascade failures.

Just to give an idea here is what is currently in my small shop for repairs.
View attachment 68278
And Yes I know a Z925A has been in the shop for a long time. At least the customer has two other ZTRs that are his primaries mowers. Weather and health has delayed getting it out but it should out in a week. Nearly fully reassembled but rain is holding me off now.

And it appears the new style ignition JD is using has a high failure rate. I done found two in less than a year. This AUC18708 switcNice list of broken mowers.

Click to expand...

No Badboys, Do you choose not to work on Badboys? I know they fail a lot.

bnicol456 said:

I would first try to see if the brake switch is sticky by spraying with WD40, or something similar, then pushing the switch with your finger a few times. If that didn't help, I would check the switch with a multi meter. To check the switch, you would need to follow the wires or find a schematic. Another way is to disconnect the switch and try two things. One is to let it stay open (no switch connected), and the second is to close the circuit with a wire directly from on input to another. One should allow the blades to work and the other would not. That would at least verify the switch.

Click to expand...

Just asking... how could it be the brake switch if it starts and I don't move the brake lever? It wouldn't start if the brake switch was bad... would it?

I got the pto, ignition switch cover plate off, now how do I check the switch . If continuity is OK then what?
Just to clear the ptk does engage the blades so that sho5prove that it is ok, right? Which blades on the pto switch can I jumper to test prove the ground wires?

I am not getting much help here now. Should I start a new thread or what?

BADBOY Lightning 2009. about 30 hours on the mower.
Here is my latest updates:
Seat switch, PTO, ignition switch and all 4 relays removed cleaned and tested. All good and working.
Seat switch tested ...good. (you can even hear it clicking when engaged and disengaged)
PTO switch tested .. good (you can even hear it clicking when engaged and disengaged)

Mower started and ran several times for short intervals. finally got it running for a couple minutes never good enough to engage the PTO , mostly had to have the choke full or half to keep it running. Only ran about 1/2 or 2/3 speed. Finally would not start until it sat with the ignition on (you can hear what seems to be the fuel pump running) for a minute or so. Then it would start and run poorly again. never good enough to even get it put of the garage to be able to have room to work it very well.
I looked at the fuel filter but of course you can't tell anything by looking. I am trying to locate the fuel shut of valve so that I can change the fuel filter but can not find one. Can't find one in the manual either (really poor manual).
Called Badboy and emailed them again and never get any replies.

Any and all advise or comments are appreciated, I am mid 70 years old and limited in my physical (and probably mental) abilities) but am really needing to get this thing running. Thanks again.

If a safety was giving you problems the machine wouldn't even turn over , click or anything else so you don't have a safety switch problem in my opinion,
The PTO switch needs 12 volts on one of the wires , use a test light and hook it up to ground and touch off on each terminal of the switch with the Key on. Which ever one makes your light come on will be your power lead, now engage your PTO with the key on and see which other terminal makes your light come on, follow that wire to the PTO and make sure it's not shorted to ground , this will give you some direction.

You're not going to get any help from Bad boy, from your description you have a carburator problem or fuel problem , if it will only run while choked , it's starving for fuel, change out your fuel filter and pull the line off at the fuel pump and see if it's flowing freely. Most machines do not have electric fuel pumps , take a few pics and attach so the smart guys can look at it.

Not really anything to take pictures of except a mower.
I wondered about the electrical pump but there is a slight sound of something running downby the engine. I am trying to find out how to turn the fuel off in order to change the filter.
I do t want to drain over 5 gallons if gas in a garage.

Most don't have shut off valves , Just pull the supply line and stick a plug of some sort in it , best to get an in line valve and install it at this point for later. Have it ready with hose clamps and you should be good to go

Thank you, I try to find a gas shutoff valve. Is walmart a good place to get one?

Auto parts will have a " small engine" area and will have something for you

Thank you very much

Update,

I managed to get the mower started and added enough gas treatment for it to run well enought and I mowed te lawn, Yahoo.!!!

home depot, lowes or Wal-Mart did not have any fuel shutoff valves other than !/4" which are to small.

Ill look again when I get the opportunity,

mower started again mowed about 1/3 of the lawn and then died and only started and ran at about 1/4 throttle not enough to run the blades but did gt it back in the garage.

Back to the drawing board.. Looks like maybe a load of bad gas.

Drained both tanks add new gas. Ran about 10 mins then the same issue, starts for a second then dies. With full choke. Stuck out in yard now. If someone steals it I how they can keep it running!

I am posting the noise that comes from the engine area with the ignition on. Not start mode yes on.
In real life it is not the loud. It is actually pretty we quite.
Any ideas as to what it could be,,? It stops after 10 or so seconds.
Could it be a water pump,,?
I couldn't post the audio file . It is a "acc" file.

Any ideas as to how I post it or what file to change it to if possible,.

If you still are having problems try removing the gas cap. Vent may be clogged causing engine to run for short intervals or with choke on.

Thank you, I finally got it running, have mowed the lawn one time , Ran out of gas and thought the problem was back , but thank goodness it just need some fuel.
Solution!!! Not exactly sure, drain fuel tanks and flushed drained again, cleaned carb and changed the fuel filter.

Good to hear.

Well, Bad news. The mower has quit again. I have several questions.
I have changed the filter and fuel again, the fuel runs freely from the hose and filter but changed them anyway. How can I check the fuel pump? Is there a way to test it? I can blow thru the fuel filters with very little restriction so I really think that they were ok. To recap it only runs for about 10 minutes or so at first start up. Then will not stay running until it sets and cools for about half a hour then the same cycle.
I really appreciate your comments and help. I really think it must be a fuel problem but I am stumped !

Well you can pull the fuel pump discharge side and crank on the mower , it should spit fuel out with each pulse of the engine will spinning over,

Thank you,

having not start and run issues again. Changed fuel, filters checked all safety switches?

How do I check the ignition module? Or does the mower have an ignition module or just ignition colis?

im having a similar issue but mine runs fine but as soon as i pull on PTO in 14 seconds it will bog down to 2700rpm and stay that way for 8 seconds then ramp back up to full power for 14 seconds then bog down again for 8 seconds

krackerjack9 said:

im having a similar issue but mine runs fine but as soon as i pull on PTO in 14 seconds it will bog down to 2700rpm and stay that way for 8 seconds then ramp back up to full power for 14 seconds then bog down again for 8 seconds

Click to expand...

When you find put what causes this please post as it may help with issues me or others are having/

its been at dealer for 2 weeks so far they keep telling me still trying to find the problem

5 pages in and I still don't know what engine you have. Lots of talk about 30 minutes old which doesn't mean anything.

Could be a twin running on one cyl that dies when you hit the PTO.

This has been sitting. Most likely a carb or fuel delivery issue.

they told me they put new plugs new coils, new fuel lines, said the carb is fine, adjusted the valves ,, and it still does it. Kawasaki FR 731v engine not even the dealer can figure it out

krackerjack9 said:

they told me they put new plugs new coils, new fuel lines, said the carb is fine, adjusted the valves ,, and it still does it. Kawasaki FR 731v engine not even the dealer can figure it out

Click to expand...

sounds a lot like my issues, it is probably something very simple and over looked but I can't figure it out.

Well sounds to me like the dealer has no idea about what they are doing or are telling you porkies
IF it stops dead it has to be in the ignition system or the electrical system
Some thing simple like a burned out diode or dead short in the coil or if it has a control module ( not familiar with yur mower ) a bad module or plug .

Sometimes you have to go with a gut feeling. I had Kawasaki V twin in the shop back in the Spring that would die engaging the deck. The idiot ignition jig said it was firing the plug so ignition should had been fine. Well after even thru having the pulling of the PITA muffler to check valve rockers and push rods, I still had a dying engine. So I when thru the whole safety system still nothing found wrong. Even the new plug had burned the factory plating off the tip indicating it was firing.

Well as a gut feeling I said to myself has to be the ignition coil so I installed a new Kawasaki coil. Fired the engine up and tested. Sure enough it was failing under compression fuel load. When I look over the coil I could see the epoxy was separating from the outside housing of the coil and that moisture was entering the coil pack.

Just shows that something our tests can give us a false indication. This where experience kicks in. Some of us small shop gets more experience than the big boys as we see more abused equipment.