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Can't find 30W oil anywhere in my area, or on line.

#1

A

Alex Ethridge

I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.


#2

O

Ocean909

Walmart and a few other places sell briggs & straton 30w in 48oz jugs. Its not usually with the car oil though, its usually with the outdoor supplies.


#3

M

MParr

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
All SAE 30 HD passenger car oils are about the same. If you want to use a SAE 30 HD oil, get a jug of Shell Rotella T1 from Walmart. The pricier oils will be Briggs and Stratton, Kohler, Kawasaki, and etc.


#4

Scrubcadet10

Scrubcadet10

Use Kawasaki KTech, it's formulated for air cooled small engines and runs $5.90 a quart at my John Deere dealer.


#5

Tiger Small Engine

Tiger Small Engine

Scrubcadet10 said:
Use Kawasaki KTech, it's formulated for air cooled small engines and runs $5.90 a quart at my John Deere dealer.
Click to expand...
SAE 10W-30 is all you need. Oh boy, not another oil debate.


#6

V

VegetiveSteam

Amazon has Castrol HD 30W but me thinks it will be hard to find someone willing to pay what they are asking.


#7

A

Alex Ethridge

Thanks to everyone.

I found Pennzoil 30W on e-bay for a reasonable price and ordered three quarts.

As for Briggs branded, Kawasaki, etc., I don't have confidence in those. Oil is just a sideline for them, AND they sell it in smaller packages at higher prices.


#8

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

Tiger Small Engine said:
Oh boy, not another oil debate.
Click to expand...
🤣
Easier to achieve world peace than get a consensus on the "best" oil.


#9

Fish

Fish


Lol, this is the link to 30w on Walmart.com!


#10

grumpyunk

grumpyunk

The SuperTech may not be as good as some national brands. Well, you can do your changes on shorter intervals if you feel it does not provide adequate longevity. Checking the links, $10 for a quart of Pennzoil is a bit much for me. The Walmart links are less pricey at least right now. I cannot understand $40 for a gallon of 30W, no matter the brand.
I'd use the SuperTech as it meets the standards specified. These machines are not in the same class as a 1911 Harley so should not need more than the manufacturer required. To each their own as likely no one will agree with my comment. I use SuperTech 30 non-detergent in my B&S branded china compressor. Lots better than the muck that was in there when I got it.


#11

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

I wonder how many guys here are old enough to remember working on engines before detergent oils? Friend of mine decided to run 10w 40 Castrol racing oil because he thought it was the best. Only difference was the racing oil wasn't detergent. In 3k miles engine sludge up and clogged oil passages and trashed the engine.


#12

I

ILENGINE

The early K series Kohler engines ran non detergent because the oil dipper would cause foaming with detergent oil. Or that was the thinking.


#13

I

ILENGINE

Alex Ethridge said:
Thanks to everyone.

I found Pennzoil 30W on e-bay for a reasonable price and ordered three quarts.

As for Briggs branded, Kawasaki, etc., I don't have confidence in those. Oil is just a sideline for them, AND they sell it in smaller packages at higher prices.
Click to expand...
But the Briggs, Kawasaki, Kohler, Honda small engine oils have a high zinc content because of the higher operating temps of the air cooled engines,which auto oils don't contain.


#14

S

slomo

Been running SuperTech for decades now, zero issues. It's not like the recipe for SAE 30 has all of a sudden changed. The current blend is SG rated. Full of zinc ZDDP nonsense. It's even blended for off highway use. Perfect for lawn mowers. It's cheap and available at every wallymart all over the country.

So this "independent lab test", where are all the locked up engines from this sub-standard oil? Haven't heard of any locked up mower engines from SuperTech. Please show us some evidence for all to see on here. Flat cam lobes, rings worn down and warped blocks. 🍿


#15

M

MParr

ILENGINE said:
But the Briggs, Kawasaki, Kohler, Honda small engine oils have a high zinc content because of the higher operating temps of the air cooled engines,which auto oils don't contain.
Click to expand...
This ☝️
Also, HDEO (diesel oil) contains higher zinc and phosphorus than passenger car engine oil. Those zinc and phosphorus levels are being reduced in HDEO oils. That’s a result of EPA mandates of diesel particulate filters, regeneration, and some catalysts. If you like running HDEO oils in your small engines, check the product data sheets for zinc and phosphorus content.
A small engine oil is going to perform well in air cooled engines. It’s formulated for just such a purpose.


#16

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

🍿scrubcadet's oil is better than your oil 🔪🥊


#17

R

Rivets

I can remember 30W non-detergent oil and still keep 2-3 quart available at all times. Why? If you ever work on air compressors, when changing compressor oil you need to use non-detergent oil.


#18

Scrubcadet10

Scrubcadet10

Tiger Small Engine said:
SAE 10W-30 is all you need. Oh boy, not another oil debate.
Click to expand...
They sell 10w30, SAE30,10W40 etc. it's cheaper than most quarts of 30 weight i can get from part stores.


#19

Scrubcadet10

Scrubcadet10

Hammermechanicman said:
🍿scrubcadet's oil is better than your oil 🔪🥊
Click to expand...
YOU BETCHA!


#20

M

MParr

Scrubcadet10 said:
They sell 10w30, SAE30,10W40 etc. it's cheaper than most quarts of 30 weight i can get from part stores.
Click to expand...
I never thought of checking the price of oil at the John Deere dealer. I go right by a JD dealer at least three times a week.


#21

Z

zrxkawboy

Alex Ethridge said:
As for Briggs branded, Kawasaki, etc., I don't have confidence in those. Oil is just a sideline for them
Click to expand...
They certainly don't blend their own oils. They simply contract with one of the big blenders.


#22

Scrubcadet10

Scrubcadet10

zrxkawboy said:
They certainly don't blend their own oils. They simply contract with one of the big blenders.
Click to expand...
Kawasaki Ktech is blended by Citgo. Really it just has a higher amount of zinc than Auto oils.


#23

C

Chris from Ontario

TSC carries it up here in the Great White North. I need it for a few of my older machines so I always have a few quarts on hand.


#24

M

Mezman

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
Oddly enough, dollar general sells it. Surely there's one in a small town near you or 5 miles away in any direction.


#25

V

Vic bellan

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
Go for Amsoil, you'll never look back


#26

T

three8

grumpyunk said:
The SuperTech may not be as good as some national brands. Well, you can do your changes on shorter intervals if you feel it does not provide adequate longevity. Checking the links, $10 for a quart of Pennzoil is a bit much for me. The Walmart links are less pricey at least right now. I cannot understand $40 for a gallon of 30W, no matter the brand.
I'd use the SuperTech as it meets the standards specified. These machines are not in the same class as a 1911 Harley so should not need more than the manufacturer required. To each their own as likely no one will agree with my comment. I use SuperTech 30 non-detergent in my B&S branded china compressor. Lots better than the muck that was in there when I got it.
Click to expand...
I believe SuperTech is manufacatured by Valvoline


#27

J

jromeo1

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
Amsoil makes a 5W-30 and 10W-30 small engine oil specifically designed for small 4-stroke power equipment including mowers. This is what the spec says for both:

Use 5W-30 Synthetic Small-Engine Oil in small engines found in (not limited to) snowblowers, generators, power washers and other equipment that requires SAE 30 or 5W-30 motor oil, including those made by Briggs & Stratton,* Honda,* Kohler,* Champion,* Generac,* Toro,* Ariens,* Troy Bilt,* John Deere,* MTD* and Husqvarna.

Use 10W-30 Synthetic Small-Engine Oil in small engines found in (not limited to) mowers (zero-turn, riding, stand-on, push), generators, power washers and other equipment that requires SAE 30 or 10W-30 motor oil, including those made by Briggs & Stratton, Honda, Kubota,* Kawasaki,* Kohler, Tecumseh,* Robin,* Onan,* Wisconsin,* Powertrain,* Yanmar,* Linamar* and Vanguard.*

So I just want to say that you should NOT be using a car oil for your mower. Two reasons.
1. Automobile engines are water-cooled. Mowers are air-cooled and get a lot hotter. The addidtives in small engine oils are designed to counter these high temps.
2. Car oils have no zinc because zinc will contaminate the catalytic converter. But, you need the protection of zinc in a small engine due to the higher compression (serves as a cushion against metal-to-metal wear).
I do not care if you use Amsoil or not - there are other small engine oils out there, but be smart about what you put in your $20,000 machine!


#28

tgzzzz

tgzzzz

I love oil threads! Do it on the grass and keep it slippery.


#29

S

sessman55

Kinetix oil is a high-zinc oil formulated for air cooled engines since they run at higher temperatures than auto engines which are liquid cooled.


#30

F

Freddie21

Meet the manufacture's oil specs and anything else may be wasted money. People think the more clear the oil, the better. Not true. Many costly additives go into making it clear. I run any full synthetic oil that meets the engines specs. Synthetic oil withstands much higher temperatures. Keep it clean and full, I've never had a lubrication related issue. Want to say a couple dollars, use the blend.


#31

R

rustygaff

I use Mobil 1 10-30 in my Briggs powered Ferris ZT.


#32

F

Franz47

1. The oils specs are the important point. Check the API S* (or ACEA) specification requirement of the engine manufacturer.
2. Buy anything which is API S* or better, covering the SAE 30 viscosity range, either a simple SAE 30 or SAE 10W-40 or whatsoever having the 30 within its range.
3. Earlier I also used to buy extra lawn mower engine SAE 30 oil bottles. Nowadays I take the oil from my 20 liter can for my cars for the lawn mowers also. It is an API SL oil SAE 5W-40. The price/liter is lower than the price of the "lawn mower oil".
4. Commercially sold "lawnmower" oils are e.g. Liquimoly API SJ, CASTROL Garden, 4T 151B50 is API SJ, MANNOL SAE 30 4-Takt Agro is API SL, Motoröl MOBIL GARDEN 4T SAE 30 is even only API SG. So you probably have an oil with higher specs already at home for your cars which probably is cheaper and also is suitable for lawn mowers engines.


#33

G

gshell

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
Try Tractor Supply....TSC ?


#34

E

eagle86801

I've used Super tech HD 30 W in my Briggs and Stratton 16.5 Hp Industrial Plus engine for as long as I can remember . I now have 698 hours on it . Never had a problem yet . You have me wondering if I should change now


#35

X

xj61975

I have been using Shell Rotella T1 for many years in my air cooled 4 stroke motors. It is no longer rated for gasoline engines but this may be related to lack of energy conservation certification and incompatibility with catalytic converters found on road vehicles. Regardless, the additive package, especially the higher zinc content, makes this oil ideal for your flat tappet air cooled engines.


#36

A

Alex Ethridge

eagle86801 said:
I've used Super tech HD 30 W in my Briggs and Stratton 16.5 Hp Industrial Plus engine for as long as I can remember . I now have 698 hours on it . Never had a problem yet . You have me wondering if I should change now
Click to expand...
I am not an oil expert and claim no degrees in chemistry or engineering so that is my disclaimer. But when it comes to oil, I have used only Castrol in all my cars and changed at 3K even though the manufacturer said every 5K. I used Castrol in one of my Siennas that I took to 348K and was losing about a pint between changes.

I read an article about 35 years ago that listed 30+ filters and graded them on their ability to filter trash and the Purolator graded third place in filtering the smallest particles. I don't remember what the first two were as they were not available in my area. I've been using Purolator PL series filters ever since. Fisk, Wix and Fram came out dead last in every test I read and since a car is the second-largest investment I've ever made, I used to read a bunch of them.

As for oil, I'll say this: You'll never see a winning race car driver with a Super Tec decal on his car.

To each his own and that's my reasoning.


#37

R

RevB

10W- 30 is 30 weight when it counts. I don't get this obsession with straight 30.


#38

A

Alex Ethridge

RevB said:
10W- 30 is 30 weight when it counts. I don't get this obsession with straight 30.
Click to expand...
Simple, it's what all the mower engine manufacturers recommend. It's not an obsession, it's just what is recommended.


#39

R

RevB

Alex Ethridge said:
Simple, it's what all the mower engine manufacturers recommend. It's not an obsession, it's just what is recommended.
Click to expand...
Again....10W-30 IS 30 weight.


#40

K

keninman1965

I have used Super Tech 5w20 synthetic in my 2012 Hyundai Accent. I am now at 356k miles and it only uses about 1/2qt every 500 to 1000 miles. I use only Wix brand filters and change my oil about every 14k to 15k miles. That's good enough reason for me to buy it Super Tech. Warren Oil makes it and many other so called name brands. For the straight 30w for my vintage tractors I use Harvest King 30w from Rural King which may be made by Citgo.


#41

A

Alex Ethridge

RevB said:
Again....10W-30 IS 30 weight.
Click to expand...
They are different or the manufacturers would not recommend one over the other.


#42

grumpyunk

grumpyunk

I kind of like the 2nd reply here:

It makes sense to me. How many old pieces of equipment are still around and running, that were always fed 'a good grade of 30W motor oil', a phrase I remember from somewhere? Which pieces of equipment are the ones that fail? Just by observation, with no statistical basis, hearsay if you will, most that die are the ones that were NOT fed oil at all, or were fed oil that was old after the first year of use. I.e., the oil was either lacking or not changed.
Very few failures are due to the design or manufacturing process, most being due to abuse by an ignorant(or lazy) owner. Of course there are exceptions.

If it calls for 30W, dump in something that is decent, and change it at reasonable intervals.

When these engines, even new ones, were designed, the extra cushion of temperature stability provided by synthetic lubricants was not even considered as the cost per quart was multiple times that of regular oil, and regular oil met the needs with a good cushion. Using synthetic is a personal choice, and is up to the individual. I *think* most failures are due to owner/operator considerations(or lack of), not the grade/brand/type of oil.
tom


#43

B

Boomer49

This is Amazon. Current as of 09/09/23 https://www.amazon.com/Briggs-Strat...ngine+oil&qid=1694264759&s=lawn-garden&sr=1-5


#44

S

Smoke cigars & know stuff

Briggs & Stratton SAE 30 30W Engine Oil - 48 Oz. 100028 https://a.co/d/chA6wVY


#45

L

LawnWizard

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
Screenshot_20230909_081827_Chrome.jpg
You should be using 4cyl oil for air cooled engines.


#46

JoeZ

JoeZ

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
I have been using this for over 4 years off & on. Now it is all I use in my Equipment that requires 30w oil. Haven't had any ring, valve or other issues. I do change oil regularly.


,


#47

B

bnicol456

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
I see Castrol HD 30 Monograde Conventional Motor Oil at Walmart online. Its expensive though at $19 QT. Ebay has better prices for it though and free shipping.


#48

H

hotajax

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
There's not one thing wrong with using Super Tech in a lawnmower. It's not a Formula 1 racer turning 10,000 rpms. It has the spec.


#49

S

sparg45

grumpyunk said:
The SuperTech may not be as good as some national brands. Well, you can do your changes on shorter intervals if you feel it does not provide adequate longevity. Checking the links, $10 for a quart of Pennzoil is a bit much for me. The Walmart links are less pricey at least right now. I cannot understand $40 for a gallon of 30W, no matter the brand.
I'd use the SuperTech as it meets the standards specified. These machines are not in the same class as a 1911 Harley so should not need more than the manufacturer required. To each their own as likely no one will agree with my comment. I use SuperTech 30 non-detergent in my B&S branded china compressor. Lots better than the muck that was in there when I got it.
Click to expand...
Plus, nothing used or leaked oil more than a 1911 Harley! So, quit wasting money on stolen oil resold on eBay for $40/gal.


#50

A

Alex Ethridge

hotajax said:
There's not one thing wrong with using Super Tech in a lawnmower. It's not a Formula 1 racer turning 10,000 rpms. It has the spec.
Click to expand...
You have my permission to be of that opinion. :)


#51

G

Gord Baker

Since most if not all newer vehicles use Synthetic oil, the price of 'Standard non-synthetic' is rising. Remember there is little difference in Quality Brand oils.


#52

Scrubcadet10

Scrubcadet10

three8 said:
I believe SuperTech is manufacatured by Valvoline
Click to expand...
Warren Mfg, Co.


#53

B

biggertv

Any HD30 is fine for Lawn equipment. It's gonna get dirty quickly anyway, and changed more often. I get a 2 gallon jug from Atwoods. Don't be swayed and use 10W30, It Will Burn off faster, especially in older motors designed for HD30. I'm in Texas with record heat. I like the oil thick.


#54

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

🍿🍿🍿🍿🍿

I like to go green so I use Wesson canola oil.








🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣😜


#55

L

lowmow

Here is a good link to learn the principles and purposes of modern oils,and a lot of legends are busted.
https://bobistheoilguy.com/motor-oil-101/


#56

L

lowmow

The best natural lubricant is actually whale oil.It had superior lubricating properties that was unequaled by modern oils.With the rightful protection of whales, a substitute was sought,and the closest,almost identical oil, is Jojoba oil.It is hard to find as an engine oil,because it is more profitable used in cosmetics.


#57

L

lowmow

Here is a link to Jojoba oil :
www.lawnmowerforum.com

Can't find 30W oil anywhere in my area, or on line.

I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but...
www.lawnmowerforum.com www.lawnmowerforum.com


#58

B

ba63

I’ve used 10W30 in my residential lawn equipment for years without any issues. I just change it yearly. I know that people believe whatever they want to believe about oil brands and I have no idea where you are getting your information, but Super Tech (typically relabeled Warren oil) has worked perfectly fine for me for years. If you want to believe that manufacturers (be they automotive or small engine) use only the best, highest end products as OEM then that is up to you, but they definitely do not! They buy from the lowest bulk bidder, relabel it, and sell it for a premium through their dealers. Don’t get me started on VWs version of Toyota “world” automatic transmission fluid that started failing at 30,000 miles. My only (most recent) issue with Super Tech oil is that my closest Wal Mart store hardly ever has it in anything other than synthetic or synthetic blend varieties. They tend to only continue to stock the top selling products and, I guess, conventional motor oil is slowly become a thing of the past. You could probably even use synthetic 10W30 oil successfully if you wanted to, but I don’t see the need to pay up for it unless I absolutely have to. I am definitely in the camp of using the most cost effective oil that has the API "Service Symbol Donut" SJ, SL, SM, or SN markings on the label that I can find and change it regularly. If the engine is older, you might want to use Shell Rotella for the added zinc; otherwise, anything else is just overthinking it.

Attachments





#59

M

MarshSt

I'm not sure where you are located but I am in the Seattle WA area and several of the O'Reillys have it in stock at $8.99/qt. A little steep on the price but what's another couple bucks for the peace of mind if that's your brand and weight choice. I'm also a Castrol "fan" and I will be using their 30W in my chipper when I change it soon. Amazon also has a 6 pack for @$42.


#60

W

whitejww

The oil debate continues……

I live in an area where the temperature in the cutting season in generally 80° or more. I’ve changed many Briggs engines over the years on tractors I flip. The rule of thumb is to Change the oil at least once
during the season or more based on hours of usage. It’s cheaper to do it more often than replacing the engine 😉. Based on temperature I have always followed the Briggs recommendation of 30w. I just looked and they have updated their guidance for use of Synthetic oils. I always check the level prior to cutting and have not used 10w30 as Briggs clearly states in 80° temps you may burn some oil with the multi weight.

1694272322388.png


#61

G

gearz

My 2 cents is that I have been a mechanic for over 30 years and I use Synthetic 5W-30 with the proper API in my trucks and lawn equipment for as long as I can remember and NEVER had a engine issue. As long as you change it at the proper interval. I tend to over maintenance every thing I own because oil is cheaper than engine issues. BTW 30W is only for summer use and I plow in the winter so 5W-30 is a better choice for cold starts.


#62

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

7 pages so far.


#63

F

farmerdave1954

I use Rotella-T 15w40 in everything I own, car, truck, tractors, everything with a motor, EXCEPT my 2006 Harley motorcycle. I use HD synthetic in it because I love keeping my Harley all original, down to the oil. Rotella-T currently sells for $79 for a 5-gallon container at Walmart. That's $3.95 per quart. I run it in 2 John Deere D140 lawn mowers with B&S Intek V-twins with almost 400 hours on each, all my Polaris ATV's, Kubota X1100C diesel UTV, 2003 Kubota M9000 tractor, 2000 NH TC33D tractor, 1968 Ford 3000 tractor, all diesels, 2004 Chevy 2500HD 122,000 miles, 2001 Impala 227,000 miles, both with gasoline engines, Generac 6500 watt generator, Generac 150kw stationary backup generator with Ford V-10 engine, Craftsman power washer with B&S engine, 4 push mowers, most with B&S engines, and probably some other machine I've forgotten. I started using Rotella-T 15w40 in my Ford 3000 tractor after a complete engine overhaul in 1982. That tractor today has over 3200 hours on the engine, hard hours, high rpm, 6-8 hours at a time, etc. It has never used any oil since overhaul. I recently had to pull an injector that got some debris in the nozzle. While I had it out, I put a scope in the cylinder to see what it looked like. It's been 41 years since the overhaul and there is no ring ridge, no sign of wear, compression right on the spec. The engine has never used any oil between yearly oil changes, None of my engines have ever needed any oil added except the 2001 Impala. I did not own it for the first 178,000 miles so don't know the history on it before that. I bought it in 2012. It uses about half a quart between changes (3000 miles) but most of that is found on my shop floor from an oil pan gasket leak. Almost impossible to change that gasket, so I let it leak. That's been my experience, and I have never had ANY oil-related engine issues whatsoever since I started using it 40+ years ago. Go ahead and scream at me that it's not supposed to be used in gasoline engines, that it's made for diesel engines. I use it because of the results and will continue to buy it 5-gallons at a time. I've actually considered buying it in the 55-gallon drums at Sam's, but the problems handling it is why I don't.


#64

rickfischer51

rickfischer51

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
You dont tell us what your using it in, but if its older, its perhaps more important to find oil intended for service class J. The newer stuff does not meet that. The B&S oil does.


#65

H

hikerpat

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
Try Ace Hardware.


#66

B

billypumper

I use 10W-30 JD Turf Gard in my JD 14SB silver deck mower, has a 5.5 HP Kawasaki engine, not one bit of trouble from this mower that I bought in 1993, mow every week during the season for the last 30 years, this oil has performed well for my 30 years of ownership.


#67

B

boydmiles

Gun forums have this same phenomenon, mention oil and it's off to the races. I think there are two truths: 1. you can get different oil now than you could in the past and 2. any oil is better than none.
I remember from my youth that among the hot rodders the best oil was always some brand you couldn't find.


#68

ChiefH

ChiefH

I would use a 10W-30 oil as it will be 30 for your use and the 10W will make starting easier in cold weather and will not affect the 30 grade provides during normal operation. I use 10W-30 for my lawn mowers, chipper, and 0W-30 for my snow thrower.


#69

B

barny57

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
You probably won’t find it everything now it’s going to a synthetic blend no more conventional


#70

L

lilguy

Walmart, Farm and Fleet. Kubota dealer.
You didn't look very hard. Its everwhere.


#71

B

Back44L&G

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
There are two Super Tech 30W oils at Walmart however, they are only sold in quarts as Walmart discontinued the 2.5-gallon jugs. There is a diesel variety but I don't mess with it. There is a plainly labeled SAE 30W Non Detergent lubricating oil which I don't buy. And there is the SAE 30 HD which I have been buying for years to run in a 2006 Snapper Rear Engine Rider with a 12.5 HP B&S flathead engine, and I never had any issues with the oil. I sold my Snapper this spring and bought a Toro Super Recycler with a Briggs engine and it runs very well with the Super Tech SAE 30 HD oil as the weather here is quite hot during the mowing season. Like you, I have searched for other brands of SAE 30 HD engine oil but Super Tech is all that I can find. Super Tech complies with the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) specifications for SAE 30W HD engine oil. Granted Super Tech is cheaper to buy, but it still must meet the same SAE specifications as Castrol SAE 30W HD or any other manufacturer. American Petroleum Institute lists the classifications of engine oils, https://www.api.org/products-and-se...d-classifications/oil-categories#tab-gasoline
Super Tech specs are in the attached photo. Super Tech and Amazon Basics are made by Highline Warren formerly Warren Distribution which has been manufacturing engine oils since 1922. https://highlinewarren.com/national-brands/ If you click the link, you'll see that Highline Warren is not an obscure manufacturer but distributes for many national brands.

Super Tech Conventional SAE HD-30 Motor Oil 1 Quart - Walmart.com.png


#72

S

slydog

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
Price is reasonable - simple search result - copy and paste in your browser <<


#73

F

Franz47

Back44L&G said:
but it still must meet the same SAE specifications as Castrol SAE 30W HD or any other manufacturer.
Click to expand...
API S.. specs, not SAE specs. SAE specs concern only viscosity, regardless of other properties of the lubricant.


#74

N

nbpt100

Why do oil related threads generate so much traffic? I like to refer people to Bob is the Oil guy when they come up because there are real oil experts on there and a huge legacy of threads on these small engine oil topics. But Someone beat me to it.

The Walmart Supertec is made by Warren oil. According to the folks on BITOG the folks there say they are a quality manufactuer and a quality product. Not my opinion but the folks there which is good enough for me.

I know people who only change the oil on thier small engines when the color gets very dark.. it could be years. My observation is they are surviving ok. They use auto oil not small engine oil.

My observation on SAE 30 vs SAE 10-w-30 is The latter burns more on warm days. Hence you have to add more and be more vigilant about checking it. Not a problem if you are good at doing that. Many people are not. This observation is also backed up by the B&S manuals I have read. Every engine failure I have seen is due to running on low oil or never changing the oil. Aside from connecting rod bolts loosening (mfg error).

I try to keep it simple. I dont worry about brand of oil in a small engine that I will change on an interval much-much more sooner than that on any car. I am not sure I would use oil made in China. Any recent SAE 30 or 10w-30 made in USA is good enough for me for a small engine. I have not seen any Chinese oil in the stores yet. Just a matter of time I assume.


#75

T

TobyU

Tiger Small Engine said:
SAE 10W-30 is all you need. Oh boy, not another oil debate.
Click to expand...
Actually, I would prefer to only have HD 30 if I have to go with the theory of one oil is all you need for outdoor power equipment.
We really can't make General blanket assumptions or statements like this because what applies to my area may not apply to someone else's climate but I will say this..

I stopped buying anything but heavy duty 30 over 10 years ago for my mowers I service.
Only on rare occasion but will I get a Kohler command in that really should have 10W30 in it and not over one or two times per year will I get a snow blower that I will need 5W30 for that but for my normal stocking and 99% of what I buy it is SAE 30.


#76

T

TobyU

Back44L&G said:
There are two Super Tech 30W oils at Walmart however, they are only sold in quarts as Walmart discontinued the 2.5-gallon jugs. There is a diesel variety but I don't mess with it. There is a plainly labeled SAE 30W Non Detergent lubricating oil which I don't buy. And there is the SAE 30 HD which I have been buying for years to run in a 2006 Snapper Rear Engine Rider with a 12.5 HP B&S flathead engine, and I never had any issues with the oil. I sold my Snapper this spring and bought a Toro Super Recycler with a Briggs engine and it runs very well with the Super Tech SAE 30 HD oil as the weather here is quite hot during the mowing season. Like you, I have searched for other brands of SAE 30 HD engine oil but Super Tech is all that I can find. Super Tech complies with the Society of Automotive Engineers (SAE) specifications for SAE 30W HD engine oil. Granted Super Tech is cheaper to buy, but it still must meet the same SAE specifications as Castrol SAE 30W HD or any other manufacturer. Super Tech specs are in the attached photo.

View attachment 66664
Click to expand...
Yes, Walmart does a very poor job in their merchandising and displaying of that non detergent oil they carry.
In fact, if their buyers had any sense they would just remove it from their shelves because nobody is looking to buy a 30 weight non detergent oil.
It should never be put into any outdoor power equipment and hasn't been used in a car since around 1953!.
But the not so bright people who designed the Walmart shelves place it right next to their standard four-cycle lawn mower oil and their little bottles of two-stroke oil.
They obviously think it has something to do with outdoor power equipment when it does not..
The only possible thing at Walmart customer could be using that all four is maybe to oil a fan motor and even then it's too thick for that.

Anyone who needs oil for their air compressor etc shouldn't be buying that in that section anyways as they have their own little bottles of compressor oil over by the air compressors and the air tools.
So this stuff needs to disappear from Walmart stores but they don't listen.


#77

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

I guess I will be the guy that pees in the pool.
Can anyone post a pic of an engine that failed because of the quality of an oil? Not run low on oil or overheated or oil not changed in a timely manner. An engine that had bearing or cylinder damage because the oil failed.
Back in the 60's and 70's they sold rerefined oil which was made from used motor oil. Stuff smelled burned and looked nasty but cost half what new oil did. Ran that trash in mowers for years in jr high and high school in a few mowers. Never had a problem with wear and yes I tore some of the engines down. Is there a "bad" oil out there?


#78

N

nbpt100

TobyU said:
Yes, Walmart does a very poor job in their merchandising and displaying of that non detergent oil they carry.
In fact, if their buyers had any sense they would just remove it from their shelves because nobody is looking to buy a 30 weight non detergent oil.
It should never be put into any outdoor power equipment and hasn't been used in a car since around 1953!.
But the not so bright people who designed the Walmart shelves place it right next to their standard four-cycle lawn mower oil and their little bottles of two-stroke oil.
They obviously think it has something to do with outdoor power equipment when it does not..
The only possible thing at Walmart customer could be using that all four is maybe to oil a fan motor and even then it's too thick for that.

Anyone who needs oil for their air compressor etc shouldn't be buying that in that section anyways as they have their own little bottles of compressor oil over by the air compressors and the air tools.
So this stuff needs to disappear from Walmart stores but they don't listen.
Click to expand...
I agree but they should still sell the ND oil. There are enough applications. As you say compressors. Vac pumps which is like a compressor too. I know old engine manuals will call for ND but we have learned the detergent can be better. Electric motor oil is usually SAE 20. You could use 30 on an older motor and get positive results. Your points are well taken but they should still sell it. BTW they do sell a super tech lawn mower oil in a 10w-30 grade. I assume it has more zinc for air cooled applications but I do not think they say that on the label.


Again BITOG very likely covers all of this.


#79

T

TobyU

nbpt100 said:
Why do oil related threads generate so much traffic? I like to refer people to Bob is the Oil guy when they come up because there are real oil experts on there and a huge legacy of threads on these small engine oil topics. But Someone beat me to it.

The Walmart Supertec is made by Warren oil. According to the folks on BITOG the folks there say they are a quality manufactuer and a quality product. Not my opinion but the folks there which is good enough for me.

I know people who only change the oil on thier small engines when the color gets very dark.. it could be years. My observation is they are surviving ok. They use auto oil not small engine oil.

My observation on SAE 30 vs SAE 10-w-30 is The latter burns more on warm days. Hence you have to add more and be more vigilant about checking it. Not a problem if you are good at doing that. Many people are not. This observation is also backed up by the B&S manuals I have read. Every engine failure I have seen is due to running on low oil or never changing the oil. Aside from connecting rod bolts loosening (mfg error).

I try to keep it simple. I dont worry about brand of oil in a small engine that I will change on an interval much-much more sooner than that on any car. I am not sure I would use oil made in China. Any recent SAE 30 or 10w-30 made in USA is good enough for me for a small engine. I have not seen any Chinese oil in the stores yet. Just a matter of time I assume.
Click to expand...
And Briggs & Stratton tells you exactly this. For decades they have said that the recommended oil for their engines is an SAE 30 or HD 30. They say that a 10w30 may be used as a substitute but increased oil consumption may occur.
I always tell people it's not may occur but will occur.
However, as you stated, all the failures come from not having enough oil. You could probably put Wesson oil in the damn thing and it would still last as long as it's going to last as long as you kept enough oil in it.
People actually waste a lot of oil on lawn mowers simply because it makes them feel better.

The reality is that hardly anyone is ever going to notice a reduction of lifespan in their lawn mower due to lack of oil changes..
All the reduction in lifespan and the fairly instantaneous destruction is from not having enough oil in them and running them low on oil for long periods of time.

These are simply the facts! People don't want to acknowledge them because it makes them feel so much better to get that black oil out of their lawn mower.
Briggs & Stratton a few years ago just took the approach of if you can't beat them join them.
That's what this never needs oil changes just check and top off is all about.
That's what the majority of customers were doing anyways.

I'm in the lawn mower maintenance and repair business but I still think people waste a lot of money on having them over serviced every year and I can prove it by the math.

Soon, that's all going to change though because eventually the what I call junk wimpy battery mowers are going to outnumber the gasoline ones and eventually they will take over and dominate.
After this happens there will be no maintenance other than sharpening or replacing a blade.
But what there will be is very expensive battery replacements on a regular basis and some almost predictable pattern of how many batteries you can replace until you end up replacing the mower with a new one.

However I also predict after that honeymoon period is over and lots of people have buyers remorse or after 9 months or a year or so when their battery capacity is lower than it was for new which was already poor enough...they will want their old mowers back and we'll have to see if the industry will provide this for them or if this will create a huge demand for good used mowers.

I feel they will come out with some clever marketing with a slight redesign on the engine and call it something like generation 2 or whatever on the engines to get people, and the agencies etc over the fact that they're internal combustion engines somehow claiming their cleaner or whatever else which I don't think most of us care about it all anyways but they'll be giving us a nice powerful longer lasting gasoline engine.

Then, people will be able to go back to mowing their whole lawns as one event and blasting through tall overgrown grass with or without a discharge shoot on the side etc and use them as brush hogs as they done since their inception.


#80

T

TobyU

Hammermechanicman said:
I guess I will be the guy that pees in the pool.
Can anyone post a pic of an engine that failed because of the quality of an oil? Not run low on oil or overheated or oil not changed in a timely manner. An engine that had bearing or cylinder damage because the oil failed.
Back in the 60's and 70's they sold rerefined oil which was made from used motor oil. Stuff smelled burned and looked nasty but cost half what new oil did. Ran that trash in mowers for years in jr high and high school in a few mowers. Never had a problem with wear and yes I tore some of the engines down. Is there a "bad" oil out there?
Click to expand...
No they can't because it simply doesn't happen.
You're not the one who pees in the pool , you are like me, a voice of reason or explain to people why they're focusing on completely the wrong things and some of their opinions and beliefs are incorrect.
People don't like this much but too bad....we're right.

I think just for fun I'll take some little small push mower engine and running on straight Wesson oil.
You are right though, you could darn near putt any commercially available fairly common oil in existence into a lawn mower and it's not going to make a squatter difference as long as you keep the level up.

The closest thing you would have to a problem might be with some of these very new thinner oils but you could put 0w-20, any multigrade five, 10, 30, 40 viscosity, straight 60 which I think some people put in motorcycles, 5w-40, 5w50, 15w40, 15w50 and the list goes on and in fact, some of these would even offer better lubrication and provide a little less scuffing and wear etc but all of this would be hardly noticeable upon inspection.
So back to my point that it doesn't make a squat of difference.

Now if you mean any engine it's a totally different ball game. But I think we're talking about lawn mowers here.

I can certainly show you Detroit Diesel 2 strokes, the 8v71 and the 6v92 ETC that are the big Diesel Pusher bus engines that have had seizing and have excessive cylinder liner and piston skirt wear due to running 15W40 diesel oil and not the proper straight 40 CF2 rated oil.
Of course you'll have people that will deny this because they personally have run these engines on 15W40 for years and never had a problem.
They also did not have another one sitting beside of it that was run on the proper oil with the same number of miles operated in the same conditions where they were able to tear them down and look at the scuffing differences on each.
Those engines were unbelievable and long lived workhorses even when neglected and abused.
Even though they were putting extra wear and tear and damage on the engines they never knew it because they never got to the level of failure.
However, that level would have been much further away had they have used the proper oil.


#81

N

nbpt100

TobyU said:
And Briggs & Stratton tells you exactly this. For decades they have said that the recommended oil for their engines is an SAE 30 or HD 30. They say that a 10w30 may be used as a substitute but increased oil consumption may occur.
I always tell people it's not may occur but will occur.
However, as you stated, all the failures come from not having enough oil. You could probably put Wesson oil in the damn thing and it would still last as long as it's going to last as long as you kept enough oil in it.
People actually waste a lot of oil on lawn mowers simply because it makes them feel better.

The reality is that hardly anyone is ever going to notice a reduction of lifespan in their lawn mower due to lack of oil changes..
All the reduction in lifespan and the fairly instantaneous destruction is from not having enough oil in them and running them low on oil for long periods of time.

These are simply the facts! People don't want to acknowledge them because it makes them feel so much better to get that black oil out of their lawn mower.
Briggs & Stratton a few years ago just took the approach of if you can't beat them join them.
That's what this never needs oil changes just check and top off is all about.
That's what the majority of customers were doing anyways.

I'm in the lawn mower maintenance and repair business but I still think people waste a lot of money on having them over serviced every year and I can prove it by the math.

Soon, that's all going to change though because eventually the what I call junk wimpy battery mowers are going to outnumber the gasoline ones and eventually they will take over and dominate.
After this happens there will be no maintenance other than sharpening or replacing a blade.
But what there will be is very expensive battery replacements on a regular basis and some almost predictable pattern of how many batteries you can replace until you end up replacing the mower with a new one.

However I also predict after that honeymoon period is over and lots of people have buyers remorse or after 9 months or a year or so when their battery capacity is lower than it was for new which was already poor enough...they will want their old mowers back and we'll have to see if the industry will provide this for them or if this will create a huge demand for good used mowers.

I feel they will come out with some clever marketing with a slight redesign on the engine and call it something like generation 2 or whatever on the engines to get people, and the agencies etc over the fact that they're internal combustion engines somehow claiming their cleaner or whatever else which I don't think most of us care about it all anyways but they'll be giving us a nice powerful longer lasting gasoline engine.

Then, people will be able to go back to mowing their whole lawns as one event and blasting through tall overgrown grass with or without a discharge shoot on the side etc and use them as brush hogs as they done since their inception.
Click to expand...
I agree with almost all of what you say. except the homeowner mower market is going electric and not turning back. A second generation ICE may carry the industrial/commercial uses but joe homeowner is only gong to have electric options for new stuff in less than 10 years. Home Depot has already said they will stop selling ICE in the future. I forget the date but they gave one in a memo. Now they can change their mind. But we shall see. Every one I know who has a battery powered mower has been satisfied with it. They all of smaller lawns of course. I even know of one guy with a zero turn battery powered who likes it over his gas. He says the battery one does not tear his grass when he turns.
But this is an oil thread and I agree with all you said about oil.


#82

B

brucebrp

Both detergent and non-detergent SAE30 is available at NAPA store.


#83

T

TobyU

nbpt100 said:
I agree but they should still sell the ND oil. There are enough applications. As you say compressors. Vac pumps which is like a compressor too. I know old engine manuals will call for ND but we have learned the detergent can be better. Electric motor oil is usually SAE 20. You could use 30 on an older motor and get positive results. Your points are well taken but they should still sell it. BTW they do sell a super tech lawn mower oil in a 10w-30 grade. I assume it has more zinc for air cooled applications but I do not think they say that on the label.


Again BITOG very likely covers all of this.
Click to expand...
I just can't agree that Walmart should still sell it. It should be still sold on the market but not by walmart..
They have compressor oil over in the Campbell hausfeld bottles and their compressor section and no one should be going to Walmart to buy oil for a vacuum pump.
If you go to like tractor supply or rural King who actually sells vacuum pumps they also have the oil right there with it.
As I said the only thing useful would be that fan motor but still 32 thick for that as you mentioned 20 weight is mostly preferred.
So even if they're going to sell it, it's obvious they don't know how it's intended to be used due to their product placement and they should hide it somewhere like put it over by differential gear lubes etc and not next to their lawnmower oils because that is too big of a risk of someone grabbing that bottle because it says 30 on it and also in ND is very close to HD if you're not paying attention or don't know what you're talking about.
If someone just reads in the manual that SAE or HD 30 is recommended and then they get to the store and they see this ND 30 they might just remember it was 30 only and it didn't have a 10w in it so they will buy that and pour it in their Mower and that's not good for the engine.

So I feel it's a risk they shouldn't take and shouldn't keep that stuff anywhere near the lawn mower oil or even have it at all at Walmart.

I've had several of those old cars that were designed and ran on non detergent oil for decades.
I'm sure everyone has their opinion but mine has always been that it's very risky to switch over to detergent oil unless you know what the inside of the engine looks like or you've had it apart recently.

If the engine is clean then it's far better to go with a detergent oil like a se30 or 10W30 etc but so many of these engines after the decades literally have a pond of muck at the bottom of the oil pan.
In fact, one of these engines was a 337 V8 Lincoln and they're all pan is made in a way that the very bottom inch and a half or so on both from the old pan and has its own gasket there.
This is the bottom more square part of the oil pan closer to the rear.
If you take one of those off on an engine that's never been switched over, and I'm talking only one with 40 or 50,000 miles, you would be amazed what's in there.
The risk of putting detergent oil in there and pulling everything into suspension which is what some of those additives do could be very risky..
On those, I take the pans off and clean everything out mainly first and then usually flush them out and then convert them over to a detergent oil and then change it two or three times in a row within fairly short amount of miles.
This prevents that pond of muck from building back up.

We must also remember though that not all new oil is better just because new and technology.
More flat tappet camshafts were destroyed in a short period of time when SM and SN oil took over then any other amount of camshafts in history!

It's a real shame this happened but it did.
They pulled the zinc out way early and at that period of time they hadn't compensated for the small percent of flat tappets still out there with other additives and stuff.
Now, some of these newer oils even though they don't have high zinc content are quite protective of flat tappet cams.
Then of course you have people who are buying additives or special oil and racing oil because the zinc content is higher but either way you do it, they just have a desired result they're trying to achieve.

I just roll my eyes though when people make blanket statements about all the oil being better today than it was back then and stuff like that.
That all depends because better - for what purpose??

As was most everything in life, it depends.


#84

T

TobyU

nbpt100 said:
I agree with almost all of what you say. except the homeowner mower market is going electric and not turning back. A second generation ICE may carry the industrial/commercial uses but joe homeowner is only gong to have electric options for new stuff in less than 10 years. Home Depot has already said they will stop selling ICE in the future. I forget the date but they gave one in a memo. Now they can change their mind. But we shall see. Every one I know who has a battery powered mower has been satisfied with it. They all of smaller lawns of course. I even know of one guy with a zero turn battery powered who likes it over his gas. He says the battery one does not tear his grass when he turns.
But this is an oil thread and I agree with all you said about oil.
Click to expand...
Well, I was simply saying a possibility that I see occurring. I'm not making bets either way.
Like I said, it is going to get to the point where the battery powered mowers completely dominate and that's all you can buy new.
So, people will take the leap of faith and they will buy one and some will have instant buyer's remorse but others will get by okay some after slightly changing their mowing habits or buying an extra battery so they can swap them mid-mo but they'll make do.
You do get a little bit of extra convenience with them but for most the extra aggravation is worse than the extra convenience but it won't matter when that's the only new more you can buy so they will suck it up and deal with it.
However, give it 9 months to year and a half and they're already wimpy battery capacity is down to about 60 to 80% of what it was and soon thereafter it won't even finish the yard with their two batteries so they'll be looking for better alternatives instead of just going out buying a new $600 mower again and another $200 battery.

So as I said, what I -could- see happening is a new demand coming for the old gasoline power mowers people had in the first place.

The prices for new ones and the prices for used ones has already gone up for the past three seasons..

I can fully see at some point here in the next few years or so used good condition gasoline-powered mowers selling on marketplace or garage sales etc for more money than these mower sold for new!
They're already going for 2 to 300 and a lot of those mowers like Toro personal Pace sold brand new for 349 for a good number of years.

You could buy a Troy-Bilt or craftsman front wheel drive mower for 249 to 269 for a heck of a long time.

People who have had it with battery powered mowers and the sacrifices that go with them will be out there spending 300 bucks to get them a good powerful all day long mowing gasoline mower and I'm going to have as many of them to sell as possible when this happens!!
I've been hoarding these things for a long time. I have literally brand new mowers that have never cut grass that I purchased in 2005.
Back then, I wasn't even trying to be opportunistic. It was simply a decent deal on sale and I just have a weird hang up about lawn mowers.
I absolutely hate to use them because that's work, and I hate to get them dirty and stuff like that so I just like to collect them.
Kind of the same way with cars. Except they're more work to keep clean even if you don't drive them.

I have to go wipe off one of my car show cars tomorrow because I've had it out I think 3 weeks now without actually spray detailing it wiping it down and while people still stop and take pictures of it, it's really starting to look terrible.


#85

T

TobyU

gearz said:
My 2 cents is that I have been a mechanic for over 30 years and I use Synthetic 5W-30 with the proper API in my trucks and lawn equipment for as long as I can remember and NEVER had a engine issue. As long as you change it at the proper interval. I tend to over maintenance every thing I own because oil is cheaper than engine issues. BTW 30W is only for summer use and I plow in the winter so 5W-30 is a better choice for cold starts.
Click to expand...
Yes, and tons of other people will have their two cents also with their personal experience which will be about the same as yours... They use a certain oil and half forever and they haven't had any problems. Lol
The fact is, hardly anyone ever has any or related failures or problems from these small air cooled engines as it's always something else.

You mentioned changing it at proper intervals, but that's pretty irrelevant too.
The most important thing is keeping enough oil in the engine!
This can be compounded when people use synthetic oil because it tends to leak out and disappear a little quicker but as long as they keep it on the full mark it doesn't make much difference what type of oil they put in there short of being 30° below zero and them having straight 30 or straight 40 in there..
The manufacturers never spec for that and even on snow blowers they tell you to use 5W30 because they assume a snow blower is going to be started and ran somewhere under 40° F and typically under 32.

Autos are just so far different from lawn mower engines that most of our experiencing comparisons just can't be related.
It is so much more important in an automobile too change your oil frequently and not let that dirty nasty crap get in there and grind things away and cause all kinds of other damage like sludge and plugging passages and creating lack of lubrication etc.
I have literally had one engine, Ford modular V10 6.8 blow up on me do to an oil related failure.
It wasn't technically my fault but I bought the vehicle from the original owner at 86k and it was 3 quarts low when I bought it so barely on the tip of the stick.
This was also a fleet vehicle that once it was started it typically idled forever and would go 6 8 or 10 hours before shutting off with most of that being idle.
I don't think the man ever changed the engine oil.
Maybe, but he didn't take care of it.
I changed the oil with typically a semi-synthetic oil but I do know one time I ran t6 rotella in it and at 1:335 even with a fresh oil change of Pennzoil Platinum 5W30 it lost oil pressure and welded the cams to the heads.

When I took that thing apart I was literally amazed by what I found.
The inside of the valve covers looked like peanut brittle that I had to scrape off with a screwdriver and a putty knife!!
The pickup tube was so clogged to ended up replacing it.

I keep saying guessing myself wondering that if I would have used like a double dose of engine flush two different times on that if maybe I could have prevented this but probably not.

Funny thing is, the engine ran absolutely flawlessly until the oil light came on and well even after that for about 30 seconds. Lol

I will also say that this failure was more related to running it excessively low all the time because it did have a slight oil pan leak that would drip right onto the exhaust pipe so it didn't leave spots on the ground and it coked everything up in there.
It wasn't because he ran the wrong weight of oil or whatever else but it certainly compounded the fact that he probably didn't change it every 3,000 miles.
If you would have, it probably wouldn't have been so low to Coke up all the oil as they would have been filling it up every 3,000 miles but it was a very good price for the vehicle and it was what it was.
I'm not upset about it at all because the story about the engine replacement and the almost no money I had in doing it and the fact that it was actually cheaper for me to switch the engine then it would have been if I would have done two oil changes a year for the time I own the vehicle..... Makes me feel a little better but I wish the engine wouldn't have blown in the first place.


#86

B

Back44L&G

TobyU said:
And Briggs & Stratton tells you exactly this. For decades they have said that the recommended oil for their engines is an SAE 30 or HD 30. They say that a 10w30 may be used as a substitute but increased oil consumption may occur.
I always tell people it's not may occur but will occur.
However, as you stated, all the failures come from not having enough oil. You could probably put Wesson oil in the damn thing and it would still last as long as it's going to last as long as you kept enough oil in it.
People actually waste a lot of oil on lawn mowers simply because it makes them feel better.

The reality is that hardly anyone is ever going to notice a reduction of lifespan in their lawn mower due to lack of oil changes..
All the reduction in lifespan and the fairly instantaneous destruction is from not having enough oil in them and running them low on oil for long periods of time.

These are simply the facts! People don't want to acknowledge them because it makes them feel so much better to get that black oil out of their lawn mower.
Briggs & Stratton a few years ago just took the approach of if you can't beat them join them.
That's what this never needs oil changes just check and top off is all about.
That's what the majority of customers were doing anyways.

I'm in the lawn mower maintenance and repair business but I still think people waste a lot of money on having them over serviced every year and I can prove it by the math.

Soon, that's all going to change though because eventually the what I call junk wimpy battery mowers are going to outnumber the gasoline ones and eventually they will take over and dominate.
After this happens there will be no maintenance other than sharpening or replacing a blade.
But what there will be is very expensive battery replacements on a regular basis and some almost predictable pattern of how many batteries you can replace until you end up replacing the mower with a new one.

However I also predict after that honeymoon period is over and lots of people have buyers remorse or after 9 months or a year or so when their battery capacity is lower than it was for new which was already poor enough...they will want their old mowers back and we'll have to see if the industry will provide this for them or if this will create a huge demand for good used mowers.

I feel they will come out with some clever marketing with a slight redesign on the engine and call it something like generation 2 or whatever on the engines to get people, and the agencies etc over the fact that they're internal combustion engines somehow claiming their cleaner or whatever else which I don't think most of us care about it all anyways but they'll be giving us a nice powerful longer lasting gasoline engine.

Then, people will be able to go back to mowing their whole lawns as one event and blasting through tall overgrown grass with or without a discharge shoot on the side etc and use them as brush hogs as they done since their inception.
Click to expand...
Referenced underlined quote above in blue, note in section (e), that "You" is the manufacturer.
The answer is under (https://www.ecfr.gov/current/title-40/chapter-I/subchapter-U/part-1054), 40CFR Part § 1054.125 What maintenance instructions must I give to buyers?
Section (e):
(e) Maintenance that is not emission-related. For maintenance unrelated to emission controls, you may schedule any amount of inspection or maintenance. You may also take these inspection or maintenance steps during service accumulation on your emission-data engines, as long as they are reasonable and technologically necessary. This might include adding engine oil, changing fuel or oil filters, servicing engine-cooling systems, and adjusting idle speed, governor, engine bolt torque, valve lash, or injector lash. You may not perform this nonemission-related maintenance on emission-data engines more often than the least frequent intervals that you recommend to the ultimate purchaser.

What Briggs and Stratton did was based on Section (e) above concerning their advertised statements of just topping off oil and no oil changes. Most of us on this forum realize that those instructions are a failure if you plan on keeping your equipment running for years to come. If you watch any of the lawnmower repair channels on YT, you will see that many people don't take care of their lawn equipment- as long as it starts up and cuts, they think it's all good. They burn pump gas without a stabilizer and then complain that the mower won't start in the spring. Those days unfortunately are going away as the high-dollar battery mowers are taking over.


#87

T

TobyU

Also, while we're talking about oils and 30 weight... Can anyone provide any proof or even reasonable recommendations that a 30 weight diesel oil like rotella is any better or worse than a heavy duty or SE 30 car oil?.
I think a lot of people have a lot of preferences and rationales but if anything I would think the diesel oil would tend to be a little better for an air-cooled lawn mower.
Regardless, I have used both and will use whichever I can get cheaper.
I sleep exactly the same at night regardless of which one I put into these small lawn mower engines. 😂


#88

G

GrumpyCat

I have never ever ever seen a "30W" oil.

None of the links provided go to a "30W" oil, no matter Amazon's ignorant description writers often say so. Look at the product pictures "SAE 30" no W. Sometimes "30WT".

There is "30 weight" oil, which is significantly different from a winter rated 30W oil.

Nothing wrong with Walmart Super Tech oils. There are very few base oil refiners in the world, everyone else (including Castrol) is a blender who buys base oil from the refiners, mixes additives, bottles and sells under their own brands. Super Tech consistently gets very good reviews from those who actually test oils at Bob Is The Oil Guy.

Over the years when asked their favorite oil the guys at Blackstone Labs https://www.blackstone-labs.com/ have always replied tongue-in-cheek, "SAE 30".


#89

G

GrumpyCat

TobyU said:
Also, while we're talking about oils and 30 weight... Can anyone provide any proof or even reasonable recommendations that a 30 weight diesel oil like rotella is any better or worse than a heavy duty or SE 30 car oil?.
Click to expand...
Once Upon A Time so-called "diesel oils" were HDFOs, Heavy Duty Fleet Oils. To simplify things for fleet managers one oil suitable for diesel, gasoline, and many transmissions/gearboxes was formulated. Fleet managers watch costs closely, including time between overhauls. HDFO vendors had to deliver a superior product, couldn't sell oil with only a picture of a big-busted model. Not that they didn't have some racy promotional posters for the fleet customers...

So we have Delvac, Delo, and Rotella, competing head to head. Product improved.

Then recently emission regulations for both diesel and gasoline have gotten to the point an oil which meets one is harmful for the emission system of the other. Lawnmowers don't worry much about catalytic converters, oxygen sensors, or diesel particulate filters, yet. So today's "diesel oils" are diesel only. But not just for emissions. Special additives are used to neutralize the byproducts of gasoline combustion (and ethanol), and special additives to neutralize the byproducts of diesel combustion. Lacking those, acid forms. The diesel-only oils on the shelf may still have gasoline byproduct neutralizers but here is no guarantee, and no guarantee for how long it will continue.

Use a gasoline rated oil in gasoline engines. If you can find dual gasoline/diesel rated "diesel oil" then by all means that is fine to use. Be ware it will have very strong detergent action to carry the soot produced by a diesel. It may scour your engine of soot you didn't know was in there. It may turn black very quickly, but that is OK, black oil means it is working, does not mean it has gone bad.


#90

U

UTBMXCruiser

Walmart SuperTech 30W non detergent is perfectly fine in a Briggs motor. I've used it for years in my older motors. When you drill down there is really nothing special going on inside a lawn mower engine. The newer Briggs mowers call for full synthetic 15W50. If you wanna get crazy over oil run that cause of it's sump temp heat break down resistance. Non detergent or not.


#91

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

9 pages......WOOHOO!


"They burn pump gas without a stabilizer and then complain that the mower won't start in the spring."

I don't use stabilizer and I use pump gas in over a dozen pieces of equipment. Still waiting for problems.


#92

G

Gescha

J
Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
Just bought Castrol straight 30 weight oil from Amazon. It was also on Walmarts web site for a bit less a few weeks back.


#93

G

Gescha

UTBMXCruiser said:
Walmart SuperTech 30W non detergent is perfectly fine in a Briggs motor. I've used it for years in my older motors. When you drill down there is really nothing special going on inside a lawn mower engine. The newer Briggs mowers call for full synthetic 15W50. If you wanna get crazy over oil run that cause of it's sump temp heat break down resistance. Non detergent or not.
Click to expand...
Non detergent oil is ok for my older Gravely mowers but please use high detergent oil in more modern engines.


#94

T

TobyU

GrumpyCat said:
Once Upon A Time so-called "diesel oils" were HDFOs, Heavy Duty Fleet Oils. To simplify things for fleet managers one oil suitable for diesel, gasoline, and many transmissions/gearboxes was formulated. Fleet managers watch costs closely, including time between overhauls. HDFO vendors had to deliver a superior product, couldn't sell oil with only a picture of a big-busted model. Not that they didn't have some racy promotional posters for the fleet customers...

So we have Delvac, Delo, and Rotella, competing head to head. Product improved.

Then recently emission regulations for both diesel and gasoline have gotten to the point an oil which meets one is harmful for the emission system of the other. Lawnmowers don't worry much about catalytic converters, oxygen sensors, or diesel particulate filters, yet. So today's "diesel oils" are diesel only. But not just for emissions. Special additives are used to neutralize the byproducts of gasoline combustion (and ethanol), and special additives to neutralize the byproducts of diesel combustion. Lacking those, acid forms. The diesel-only oils on the shelf may still have gasoline byproduct neutralizers but here is no guarantee, and no guarantee for how long it will continue.

Use a gasoline rated oil in gasoline engines. If you can find dual gasoline/diesel rated "diesel oil" then by all means that is fine to use. Be ware it will have very strong detergent action to carry the soot produced by a diesel. It may scour your engine of soot you didn't know was in there. It may turn black very quickly, but that is OK, black oil means it is working, does not mean it has gone bad.
Click to expand...
As I said, if anything, it may be better for your engine. Lol


#95

T

TobyU

GrumpyCat said:
I have never ever ever seen a "30W" oil.

None of the links provided go to a "30W" oil, no matter Amazon's ignorant description writers often say so. Look at the product pictures "SAE 30" no W. Sometimes "30WT".

There is "30 weight" oil, which is significantly different from a winter rated 30W oil.

Nothing wrong with Walmart Super Tech oils. There are very few base oil refiners in the world, everyone else (including Castrol) is a blender who buys base oil from the refiners, mixes additives, bottles and sells under their own brands. Super Tech consistently gets very good reviews from those who actually test oils at Bob Is The Oil Guy.

Over the years when asked their favorite oil the guys at Blackstone Labs https://www.blackstone-labs.com/ have always replied tongue-in-cheek, "SAE 30".
Click to expand...
Probably never seen a "Straight 30" oil either that was printed on the bottle/can but that's what people call it and that's fine.
I would say at one time "straight" or "straight weight" has been printed on an oil container.


#96

M

mechanic mark



#97

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

Gescha said:
Non detergent oil is ok for my older Gravely mowers but please use high detergent oil in more modern engines.
Click to expand...
Help me understand why the gravely needs non detergent oil.


#98

B

bodean

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
I’ve been using Shell Rotella 15W40 T4 oil in all my non lawn equipment for over 25 years and have never had any premature wear issues. I buy it by the 5 gal pail to get it cheaper than individual quarts.


#99

B

bodean

bodean said:
I’ve been using Shell Rotella 15W40 T4 oil in all my non lawn equipment for over 25 years and have never had any premature wear issues. I buy it by the 5 gal pail to get it cheaper than individual quarts.
Click to expand...
Correction; I meant to say in all my lawn equipment.


#100

shurguywutt

shurguywutt

Most useless thread ever. LOL


#101

G

gregjo1948

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
Did you try NAPA?


#102

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

Since the oil I use comes from forests and jungles of millions of years ago I am going to say that it is plant based and that makes it OK with the hipsters and I feel good about saving the environment while I use almond milk in my latte.


#103

Scrubcadet10

Scrubcadet10

shurguywutt said:
Most useless thread ever. LOL
Click to expand...
My oil is still better than your oil.
It's even better than @Hammermechanicman 's oil.
🤣


#104

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

Scrubcadet10 said:
My oil is still better than your oil.
It's even better than @Hammermechanicman 's oil.
🤣
Click to expand...
my oil is "special"
😉


#105

M

Mow Joe

I always used non-detergent 30W in my car wash pumps. Napa carried it under their own brand name. One of my washes was near a Tractor Supply store and I usually just bought it there, under their store brand "Traveler".


#106

Scrubcadet10

Scrubcadet10

Hammermechanicman said:
my oil is "special"
😉
Click to expand...
Mine's special-er


#107

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

Scrubcadet10 said:
Mine's special-er
Click to expand...
🤣🤣🤣


#108

B

BillS2019

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
Super Tech is as good as any oil marketed.


#109

H

hotajax

Alex Ethridge said:
You have my permission to be of that opinion. :)
Click to expand...
BFD


#110

T

TobyU

Mow Joe said:
I always used non-detergent 30W in my car wash pumps. Napa carried it under their own brand name. One of my washes was near a Tractor Supply store and I usually just bought it there, under their store brand "Traveler".
Click to expand...
Yes, but my thought on that is for such a specially purpose he should have to go somewhere like a hardware store or a supply house to get it. It's not something that Walmart should carry on the shelf and ESPECIALLY not right next to 10w30 mower marked for lawn mowers and two-cycle oil.

It's just nuts and it demonstrates they obviously don't understand where and how this oil is supposed to be used.


#111

T

TobyU

Hammermechanicman said:
Help me understand why the gravely needs non detergent oil.
Click to expand...
It doesn't. And since most mowers like that don't have any type of oil pump passage with pressure lubrication etc even if there was a ton of sludge sitting in the bottom, it wouldn't matter but by the design, when you did all changes most of that would come out anyways because there's a drain plug at or very near the bottom.
My previous post addressed non detergent oil in very old cars that it had it for decades which often have over half an inch of built up sludge on the bottom and that's not something you can get out unless you remove the pan or part of the pan.
This is why some people continue to use not a church in those as detergent oil is likely to bring that into suspension and cause more problems than good.


#112

T

TobyU

bodean said:
I’ve been using Shell Rotella 15W40 T4 oil in all my non lawn equipment for over 25 years and have never had any premature wear issues. I buy it by the 5 gal pail to get it cheaper than individual quarts.
Click to expand...
And many others can say the same for using 10w30, or 10w40, or lots of other things they've been slapping in lawnmower engines for decades and their experience will be just as good as yours, or mine BECAUSE in reality, with all opinions and personal preferences aside, it makes very little difference what kind, brand, type, weight of oil you have in a little low performance turd lawn mower engine and the only thing that really matters is that you have ENOUGH oil in them.
Sure, anyone can make up some specific scenario to support their argument but for the highest percentiles and I mean like 99 plus percent of the time this is all that really matters.

Does that mean I pour anything into my mowers? Not at all!
Hi Ron straight 30 and whatever brand is fine with me..
I used to run the stuff from Meijer but then it went up. Then rural King had the best price and they've increased their price a lot also.
2 months ago they had Pennzoil on sale cheaper than the house brand so I bought that..
Last time I bought all they had rotella 30 weight on sale so I bought several gallons of that.


#113

H

hotajax

BillS2019 said:
Super Tech is as good as any oil marketed.
Click to expand...
I use SuperTech full syn in my truck 330,000 miles. Also in my standby generator which has been in service for 9 years now. Guess what? They're both running fine, and I don't go to confession on Saturday. Just change it when you're supposed to. Everything else I have runs on 2 cycle fuel


#114

H

hotajax

TobyU said:
And many others can say the same for using 10w30, or 10w40, or lots of other things they've been slapping in lawnmower engines for decades and their experience will be just as good as yours, or mine BECAUSE in reality, with all opinions and personal preferences aside, it makes very little difference what kind, brand, type, weight of oil you have in a little low performance turd lawn mower engine and the only thing that really matters is that you have ENOUGH oil in them.
Sure, anyone can make up some specific scenario to support their argument but for the highest percentiles and I mean like 99 plus percent of the time this is all that really matters.

Does that mean I pour anything into my mowers? Not at all!
Hi Ron straight 30 and whatever brand is fine with me..
I used to run the stuff from Meijer but then it went up. Then rural King had the best price and they've increased their price a lot also.
2 months ago they had Pennzoil on sale cheaper than the house brand so I bought that..
Last time I bought all they had rotella 30 weight on sale so I bought several gallons of that.
Click to expand...
"Low performance turd lawnmower engine". Good one. You should be on with Joe Rogan. (y)


#115

T

TobyU

hotajax said:
"Low performance turd lawnmower engine". Good one. You should be on with Joe Rogan. (y)
Click to expand...
I'm not sure who he is but I think he's involved with sports or something but I've been calling them low performance little turds... for a long time.

Let me also say that everything I say or post in one of these forums unless it's obvious it's simply my opinion or my preference which I will usually clearly state that.. but everything else, if I say it you can take it to the bank as being absolutely 100% fact!
I don't know why I have to bother to tell people this but it seems humans today especially on social media and online have the default stance I'm not trusting anything anyone says.
I don't get that but I guess we should be clear or more clear when we tell people things like maybe try this or something to let them know we're not telling them that this is specifically going to work that's why we said maybe.

But back to turdmobiles.
A current, latest and greatest high-tech Briggs & Stratton lawn mower engine of let's say the 24 horsepower variety is about 597 cc's. Let's forget for a moment that you could also find a 597cc or approximate engine that had anywhere from 20 to probably 26 horsepower but let's just sweep them into the carpet for now as we can let people argue and blame that on different carburetors later. 😂

So this 2023 model engine is almost 600 cc's it has maybe 24 horsepower on a good day, and some test lab at low altitude and very dense thick moist air but also maybe with a small leaf trimmer with a trickle of gasoline being blown into its air filter housing.

But I'll give it the benefit of the doubt and say it's got 24 horsepower.
A 1987 let's say Kawasaki 600 ninja sport bike also had a 600cc engine, about 598 or so but in some situations they were only barely x48 and they rounded up and still called them to the next hundred.
But anyways, these engines had a minimum of around 85 horsepower!

Shocking and exhilarating!
Sure, they had four cylinders but that's not the point - they were still a 600cc engine but they WERE NOT low performance turds.
They were high performance.... Some of the highest performance.

Now what really surprises me cuz I thought these motorcycle engines had high compression ratios but apparently they're just about as bad as the lawn mowers had like 7:1. This is surprising and slightly disappointing.
Back then, even with the cheapest pump gas eight and a half or at least eight and three quarter if not 9 or 9 and 1/4 to 1 would have been just fine but on a high performance motorcycle why not tell people they have to run premium fuel in there with a minimum octane of 89 or 91?.
But llama wrenches have very little compression ratio also. I often joke that it's about 7:1 but it may be worse than that.
If you've ever slowly watched the intake valve open and the Piston go down two bottom dead center and sit there waiting for it to close so it can actually compress the air that's in the cylinder...and you sit there waiting, and waiting, and waiting as the Piston comes back up as you rotate the flywheel etc and then only when the Piston gets to like 3/4 of the way up or something on its last little legs the valve actually closes!
It's depressing!
I know there's that pesky little thing that if the valves operated like I want them to you wouldn't be able to pull the rope as it would yank it out of your hand and break your fingers or wrist but that's not the point!!
Low performance little turds!!!

Got to go. I'm on a roll today pissing people off.


#116

T

TobyU

hotajax said:
I use SuperTech full syn in my truck 330,000 miles. Also in my standby generator which has been in service for 9 years now. Guess what? They're both running fine, and I don't go to confession on Saturday. Just change it when you're supposed to. Everything else I have runs on 2 cycle fuel
Click to expand...
And Steve down the road used 10w40 Valvoline in his with the same results. Phil around the corner use that no name stuff that Speedway gas station sells and the black bottles with the big colored label and his didn't blow up either.

I am seriously going to take one of these little lawn mower engines and poor Wesson oil in it and videotape it and run it etc and prove that you won't notice any difference and you won't have any reduced lifespan as long as the dam engine is lubricated.
With these new Briggs and strattons and their plastic camshafts, like it's really going to matter..
I will say though I pulled one apart the other day and it did have a slightly improved and redesigned camshaft so you know they might actually be trying a little bit.
They have a very bad track record at not putting any effort into fixing problems but we'll see.


#117

L

lbrac

grumpyunk said:
I kind of like the 2nd reply here:

It makes sense to me. How many old pieces of equipment are still around and running, that were always fed 'a good grade of 30W motor oil', a phrase I remember from somewhere? Which pieces of equipment are the ones that fail? Just by observation, with no statistical basis, hearsay if you will, most that die are the ones that were NOT fed oil at all, or were fed oil that was old after the first year of use. I.e., the oil was either lacking or not changed.
Very few failures are due to the design or manufacturing process, most being due to abuse by an ignorant(or lazy) owner. Of course there are exceptions.

If it calls for 30W, dump in something that is decent, and change it at reasonable intervals.

When these engines, even new ones, were designed, the extra cushion of temperature stability provided by synthetic lubricants was not even considered as the cost per quart was multiple times that of regular oil, and regular oil met the needs with a good cushion. Using synthetic is a personal choice, and is up to the individual. I *think* most failures are due to owner/operator considerations(or lack of), not the grade/brand/type of oil.
tom
Click to expand...
I generally keep my equipment, so I maintain it reasonably well myself. I have never had an oil related failure in any of my engines, but I use the recommended grade of oils and filters, if so equipped. In a 12-month automotive maintenance course I took after high school in 1968-69, we had an Autolite rep come in for a couple of days to basically tell stories of his experiences. He had been on the Chevy team at Daytona around 1956-57 when they ran a first year fuel-injected Corvette engine. They had no real experience with fuel injection and had little time to test before the race. The car ran much faster than they expected, and it burned up the engine due to it being too lean. As an inscrutable Japanese motorcycle engineer once said, "sometimes more is learned when nothing is gained", which applied here. Later, when he was with Autolite, he was making a sales call at a Ford dealer one day when a customer came to get parts. They talked, and the customer said all he used was Autolite filters and oil because they were the best. He was bad-mouthing Wix filters and a brand of oil, I can't remember which one. The rep didn't have the heart to tell the customer that that year Autolite had contracted with Wix for their filters and whatever the brand of oil was that he hated. The customer left with the Autolite branded filters and oil he came to get. Marketing is the name of the game for most products. Claims might have some truth to them, but that doesn't mean that that claim applies to your needs. If a lube is failing in a particular application, then another product might perform better. But if a product is performing well, then another, more expensive product might not make any difference in that application. The goal is to use products that provide all you need without paying a premium for something you don't. If a supposed premium product is readily available and only a little more expensive, then maybe it is worth it for the peace of mind. But if it requires a major search to find, and then it is considerably more expensive, then maybe it isn't. Don't be the Autolite customer who would go out of his way to pay a premium not to use the same product by a different name; unless of course you want to. "Often it is harder for a mechanic to fix the owner than the equipment."


#118

L

lbrac

Hammermechanicman said:
🍿🍿🍿🍿🍿

I like to go green so I use Wesson canola oil.








🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣😜
Click to expand...
I prefer peanut oil, it tolerates higher temps better than canola oil. Besides, I don't even know what a canola looks like, or where it lives.


#119

L

lbrac

Hammermechanicman said:
🍿🍿🍿🍿🍿

I like to go green so I use Wesson canola oil.








🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣😜
Click to expand...
I prefer peanut oil, it tolerates higher temps better than canola oil. Besides, I don't even know what a canola looks like or where it lives.
Hammermechanicman said:
I guess I will be the guy that pees in the pool.
Can anyone post a pic of an engine that failed because of the quality of an oil? Not run low on oil or overheated or oil not changed in a timely manner. An engine that had bearing or cylinder damage because the oil failed.
Back in the 60's and 70's they sold rerefined oil which was made from used motor oil. Stuff smelled burned and looked nasty but cost half what new oil did. Ran that trash in mowers for years in jr high and high school in a few mowers. Never had a problem with wear and yes I tore some of the engines down. Is there a "bad" oil out there?
Click to expand...
Not many people around these days that remember re-refined oil, I suspect. I had a friend in high school who had a Fairlane w/ a V-8 that burned so much oil, he would buy it by the case (Palm brand, non-detergent, less than $0.25/qt.) and carry it in his trunk. He would have to add at least a quart between gas fill ups, and another when he filled up. It was great for mosquito control. When he finally pulled the engine down to rebuild it, it was because the compression was so low it would only start when cold. It was said there was enough sludge in it to grow corn, although I doubt corn would grow very well in engine sludge.


#120

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

lbrac said:
I prefer peanut oil, it tolerates higher temps better than canola oil. Besides, I don't even know what a canola looks like, or where it lives.
Click to expand...
Canolas live in jungles. you normally find them in the same areas as you find naugas.


#121

M

MParr

😉


#122

L

lbrac

Hammermechanicman said:
Canolas live in jungles. you normally find them in the same areas as you find naugas.
Click to expand...
That must be where naugahide.


#123

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

lbrac said:
That must be where naugahide.
Click to expand...
Yup


#124

B

bertsmobile1

Actually not useless
When ever you get a LOT of people posting in a civil manner it is a good thing for humanity .


#125

D

davis2

lbrac said:
That must be where naugahide.
Click to expand...
Canola meal is used in cattle feed.


#126

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

Everybody likes a little genetically modified rapeseed.

Fun fact. Canola oil is used in the gearboxes of some food processing equipment because it is non toxic


#127

L

lbrac

davis2 said:
Canola meal is used in cattle feed.
Click to expand...
Does that eliminate the need for castor oil? Or is the canola oil already extracted from the canola before meal time?


#128

L

lbrac

Hammermechanicman said:
Everybody likes a little genetically modified rapeseed.

Fun fact. Canola oil is used in the gearboxes of some food processing equipment because it is non toxic
Click to expand...
Are we still talking about engine oils, or did you switch things up when I dozed off for a moment? Salad dressing, maybe?


#129

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

lbrac said:
Are we still talking about engine oils, or did you switch things up when I dozed off for a moment? Salad dressing, maybe?
Click to expand...
This thread took a left turn and went off the rails about 4 pages ago.


#130

D

djb383

This article my help dispel some motor oil myths/confusion. 0W30, 5W30,10W30 and straight 30W are all 30W when they reach 100*C operating temp. Multi weight oils have superior lubrication/flow characteristics compared to single weight motor oils when the motor oil temp is less than 100C.

Motor Oil

Trying to understand motor oil
www.positivespin.us www.positivespin.us


#131

T

TobyU

hotajax said:
I use SuperTech full syn in my truck 330,000 miles. Also in my standby generator which has been in service for 9 years now. Guess what? They're both running fine, and I don't go to confession on Saturday. Just change it when you're supposed to. Everything else I have runs on 2 cycle fuel
Click to expand...
And Steve down the road used 10w40 Valvoline in his with the same results. Phil around the corner use that no name stuff that Speedway gas station sells and the black bottles with the big colored label and his didn't blow up either.

I am seriously going to take one of these little lawn mower engines and poor Wesson oil in it and videotape it and run it etc and prove that you won't notice any difference and you won't have any reduced lifespan as long as the dam engine is lubricated.
With these new Briggs and strattons and their plastic camshafts, like it's really going to matter..
I will say though I pulled one apart the other day and it did have a slightly improved and redesigned camshaft so you know they might actually be trying a little bit.
I have a very bad track record at not putting any effort into fixing problems
djb383 said:
This article my help dispel some motor oil myths/confusion. 0W30, 5W30,10W30 and straight 30W are all 30W when they reach 100*C operating temp. Multi weight oils have superior lubrication/flow characteristics compared to single weight motor oils when the motor oil temp is less than 100C.

Motor Oil

Trying to understand motor oil
www.positivespin.us www.positivespin.us
Click to expand...
Despite what ANY OR ALL of that says...0w30 WILL NOT protect as well or stay in the case as long in a push mower engine as SAE 30.
We don't need any "superior flow characteristics" since when it's over 60 out and a dip/splash setup with no pumping etc.
It will thin out as the viscosity improvers get worn out since most don't change the oil that often or at all..


#132

B

bertsmobile1

Actually not a useless thread
When ever you get a LOT of people posting in a civil manner it is a good thing for humanity .


#133

B

bertsmobile1

While "oil aint oils Sol" any oil is better than no oil
Some will work better & provide better protection under SPECIFIC conditions in SPECIFIC engines than others
Mower oil funny enough works best in mowers because the additive package blended into the base oil is tailored specifically for mowers
Car oil will work just fine, within limits as will truck oil even hydraulic oil or cooking oil
I ran castor oil in my racing motorcycle for decades
In regions where green galoots prevail down here and we mow all year round running 2 strokes on vegetable oil is quite common on the misguided belief that cooking oil is less polluting than mineral oil ( most earth saving greenies have no idea of basic chemistry ) and this works there but would not work down south as it would gum up the rings over the winter non mowing season.
Similar stories with chain bar oil.
Vegetable oil works really well in your bar just so long as you use your saw at least monthly otherwise it gums up the pump.
I run corn headder oil in the fuel in some of my vintage motorcycles and two stroke in others .
Oil performance is also climate specific
What works best in very wet regions along the coast might very well not work well in dry inland regions
Same story for regions with high humidity and overnight temperature well below dew point as compared to regions with low humidity .
So the "I have used XYZ for POQ number of years" testimonials are somewhat meaningless for any one other than you neighbours .
Mowers in particular are very low stress engines when compared to truck & car engines but of course suffer a higher heat range because they are air cooled so the operating temperatures can be all over the place as agains water cooled engines where they are at a very consistent 80 C to 120 C .
Then there are things like cam followers
Try to compress your car / truck valve springs the do the same to your mower engine
You will see that mowers use very soft springs thus the scuffing wear between the cam & the followers is a lot less on mowers so all the arguements about the need for extra ZZDP in mowers is again meaningless
The main reason why cars have gone to very low viscosity base oils ( 0w-anything ) is because of very tight emission restrictions requiring each cylinder to fire within 4 engine revolutions to prevent unburned fuel being sent out the exhaust into the atmosphere ( same reason for the carb solenoid on mowers ).
Because of this car engines need the lowest possible internal drag on the engine when cold, thus the 0 base oil
On top of that low viscosity crudes are a lot cheaper .

OTOH is is always interesting to find out what people actually do with their mowers & cars


#134

shurguywutt

shurguywutt

Scrubcadet10 said:
My oil is still better than your oil.
It's even better than @Hammermechanicman 's oil.
🤣
Click to expand...
Can't be, I use whale oil imported from Alaska. You can't get it in the store. You have to order it by ship piloted by Eskimos.


#135

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

Back in the 90's when the Arthritis Foundation was holding Mini Grand Prix charity go cart races we would run castor based oil in the crankcase and put a little bit in the fuel. The smell is very distinctive. It would freak the other teams out making them think we were using some super fuel. We did it just to mess with their heads.


#136

Tiger Small Engine

Tiger Small Engine

jromeo1 said:
Amsoil makes a 5W-30 and 10W-30 small engine oil specifically designed for small 4-stroke power equipment including mowers. This is what the spec says for both:

Use 5W-30 Synthetic Small-Engine Oil in small engines found in (not limited to) snowblowers, generators, power washers and other equipment that requires SAE 30 or 5W-30 motor oil, including those made by Briggs & Stratton,* Honda,* Kohler,* Champion,* Generac,* Toro,* Ariens,* Troy Bilt,* John Deere,* MTD* and Husqvarna.

Use 10W-30 Synthetic Small-Engine Oil in small engines found in (not limited to) mowers (zero-turn, riding, stand-on, push), generators, power washers and other equipment that requires SAE 30 or 10W-30 motor oil, including those made by Briggs & Stratton, Honda, Kubota,* Kawasaki,* Kohler, Tecumseh,* Robin,* Onan,* Wisconsin,* Powertrain,* Yanmar,* Linamar* and Vanguard.*

So I just want to say that you should NOT be using a car oil for your mower. Two reasons.
1. Automobile engines are water-cooled. Mowers are air-cooled and get a lot hotter. The addidtives in small engine oils are designed to counter these high temps.
2. Car oils have no zinc because zinc will contaminate the catalytic converter. But, you need the protection of zinc in a small engine due to the higher compression (serves as a cushion against metal-to-metal wear).
I do not care if you use Amsoil or not - there are other small engine oils out there, but be smart about what you put in your $20,000 machine!
Click to expand...
Small engines are typically around 8.5 to 1 on compression (low compression compared to cars). Most important thing is change oil consistently (50 hours) and try to use the same brand if possible.


#137

U

UTBMXCruiser

Gescha said:
Non detergent oil is ok for my older Gravely mowers but please use high detergent oil in more modern engines.
Click to expand...
Did you read my post? Specifically the last sentence? Sump temp heat breakdown. A mower engine with a slinger and no oil pump doesn't care. Run the full synthetic 15W50 in everything. Old or new.


#138

S

smallenginerepairs

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
I've been using Farm and Fleet brand 30w oil for the last 20 years and have had no issues with it. I use it in my mowers and customers mowers also and it gives good protection against wear.


#139

L

lbrac

bertsmobile1 said:
While "oil aint oils Sol" any oil is better than no oil
Some will work better & provide better protection under SPECIFIC conditions in SPECIFIC engines than others
Mower oil funny enough works best in mowers because the additive package blended into the base oil is tailored specifically for mowers
Car oil will work just fine, within limits as will truck oil even hydraulic oil or cooking oil
I ran castor oil in my racing motorcycle for decades
In regions where green galoots prevail down here and we mow all year round running 2 strokes on vegetable oil is quite common on the misguided belief that cooking oil is less polluting than mineral oil ( most earth saving greenies have no idea of basic chemistry ) and this works there but would not work down south as it would gum up the rings over the winter non mowing season.
Similar stories with chain bar oil.
Vegetable oil works really well in your bar just so long as you use your saw at least monthly otherwise it gums up the pump.
I run corn headder oil in the fuel in some of my vintage motorcycles and two stroke in others .
Oil performance is also climate specific
What works best in very wet regions along the coast might very well not work well in dry inland regions
Same story for regions with high humidity and overnight temperature well below dew point as compared to regions with low humidity .
So the "I have used XYZ for POQ number of years" testimonials are somewhat meaningless for any one other than you neighbours .
Mowers in particular are very low stress engines when compared to truck & car engines but of course suffer a higher heat range because they are air cooled so the operating temperatures can be all over the place as agains water cooled engines where they are at a very consistent 80 C to 120 C .
Then there are things like cam followers
Try to compress your car / truck valve springs the do the same to your mower engine
You will see that mowers use very soft springs thus the scuffing wear between the cam & the followers is a lot less on mowers so all the arguements about the need for extra ZZDP in mowers is again meaningless
The main reason why cars have gone to very low viscosity base oils ( 0w-anything ) is because of very tight emission restrictions requiring each cylinder to fire within 4 engine revolutions to prevent unburned fuel being sent out the exhaust into the atmosphere ( same reason for the carb solenoid on mowers ).
Because of this car engines need the lowest possible internal drag on the engine when cold, thus the 0 base oil
On top of that low viscosity crudes are a lot cheaper .

OTOH is is always interesting to find out what people actually do with their mowers & cars
Click to expand...
My understanding is that clearances between mating parts are much tighter in current automotive engines, compared to what was normal in the past. This requires a lower viscosity oil to get between mating parts, which also reduces friction and improves fuel consumption. Tighter piston to cylinder clearance allows less rocking motion of the pistons, especially when cold, and allows more consistent ring contact with the cylinder walls to reduce blow-by into the crankcase. When I was in high school, I worked at a full service gas station part-time. There was a regular customer that had a 1966 or 1967 model Chevelle with a 325 hp 396 cu. in. engine who would change his oil only when the hydraulic valve lifters started clattering. We would change the oil and filter and, by the time he left, the lifters were quiet as new. This was a regular occurrence, and when he stopped for gas it would still be quiet for a good while, then it would start clattering again. Apparently, the viscosity modifiers in the multi-weight oil would break down, and the oil would stay at its lowest rated viscosity when the engine heated up to normal running temperature, which was too thin to keep the lifters pumped up. This is an extreme example because most people change their oil often enough that it doesn't reach the point that the oil viscosity fails to increase at higher temperature. But it does show that it is important to change multi-weight oil at least occasionally for this reason, and because other additives like detergents, acid neutralizers, anti-foamers, etc., even in straight weight oil, get depleted over time with use.


#140

D

djb383

TobyU said:
And Steve down the road used 10w40 Valvoline in his with the same results. Phil around the corner use that no name stuff that Speedway gas station sells and the black bottles with the big colored label and his didn't blow up either.

I am seriously going to take one of these little lawn mower engines and poor Wesson oil in it and videotape it and run it etc and prove that you won't notice any difference and you won't have any reduced lifespan as long as the dam engine is lubricated.
With these new Briggs and strattons and their plastic camshafts, like it's really going to matter..
I will say though I pulled one apart the other day and it did have a slightly improved and redesigned camshaft so you know they might actually be trying a little bit.
I have a very bad track record at not putting any effort into fixing problems

Despite what ANY OR ALL of that says...0w30 WILL NOT protect as well or stay in the case as long in a push mower engine as SAE 30.
We don't need any "superior flow characteristics" since when it's over 60 out and a dip/splash setup with no pumping etc.
It will thin out as the viscosity improvers get worn out since most don't change the oil that often or at all..
Click to expand...
Dr. Haas, who wrote the article, just might know what he’s talking about since he is an expert in lubricity and fluid flow characteristics thru years of lab experimentation, testing and fact finding. Splash is just a different way to move oil from the sump (point A) to moving parts (point B), no? Can hardly wait to see articles debunking Dr. Haas’ article.🤷‍♂️


#141

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

CAUTION! bad joke ahead


If you could ask God 2 questions what would they be?

1. Who was right?
2. What was the best oil?


#142

R

Rivets

Ok, it’s got to be said. Is anyone else thinking that this thread, “my oil is better than your oil”, has reached its maturity? Seems like once a year we have one of these. I recommend the moderator put this to bed and lock it up.


#143

V

VegetiveSteam

TobyU said:
I am seriously going to take one of these little lawn mower engines and poor Wesson oil in it and videotape it and run it etc and prove that you won't notice any difference and you won't have any reduced lifespan as long as the dam engine is lubricated.
Click to expand...
I'm far from any kind of an oil expert and I know a guy who ran his Jeep Grand Cherokee over 200000 miles before his son inherited it using nothing but the cheapest oil and filters he could find at Walmart. His son still drives it and last I knew it had around 310000 miles on it.

That being said, I have seen a small push mower engine run on Wesson oil. It didn't make it through it's first mowing before the connecting rod seized to the crankshaft.


#144

S

slomo

Think the OP lives in remote Alaska. Or a strage town where there is no wallymart.


#145

B

bertsmobile1

lbrac said:
My understanding is that clearances between mating parts are much tighter in current automotive engines, compared to what was normal in the past. This requires a lower viscosity oil to get between mating parts, which also reduces friction and improves fuel consumption. Tighter piston to cylinder clearance allows less rocking motion of the pistons, especially when cold, and allows more consistent ring contact with the cylinder walls to reduce blow-by into the crankcase. When I was in high school, I worked at a full service gas station part-time. There was a regular customer that had a 1966 or 1967 model Chevelle with a 325 hp 396 cu. in. engine who would change his oil only when the hydraulic valve lifters started clattering. We would change the oil and filter and, by the time he left, the lifters were quiet as new. This was a regular occurrence, and when he stopped for gas it would still be quiet for a good while, then it would start clattering again. Apparently, the viscosity modifiers in the multi-weight oil would break down, and the oil would stay at its lowest rated viscosity when the engine heated up to normal running temperature, which was too thin to keep the lifters pumped up. This is an extreme example because most people change their oil often enough that it doesn't reach the point that the oil viscosity fails to increase at higher temperature. But it does show that it is important to change multi-weight oil at least occasionally for this reason, and because other additives like detergents, acid neutralizers, anti-foamers, etc., even in straight weight oil, get depleted over time with use.
Click to expand...
I do not think you understand viscosity indexes
The first number is measured at 25 C the second one is between 80 & 120 C depending which standard you use.
All oils get THINNER as they get hotter
They do not and can not get thicker
What multigrades do is GET THINNER SLOWER
People conflate multigrade "thickening" with observed oil burning & sludging .
As for the lifters, they were responding to the fact that the particulates in the oil slow down it's movement and prevent the oil filling the lifters.
In extreme cases the particulates in the oil force the filter bypass to open so you are in a low oil pressure situation
This is exactly the same as running with low oil.
In any case it has zero to do with mower engines apart from Kohler Commands as mower engines are strait solid lifter systems .
It is a simple experiment I used to make all of my students on their first prac session .
Get a big funnel and put an obstruction in the outlet ( which is the actual tool that is used ) so the outlet is no bigger than 1/8" diameter
Get a tall container and mark 2 lines on it about 1/2" from the bottom & top
Fill the funnel with cold oil & measure the time it takes to drain from the lower line to the higher line
Tip the oil out and heat it in a pan ( outside on the BBQ if you want to sleep in your own bed the following night ) to say 100 C then tip it into the funnel again & measure the time again.
It used to blow the students minds and we had groups or 2 or 3 so they could test a lot of different oils ( and other fluids ) .
By 1985 I was no longer allowed to do this prac session unless it was done in a fume cupboard, all of the participants had to be wearing full fire suits & respirators which is a shame because it was probably the best value session for generating deep discussion as every one had been exposed too BS advertising so they all "knew" what the results would be and were dumbfounded when the expected results were not obtained .


#146

D

davis2

lbrac said:
Does that eliminate the need for castor oil? Or is the canola oil already extracted from the canola before meal time?
Click to expand...
The oil is extracted. The meal is probably just leftovers from the process. As is the case witn many feed ingredients.


#147

D

davis2

lbrac said:
Does that eliminate the need for castor oil? Or is the canola oil already extracted from the canola before meal time?
Click to expand...
They also use Blood meal, feather meal, pork meat and bone meal...


#148

B

bertsmobile1

Rivets said:
Ok, it’s got to be said. Is anyone else thinking that this thread, “my oil is better than your oil”, has reached its maturity? Seems like once a year we have one of these. I recommend the moderator put this to bed and lock it up.
Click to expand...
Yes it has gotten beyond the original OP's problem but these thread do encourage people who rarely ever post to join in the conversation which is good provided it remains civil, which it has .
It also allows some peoples misconseptions to addresses as per Ibrac's post which is also good .


#149

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

davis2 said:
They also use Blood meal, feather meal, pork meat and bone meal...
Click to expand...
years ago I serviced a machine at a place called carl akey feed. They cooked animal blood down to blood meal. More than one person lost their lunch from the smell.


#150

Scrubcadet10

Scrubcadet10

As long as it remains civil-ish I see no reason why it can't continue


#151

D

davis2

Hammermechanicman said:
years ago I serviced a machine at a place called carl akey feed. They cooked animal blood down to blood meal. More than one person lost their lunch from the smell.
Click to expand...
Feather meal actually smells worse. But fish meal is the absolute worst!


#152

D

djb383

Not being able to find or it being difficult to find 30W is probably a hint regarding single weight oil performance vs multi-vis oil performance, no?🤷‍♀️


#153

G

GrumpyCat

mechanic mark said:
Click to expand...
Just because vendors don't know what it is called and Google finds it doesn't make it so. The manufacturer knows and none of the products returned in the search say "30W" on the package.

Is "SAE 30", often said to be "Straight Weight" to differentiate from 10W-30 and other multi-viscosity oils.

Straight 30 weight should be easier for manufacturers to make a product that stays in grade longer in service than multi-viscosity. As to whether the manufacture actually makes an oil up to what theory says is another topic. That is should be able to stay in-grade longer, and could be cheaper, is the only reason to use SAE 30 over 10W-30. A synthetically manufactured oil should have fewer Viscosity Improver additives than a refined oil, and therefore last longer. Viscosity Improvers are weaker than base oil. But again as to whether the synthetic you choose really does have less VI and really does last longer is another topic.


#154

B

bertsmobile1

djb383 said:
Not being able to find or it being difficult to find 30W is probably a hint regarding single weight oil performance vs multi-vis oil performance, no?🤷‍♀️
Click to expand...
Well it is only used in lawn mower engines and very few use more than 2 litres while push mowers use 500ml so not going to be a really big seller compared to car oils
On top of that mower owners tend to want the cheapest possible oil and cheap = low profit
I go through a 44 gallon drum full every 5 years
I can sell you a can of synthetic multigrade oil and make $ 10 profit or the same size can of SAE 30 and make a $ 2 profit
Guess which one I will put on the shelf and which one will be hidden around the back ?


#155

D

davis2

djb383 said:
Not being able to find or it being difficult to find 30W is probably a hint regarding single weight oil performance vs multi-vis oil performance, no?🤷‍♀️
Click to expand...
I find SAE30 HD at Walmart. It is with the lawnmower stuff. Not hard to find if you take your time and look. Just check the label to be sure it isn't non-detergent.


#156

D

davis2

Be
bertsmobile1 said:
Well it is only used in lawn mower engines and very few use more than 2 litres while push mowers use 500ml so not going to be a really big seller compared to car oils
On top of that mower owners tend to want the cheapest possible oil and cheap = low profit
I go through a 44 gallon drum full every 5 years
I can sell you a can of synthetic multigrade oil and make $ 10 profit or the same size can of SAE 30 and make a $ 2 profit
Guess which one I will put on the shelf and which one will be hidden around the back ?
Click to expand...
Bert, I have a question about oil. Is it true that synthetic is actually dino oil broken down and re-mixed with any additives also added at that time? I heard that somewhere, but can't remember where.
It makes sense, because that is how milk is processed. Break it down, and put it back together so it meets the label specs... And how else can they guarantee fat %? I did work in a dairy plant, so have some knowledge of it, not an authority, but some knowledge...


#157

B

bertsmobile1

davis2 said:
Be

Bert, I have a question about oil. Is it true that synthetic is actually dino oil broken down and re-mixed with any additives also added at that time? I heard that somewhere, but can't remember where.
It makes sense, because that is how milk is processed. Break it down, and put it back together so it meets the label specs... And how else can they guarantee fat %? I did work in a dairy plant, so have some knowledge of it, not an authority, but some knowledge...
Click to expand...
There is no legal definition of "synthetic"
So yes some synthetics are actually reconstructed from the individual refined compounds
True synthetics are made the same way except the feed stock is ethylene gas not crude oil
Just about every thing we use now days is "synthetic" to some extent because modern high volume production requires identical feed stock or you end up with a disaster
Back in my high school & college days I sliced & wrapped bread every morning.
One bakery was owned by the four mill so their machines could run all morning without any problems & I am talking 60 loaves a minute on the 3 man machine
The other brand bought in their flour and it was very common to spend more time shoveling damaged loaves off the floor into the pig feed bins than loading wrapped loaves into the delivery trollies and that was down as slow as 20 loaves a minute

Sugar is recombined , everything that goes into chocolate is recombined some cooking oils are recombined , butter is recombined .
You notice it when you purchase farm gate products, particularly dairy where the farm gate stuff has a very complex flavour where as supermarket stuff is the same bland taste every time .

IF you want to have your mind blown chase down all the stuff that is nothing more than corn stripped & recombined
Soft serve Ice Cream ( which in OZ can not be called ice cream ) non dairy milk , and starches of every description, even synthetic leather can be made from corn.


#158

D

djb383

I just don’t understand the fascination with old school single weight 30W oil when multi-vis oils are far superIor regarding flow (splash) and lubrication characteristics.🤷‍♂️ My thoughts and my opinion, YMMV.


#159

V

VegetiveSteam

I'm fascinated with all of the answers to questions nobody asked.


#160

D

djb383

Maybe the Motor Oil Basics article I post answered a few questions so the question doesn’t need to be asked.🤷‍♂️


#161

G

GrumpyCat

bertsmobile1 said:
There is no legal definition of "synthetic"
Click to expand...
Furthermore there is no performance specification for which a motor oil must meet to be sold as "synthetic". In other words, no assurance a synthetic motor oil is better than a refined oil. No requirement for a synthetic to be as good or better.


#162

G

GrumpyCat

No one has found a "30W" oil yet. All you are finding is "SAE 30 HD" because 30W only exists in Google who returns links to "SAE 30" products.


#163

7394

7394

O'Reilleys carries 30wt oil in Castrol brand..


#164

F

fixit1ddh

You reminded me I need to change the oil in my 2008 14hp. Single cylinder air cooled generator. It still has the original fill of 15w40. These oil debates is the reason I changed the oil on Wife's 2008 snow blower in 2021 that still had original oil fill. And yes they both still run like new & use 0 oil.


#165

7394

7394

fixit1ddh said:
15w40
Click to expand...
Shell Rotella has a good 15w-40 oil..


#166

B

bodean

lbrac said:
I prefer peanut oil, it tolerates higher temps better than canola oil. Besides, I don't even know what a canola looks like, or where it lives.
Click to expand...
One place canola lives is near me, which is about 20 miles south of the TN state line in Alabama. Acres and acres of it is grown and farmed yearly. BTW, lots of soybeans to make soybean oil and soybean meal to is farmed right next to it.


#167

M

MowManMow

Scrubcadet10 said:
They sell 10w30, SAE30,10W40 etc. it's cheaper than most quarts of 30 weight i can get from part stores.
Click to expand...
If I run 10w30,10w40 *(syn or dino) in any of my Kohler K/Magnum engines they always burn oil. Straight 30 they never do burn it.
Kohler actually states in their Operator manuals these engines will burn oil when a 10w is used but says it can be used if desired.
Ive ran straight 30 in mine over 40yrs now but the last 2yrs noticed some oil disappears. I have 4 suddenly doing it so I know it's not from engine wear.
Odd that 10× full syn disappears in these engines, always has but idk why?


#168

G

GrumpyCat

10W-30 is thinner than 30 weight at room temperature but the same at 212°F, at which point it is even thinner.

In ancient times we knew some engines simply burned one brand of 10W-40 and others not. And some engines were happy with that oil, but others not. It was simply a matter of trial and error to find the appropriate oil for your automobile.

As I recall, we had one car which burned Kendal but not Havoline, and another which burned Havoline but not Kendal.


#169

Scrubcadet10

Scrubcadet10

GrumpyCat said:
10W-30 is thinner than 30 weight at room temperature but the same at 212°F, at which point it is even thinner.

In ancient times we knew some engines simply burned one brand ofto 10W-40 and others not. And some engines were happy with that oil, but others not. It was simply a matter of trial and error to find the appropriate oil for your automobile.

As I recall, we had one car which burned Kendal but not Havoline, and another which burned Havoline but not Kendal.
Click to expand...
To bring that into the small engine world, I had a kohler command with HLA's, it would tick with Havoline,but not with Valvoline.


#170

Fish

Fish

I'm a little late to declare it......

oilthread.JPG


#171

Hammermechanicman

Hammermechanicman

Please check all guns and knives at the door and no biting or hitting below the belt.


#172

B

Bmwz3coupe

Alex Ethridge said:
I'm looking for Castrol 30W oil and cannot find it anywhere, on-line or locally. I've checked AutoZone, Advance, O'Reilly, Walmart, Lowe's and Home Depot. So I decided to try for other brands, brands I recognize, not this cheap unknown stuff. The only straight 30W I can find is Super Tech but I have seen the independent wear test run on it and is ABSOLUTELY NOT as good as the nationally-recognized name brands.
Click to expand...
ACE brand has there HD30 on sale for $3.49 qt this month.


#173

J

jdwalsh

ILENGINE said:
But the Briggs, Kawasaki, Kohler, Honda small engine oils have a high zinc content because of the higher operating temps of the air cooled engines,which auto oils don't contain.
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Which is why I put a few Tbls of STP or GM EOS (engine oil supplement) in whatever oil I use in air-cooled four-strokes. You will then have a ZDDP content suitable for solid lifters. No need to use the waaaaay overpriced manufacturers oils.


#174

I

ILENGINE

jdwalsh said:
Which is why I put a few Tbls of STP or GM EOS (engine oil supplement) in whatever oil I use in air-cooled four-strokes. You will then have a ZDDP content suitable for solid lifters. No need to use the waaaaay overpriced manufacturers oils.
Click to expand...
If used correctly is fine, Problem is most people tend to overdose the oil. Nothing like pulling the side cover on a Kohler CH20 and the oil is the consistency of #2 grease.


#175

S

slomo

jdwalsh said:
Which is why I put a few Tbls of STP or GM EOS (engine oil supplement) in whatever oil I use in air-cooled four-strokes. You will then have a ZDDP content suitable for solid lifters. No need to use the waaaaay overpriced manufacturers oils.
Click to expand...
Wallymarts SuperTech SAE 30w already has it in there. It's SG rated for off road use. Remember how long ago SG was around? It's full of all the good stuff and easy on the wallet.


#176

shurguywutt

shurguywutt

Bmwz3coupe said:
ACE brand has there HD30 on sale for $3.49 qt this month.
Click to expand...
I picked up 4 qts of "ACE" 10w40 for the same price.


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