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Craftsman Rider Battery ( RANT )

#1

O

OldDiyer

OK so I have a 2002 Craftsman LTZ1000 tractor that I purchased new and has been a good unit for me so I am pleased with it. So heres my rant, I have an auto repair (and owner) backround in 2016 the battery gave up the ghost so I went to Auto Zone and purchased their Gold Duralast U1-3 battery, 6 years into that battery it dies and after checking it has a bad cell thought that seems odd but last Oct. needed another battery so went back to them for another Gold Duralast U1-3 battery put it in and things were fine till a week ago. Went to use the tractor and the battery was dead thought that maybe I left the key on or something so charged it and got the lawn done the tractor sat for about a week or so went to use it and its dead again. Charged again and did a 12 volt test light draw test nothing, did an amp parisetic draw test and nothing let it sit for 2 days and its dead again. I removed the battery and it is a sealed battery but you can get the cover off so I checked and it had a dead cell.
Needless to say I was not happy because these batterys no matter where you get them only have a 90 day replacement warrenty whats with that? I did not go back to Auto Zone but got another battery at Walmart I know that they may not be the best but I tried Auto Zones best and that dumped on me also.
I guess my rant is the original battery lasted 14 years, second battery 6 years and now 8 months. I don't misuse my tractor and use it year around for summer grass and in winter I have a blower for it and change oil with the seasons. I guess if I didn't take care of the battery or the tractor I would understand. Thanks for listening!


#2

R

Rivets

Have you checked the charging system on the tractor to see if it is working properly and you are getting a full charge while using?


#3

sgkent

sgkent

what Rivets said. I might add, I bought an autozone battery for my VW bus about 10 years ago, it was weak in 2 years. We occasionally use the bus but it is garaged and I put the charger on it frequently to keep it topped off. Replaced it with Interstate and that lasted almost 10 years before testing weaker. The current Duracell battery came from Sam's Club. I think Duracell are made by East Penn / Deka. I think Clarios makes Autozone batteries, Clarios is a successor to Johnson Controls. I believe Napa batteries are also East Penn / Deka. Just spent the last hour researching sealed AGM backup batteries for a Dell server rack - sort of like 8 motorcycle batteries in a case. The ones we finally landed on are made in Vietnam. There were no American or German made replacements that I could find. i suspect lots of these smaller wet cell batteries are whomever is making them at the time.


#4

StarTech

StarTech

Battery Plus Bulbs was giving a 6 month warranty on their batteries. It was 12 months before Covid.


But battery quality has taken a dump since Covid hit.


#5

B

bertsmobile1

I am not familiar with that brand
However I did make batteries for several year in my immediate post grad years
When I starter battery grid plates were 2mm thick and you could hang your washing on them
When I left they were 0,5mm thick & broke under their own weight if not handled carefully .
When this became a problem for things like off-road vehicles, pleasure craft & motorcycles their grids went up to 0.75mm to 1mm and the alloy was changed because of repeated failures,
However the car batteries remained at 0,5mm because car suspension gave them an easy life.
Mower batteries get a rough life as mowers have no suspension & a crude electrical system.
So unless that is a mower battery , it could just be a case of wrong battery for the job.
If your yard is quite rough and you mow hard then you may need to go to a "motorsport" battery .
These have thicker plates, stronger glue in the paste and fiberglass spacers between plates for added support .
The absolute best battery for a mower is the spiral cell battery Toro used for a while that is still available , but take your big wallet with you.
Check the battery terminals for AC when the engine is running.
Electrically this kills batteries faster than a direct short .
Cranking continiously for over a minute or so can also cause the grid plates to warp on cheaper batteries .


#6

O

OldDiyer

Even thou the battery did have that dead cell after reading all the replys thought it would be a good idea to check the charging system just in case something was amiss being that the tractor is 21 years old. These are the results of the testing. Battery voltage at start of test 12.6 volts,disconnected leads at regulator has 12.6 volt coming in from ignition switch, next checked the AC volts coming from alternator 28.6 volts, checked DC volts out of regulator after starting and it was 16.2 volts but after running a bit it went to 14.8 volts turning on lights for a bit it came up to 16.1 than dropped back to 14 9 volts. So with this testing I believe the charging system is good so guess I just got a bum battery. Not only that but remembering a question I asked about a while back a bungee cord did the trick to start the tractor without a helper. ;););) So again THANK YOU every one for the replies and also the idea to look at the charging system as well.


#7

B

bertsmobile1

Did you test the DC output for AC ?
This happens when the rectifier is faulty
Most cheap meters will show 1/2 the AC voltage if you measure AC while on the DC setting .


#8

O

OldDiyer

Bert, The meter I own has AC and DC volt scales so when I checked the 2 wire connector from the alternator I was in AC and got the 28.6 AC volts. And than I back probed the red single connector from the regulator to battery and got the 16.2 but it went to 14.8 after just a few minutes I didn't wait much longer because I figured I was good with the reading i got. I did watch a few videos just to get the idea on how to check this on a lawn tractor they were all pretty much the same by the way they did it so thought that it may be correct way to go about it.


#9

R

Rivets

Looks like you have a CV492 Kohler engine in your unit. That being said Kohler engines that size should have an AC voltage output of 35+ VAC. I’ve attached a service manual for your engine which has a very good procedure for testing the charging system. https://www.mymowerparts.com/pdf/Ko...13-CV14-CV15-CV16-CV460-CV465-CV490-CV495.pdf


#10

O

OldDiyer

I do not have the Kohler engine it is a Briggs 21.5 hp I do have the service manual for my engine.


#11

R

Rivets

Sorry, but when I looked up a 2002 LTZ1000, it came up as a Kohler engine.


#12

B

bertsmobile1

So how do you know the rectifier is in fact converting the AC to DC if you do not check for AC on the DC circuit ?


#13

O

OldDiyer

Rivets, No problem I didn't list all the numbers when I posted because I didn't think the help from you people would send me down the charging system check because of the dead battery cell I have all the numbers to post if needed but just didn't do it for this post Sorry.
Bert, I guess I'm not sure how to get the AC volts from the rectifier. How would I do this to get that AC check on the 12 volt wire???


#14

R

Rivets

May this manual will be of some help. https://www.briggsandstratton.com/c...a/en_us/Files/FAQs/alternator_replacement.pdf


#15

O

OldDiyer

Rivets, been doing some shed clean up but took a brake to check out your post, Man thank you for this Manual I for sure am keeping it for future use. I just flipped thru a few pages, and you bet it will be a lot of help and I'll be reading some of that testing info for sure. Again Thanks
Just looked up that shunt tool guess I won't be getting one of those !!!!!


#16

R

Rivets

If you have the ability and experience, they can be made.


#17

L

LMPPLUS

OldDiyer said:
OK so I have a 2002 Craftsman LTZ1000 tractor that I purchased new and has been a good unit for me so I am pleased with it. So heres my rant, I have an auto repair (and owner) backround in 2016 the battery gave up the ghost so I went to Auto Zone and purchased their Gold Duralast U1-3 battery, 6 years into that battery it dies and after checking it has a bad cell thought that seems odd but last Oct. needed another battery so went back to them for another Gold Duralast U1-3 battery put it in and things were fine till a week ago. Went to use the tractor and the battery was dead thought that maybe I left the key on or something so charged it and got the lawn done the tractor sat for about a week or so went to use it and its dead again. Charged again and did a 12 volt test light draw test nothing, did an amp parisetic draw test and nothing let it sit for 2 days and its dead again. I removed the battery and it is a sealed battery but you can get the cover off so I checked and it had a dead cell.
Needless to say I was not happy because these batterys no matter where you get them only have a 90 day replacement warrenty whats with that? I did not go back to Auto Zone but got another battery at Walmart I know that they may not be the best but I tried Auto Zones best and that dumped on me also.
I guess my rant is the original battery lasted 14 years, second battery 6 years and now 8 months. I don't misuse my tractor and use it year around for summer grass and in winter I have a blower for it and change oil with the seasons. I guess if I didn't take care of the battery or the tractor I would understand. Thanks for listening!
Click to expand...


#18

L

LMPPLUS

OldDiyer, If you can find someone who doesn't stock there batteries with acid in them while on the shelf they will last longer.


#19

I-Mow

I-Mow

If i get 5 years out of a U1 battery im happy. more that 5 years and its a bonus.


#20

J

Joed756

bertsmobile1 said:
I am not familiar with that brand
However I did make batteries for several year in my immediate post grad years
When I starter battery grid plates were 2mm thick and you could hang your washing on them
When I left they were 0,5mm thick & broke under their own weight if not handled carefully .
When this became a problem for things like off-road vehicles, pleasure craft & motorcycles their grids went up to 0.75mm to 1mm and the alloy was changed because of repeated failures,
However the car batteries remained at 0,5mm because car suspension gave them an easy life.
Mower batteries get a rough life as mowers have no suspension & a crude electrical system.
So unless that is a mower battery , it could just be a case of wrong battery for the job.
If your yard is quite rough and you mow hard then you may need to go to a "motorsport" battery .
These have thicker plates, stronger glue in the paste and fiberglass spacers between plates for added support .
The absolute best battery for a mower is the spiral cell battery Toro used for a while that is still available , but take your big wallet with you.
Check the battery terminals for AC when the engine is running.
Electrically this kills batteries faster than a direct short .
Cranking continiously for over a minute or so can also cause the grid plates to warp on cheaper batteries .
Click to expand...
A thick foam pad under the battery would cushion it against bumps and bruises.


#21

J

Joed756

bertsmobile1 said:
I am not familiar with that brand
However I did make batteries for several year in my immediate post grad years
When I starter battery grid plates were 2mm thick and you could hang your washing on them
When I left they were 0,5mm thick & broke under their own weight if not handled carefully .
When this became a problem for things like off-road vehicles, pleasure craft & motorcycles their grids went up to 0.75mm to 1mm and the alloy was changed because of repeated failures,
However the car batteries remained at 0,5mm because car suspension gave them an easy life.
Mower batteries get a rough life as mowers have no suspension & a crude electrical system.
So unless that is a mower battery , it could just be a case of wrong battery for the job.
If your yard is quite rough and you mow hard then you may need to go to a "motorsport" battery .
These have thicker plates, stronger glue in the paste and fiberglass spacers between plates for added support .
The absolute best battery for a mower is the spiral cell battery Toro used for a while that is still available , but take your big wallet with you.
Check the battery terminals for AC when the engine is running.
Electrically this kills batteries faster than a direct short .
Cranking continiously for over a minute or so can also cause the grid plates to warp on cheaper batteries .
Click to expand...
A thick foam pad under the battery would cushion it against bumps and bruises.


#22

J

jearlc

OldDiyer said:
OK so I have a 2002 Craftsman LTZ1000 tractor that I purchased new and has been a good unit for me so I am pleased with it. So heres my rant, I have an auto repair (and owner) backround in 2016 the battery gave up the ghost so I went to Auto Zone and purchased their Gold Duralast U1-3 battery, 6 years into that battery it dies and after checking it has a bad cell thought that seems odd but last Oct. needed another battery so went back to them for another Gold Duralast U1-3 battery put it in and things were fine till a week ago. Went to use the tractor and the battery was dead thought that maybe I left the key on or something so charged it and got the lawn done the tractor sat for about a week or so went to use it and its dead again. Charged again and did a 12 volt test light draw test nothing, did an amp parisetic draw test and nothing let it sit for 2 days and its dead again. I removed the battery and it is a sealed battery but you can get the cover off so I checked and it had a dead cell.
Needless to say I was not happy because these batterys no matter where you get them only have a 90 day replacement warrenty whats with that? I did not go back to Auto Zone but got another battery at Walmart I know that they may not be the best but I tried Auto Zones best and that dumped on me also.
I guess my rant is the original battery lasted 14 years, second battery 6 years and now 8 months. I don't misuse my tractor and use it year around for summer grass and in winter I have a blower for it and change oil with the seasons. I guess if I didn't take care of the battery or the tractor I would understand. Thanks for listening!
Click to expand...
Walmart Batters have a 1 year return warranty.


#23

M

mcspeed

My Kubota ZT mower killed two dura last batteries in two years. I had parasitic drain so put a disconnect switch on it. Went with a walmart battery with a current date code and it is still working after 3 years. Also run a trickle charger on it during the off season.


#24

F

Forest#2

you say:
Just looked up that shunt tool guess I won't be getting one of those !!!!!

I do not use or even like shunt tools.

A more user friendly Fast way to check DC AMPS is to use a clamp on DC ammeter. I have couple different brands that goes to 400 amps DC and is Auto scale.

I can read from very low amps for parasitic drain to 400 amps to test a starter amps load.
If you piddle around doing your own electrical troubleshooting of Auto, Lawn tractors, etc. the DC clamp is a no brainer.
Not many DMM's will read high DC AMPS so shop carefully.

AND testing charging amps is a more reliable test of a charging system rather than checking volts.


#25

I-Mow

I-Mow

Ive used John Deere Stron Box batteries for years. JD claims they are the best on the market being built to handle vibratoration and a general rough life. Hype? I don't know. I receiently had a battery fail in a machine I purchased used several years ago. It was 10 years old. about double what ive beed getting on my Stron Box batteries. The failed one was made by Exide and was a U1-3. I found a U1-3 at Autozone and saves a few $. I dont know the manafacture it wasnt marked and the soore emplouees didn't know either. I'll see if its any better.


#26

T

TobyU

Simple fact is they don't make batteries the way they used to. They are all pretty much junk. Anything over 2 to 3 years is on borrowed time.
In fact, if you Google it they will tell you that the average lifespan of an automotive car battery is just less than 4 years. That's pathetic. I have had car batteries last 15 years many times but the new one seem to be junk.

Stop buying those expensive duralast batteries. Just buy whatever cranking amp you need it has a start around 155 and go all the way up to 3:45 or so. You can always put a large one in if you get a good price on it but don't put a 155 where a mower had a 245 or something like that as you will lose cranking power and capacity.
I think interstate makes probably the best ones still on the market but it's not worth it. Just buy whatever is on sale for under $29.99..
You will occasionally find that for 1999 but they're almost always the low cranking amp 155 ones. You can almost always get a higher cranium for between 29.99and 36.99.


#27

B

bertsmobile1

TobyU said:
Simple fact is they don't make batteries the way they used to. They are all pretty much junk. Anything over 2 to 3 years is on borrowed time.
In fact, if you Google it they will tell you that the average lifespan of an automotive car battery is just less than 4 years. That's pathetic. I have had car batteries last 15 years many times but the new one seem to be junk.

Stop buying those expensive duralast batteries. Just buy whatever cranking amp you need it has a start around 155 and go all the way up to 3:45 or so. You can always put a large one in if you get a good price on it but don't put a 155 where a mower had a 245 or something like that as you will lose cranking power and capacity.
I think interstate makes probably the best ones still on the market but it's not worth it. Just buy whatever is on sale for under $29.99..
You will occasionally find that for 1999 but they're almost always the low cranking amp 155 ones. You can almost always get a higher cranium for between 29.99and 36.99.
Click to expand...
For the reasons stated back in reply # 5
The car makers only want to pay for a battery that will just outlast the warranty period.
I know this because we made special batteries for all of the car makers to fit in their vehicles that had extended warranties & government vehicles that are on a 6 year lease so they got batteries that would last 6 years most of the time .
All of the other mugs got a 3 year battery


#28

O

OldDiyer

Just getting back to my original testing, I did have time to finish up my testing as many recommended and found that my unit is putting out 6.6 amps after it was running for a while so according to the specs in the manual that Rivets put me on to, I should be good to go. Thanks again to all the help from everyone.
Rivets, Thanks again for the manual link I did save it so have it for future use.
Bert, Thanks for pushing the amp checking as well as volts.


#29

T

TobyU

bertsmobile1 said:
For the reasons stated back in reply # 5
The car makers only want to pay for a battery that will just outlast the warranty period.
I know this because we made special batteries for all of the car makers to fit in their vehicles that had extended warranties & government vehicles that are on a 6 year lease so they got batteries that would last 6 years most of the time .
All of the other mugs got a 3 year battery
Click to expand...
Yes, I have had many people tell me over the past 10 years or so that the battery manufacturers basically make a battery to whatever price point you want. You want a $50 battery here's a $50 battery quality. You want a $85 battery here's a higher quality. You want $125 battery here's the quality that goes with that.

This is nothing new either. I used to laugh all the time at the AC Delco freedom batteries with little green eye on them they had a 36-month warranty all throughout the 80s and early 90s.
It was almost like clockwork that when it hit 36 months old your battery would would fail in the next 2 months.
Of course they all had a nice bright green indicator saying they were fine!
Lol


#30

T

TobyU

TobyU said:
Yes, I have had many people tell me over the past 10 years or so that the battery manufacturers basically make a battery to whatever price point you want. You want a $50 battery here's a $50 battery quality. You want a $85 battery here's a higher quality. You want $125 battery here's the quality that goes with that.

This is nothing new either. I used to laugh all the time at the AC Delco freedom batteries with little green eye on them they had a 36-month warranty all throughout the 80s and early 90s.
It was almost like clockwork that when it hit 36 months old your battery would would fail in the next 2 months.
Of course they all had a nice bright green indicator saying they were fine!
Lol
Click to expand...
I forgot to mention that I think most things are that way today. There's two things involved with their planning. They want it to last at least through the warranty. And they don't want to be too much better or too much worse than the competition.

Either way would be a problem. If it's too much worse eventually people would learn to buy the competing brand because they lasted longer but if it's too much better they are shooting themselves in the foot for selling more items.

Everything has just been watered down in quality to a subpar, mediocre level that I have little faith in ever improving.


#31

B

Born2Mow

Try a a battery disconnect, as found on Amazon and other sources.

AZ49b6Al.jpg


Your battery is being sucked dead by an electrical fault. But this can ONLY occur if you leave the battery connected in the circuit. This simple device completely disconnects the battery from whatever your electrical fault is.

Now you may ALSO have a blown regulator which is only sending 1/2 charge or No charge to the battery. Or, you might also have a low-level electrical load (like lights or ignition ON all the time) that is pulling the battery down between mowing sessions. That needs to be checked out.

When you use a battery disconnect, your battery ONLY gets charged... NEVER discharged. They have also ended winter trickle charging for me.


#32

B

bertsmobile1

OK Toby, it goes like his
Batteries are made by machines
On the new ( in 1974) line there was no people it was fully automated and slashed 85% off the assembly cost
The new plate casting machine knocked 75% off the materials cost , cut the reject rate down to under 20%
Down side was these two machines cost over $ 9,000,000 by the time they were handed over to us .
The good side was together they could make 10 times as many batteries / day as the old hand line.
But the faster the machines worked the more less than perfect batteries ended up on the end of the line
It was never set up to make "bad" batteries , always set up to make premium batteries in the plate size being used .
SO what happened to all of the less than perfect batteries ?
They got the stickers for the supermarket brands put on the cases.
So the difference between the $ 10 battery & the $ 100 battery is simply the $ 10 battery failed some of the quality control tests .
What muddies the waters was K-Mart was the biggest customer and if everything was working properly then there were no K-Mart grade batteries so they would fill the order with Motocraft or GM batteries .
From cold the grid casting machine took an hour or 2 before more than 95% of the plates were perfect and that is around 500 batteries worth of grids
So they would be hand sorted and the "acceptable" ones got the off road grade paste on them and set aside for cheap house brand batteries .
Similar story for the assembly machine the first hundred or so would always be dubious so we would load the cheapie brand cases in the machine and run it till we got to 95% perfects then switch over to the premium grade cases ( case thickness was different and of course the colour of the tops were different.
The batteries for the auto makers got less paste than the premium batteries that went to battery shops & auto electricians .

The take away from this is
A premium battery should always be a premium battery but because their sales volume is low they will always be stale so require a proper charge before use.
Failing to do this can half their service life.
A cheap brnd of battery could be a higher quality battery with cheapie stickers on it or a real dud battery , it is a lucky dip according to what the battery factory has in stock at the time


#33

R

rdedrick

Batteries are not what they used to be that's for sure. Get a battery maintainer with a de-sulphating function. Also Amazon sells a de-sulphater that you can connect to your battery. A few people feel they don't work because they work slowly. Everyone wants results. A person I mow for pulled his battery that was dead and left it on the bench. I told him I would put a charger on it. My topdon battery tester rated it at 10% life last fall. I left it on a trickle charger for a month but it didn't improve. I connected a de-sulphtor to it for most of the winter. It's now rated at 100% health and fully charged. Many trickle chargers now have this function built in.


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