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B&S engine seized. Short block, whole new engine...or new tractor???

#1

C

caseyinGA

We have a Husqvara 42" lawn tractor (YTH18542) with a Briggs & Stratton OHV engine. It's 7 yrs old with 200 hrs on it.

We've had no problems with it until last week. The engine clanked a couple times then quit in a cloud of smoke. The shop says we can go with a short block for $800, a new engine for $1200, or give us a hundred off buying a new tractor using our current one as a trade in.

At first we thought to just get a new tractor but when we looked at the new models under 2 grand they no longer have a PTO, hour meter, or ammeter and we like those features. We are also thinking the quality of the new tractors isn't as high as what we've got.. at least in the under 2G category.

So now we're thinking to have ours repaired...maybe. What would you experts say we do? Is it worth spending that much on a 7 yr old/200 hr tractor? If it is, should we go the short block or new engine option?? Or just buy a whole new tractor??


#2

C

chance123

Personally, I would go with a short blk. The newer engines today are not made like they used to be. So,, if you get a new engine, or a new tractor, you "still" have that same new engine. If you can get a "NOS" replacement engine, thats a different story,, Grab it!


#3

C

caseyinGA

Thanks for the reply. "NOS" replacement engine...is "New Old Stock" correct? Which means an old engine that is unused I assume?


#4

C

chance123

caseyinGA said:
Thanks for the reply. "NOS" replacement engine...is "New Old Stock" correct? Which means an old engine that is unused I assume?
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That is correct. It's a new engine manufactured years ago that was never yet sold. There are no doubt many sitting unopened on a shelf somewhere. With the knowledge you now a days possess as to preventive maintainence, it should/could out live the machine.


#5

I

ILENGINE

caseyinGA said:
We have a Husqvara 42" lawn tractor (YTH18542) with a Briggs & Stratton OHV engine. It's 7 yrs old with 200 hrs on it.

The shop says we can go with a short block for $800, a new engine for $1200, or give us a hundred off buying a new tractor using our current one as a trade in.




I could do a 27hp briggs twin intek for less than that. Just replaced a 16hp briggs with a 17.5hp last week for $529 plus tax.

The price seems excessive unless you have a Vanguard and then it would be a little closer to what they quoted.
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#6

P

Prest989

How much have you spent on other issues recently? Spindles wearing out, is the deck rusted, are you breaking belts very frequently? If everything else on the mower is in excellent condition, I'd recommend a new replacement engine. New engines include a 2 year warranty, shortblocks include a 90 day warranty assuming it was installed correctly. If the mower has had some issues in the past, or the deck, bearings or spindles are in need of replacement, I would pick up something new.


#7

C

caseyinGA

We've had no problems at all with the tractor and it's in excellent shape Prest989...no rust, no belt probs etc. Been a dream machine for us :smile:

And to ILENGINE...sure wish you lived down our way at that price! I don't have the model of the engine we have (it's at the shop so can't check, and didn't write it into the manual) but it is a 17.5HP OHV

Still haven't decided which way to go...more comments welcomed!


#8

L

LakeRat1

caseyinGA. if you are handy with tools you can do this swap much cheaper that the Shop, remember they have to make some money Plus pay the man doing the work, i see a 17.5 HP - B&S in the Nothern tool Cat. listed for $ 529, also see a 21 hp B& S for 549, dont know if this is your engine or not, but you can surf around and fine what you need, if you have a ew tools, this is not a hard swap, also you might check with Jacks small engine, i would sure do some checking, before i layed out my hard earned money

LakeRat1


#9

Grassbandit

Grassbandit

I would replace the engine, if the rest of it is working just fine and in good condition then keep it.
The trade in offer isnt that great. But you can search ebay for a replacement tractor engine and it won't nearly cost 800-1200 for an IC Cast Iron block.
If you're not too mechanically savvy, buy the engine and take it to the shop and let them install it.
Briggs Vanguard series are really costly but they're worth every penny. So if you do want to shell out that much money make sure you're getting a Vanguard Series engine.:cool:


#10

scott47429

scott47429

I would look into a short block also as long as the rest of the mower is in good shape it will be alot cheaper and you will still have the mower you have come to love


#11

lzn197

lzn197

I'm looking at the other side of the coin. Could it be you just have a blown head gasket or overfilled the oil? You really didn't give details on it's final days of running on the original engine.


#12

J

jrelkhunt

buy a new complete engine on the web---cheaper and better than a short block..


#13

reynoldston

reynoldston

Why would you want to spend over a 1000 dollars on a seven year old mower?? Sound like a money pit. Your money so go for it. My vote would be a new tractor and I sure wouldn't be asking for advice from a forum.


#14

davbell22602

davbell22602

Buy new mower. Keep the old mower and part it out. Its worth more than $100 by parting it out.


#15

Fish

Fish

davbell22602 said:
Buy new mower. Keep the old mower and part it out. Its worth more than $100 by parting it out.
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Heck, the flywheel is worth more than $50.

But I would still pull it down and see what happened, might not be too bad and may be repairable.


#16

reynoldston

reynoldston

Fish said:
Heck, the flywheel is worth more than $50.

But I would still pull it down and see what happened, might not be too bad and may be repairable.
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Unless I am missing something here it looks like to me the OP is having this work done by a shop?? A couple of things here, 1 Why would he himself be taking this mower apart to sell parts 2 Why would he be spending money to take the mower apart to see if it was repairable. I don't know what the shop labor is where he has his mower but around here it can run better then 70 dollars a hour. If he was doing his own work I can see doing his own repairs but seeing he has to have his work done by a shop, get a new mower and be done with it.


#17

Fish

Fish

reynoldston said:
Unless I am missing something here it looks like to me the OP is having this work done by a shop?? A couple of things here, 1 Why would he himself be taking this mower apart to sell parts 2 Why would he be spending money to take the mower apart to see if it was repairable. I don't know what the shop labor is where he has his mower but around here it can run better then 70 dollars a hour. If he was doing his own work I can see doing his own repairs but seeing he has to have his work done by a shop, get a new mower and be done with it.
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You are correct, I was responding more to the last few posts, and not to the O.P. {Original Poster}.

To the Original Poster: Go find a local Poulan Tractor dealer, and buy an identical Poulan 42" tractor with the same engine,
same quality for @ $1300, it is the same tractor, just not Orange and has a Husqvarna Sticker on it!!! Poulan, Poulan Pro, Craftsman, Husqvarna, same unit, different color....

Same tractor, and sell your old one to a neighbor kid for a $100 or so....


#18

reynoldston

reynoldston

Fish said:
You are correct, I was responding more to the last few posts, and not to the O.P. {Original Poster}.

To the Original Poster: Go find a local Poulan Tractor dealer, and buy an identical Poulan 42" tractor with the same engine,
same quality for @ $1300, it is the same tractor, just not Orange and has a Husqvarna Sticker on it!!! Poulan, Poulan Pro, Craftsman, Husqvarna, same unit, different color....

Same tractor, and sell your old one to a neighbor kid for a $100 or so....
Click to expand...

Now this post makes sense to me. I agree.


#19

wjjones

wjjones

I would pick none of the above you can get a complete engine cheaper than that.

Surplus Center


#20

J

jrelkhunt

you can get a complete new engine for far less than $800, and all you do is bolt it on


#21

reynoldston

reynoldston

jrelkhunt said:
you can get a complete new engine for far less than $800, and all you do is bolt it on
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440 dollars from surplus center and bolt it in, fine do it that way. I have the catalog. This person is having it done at a shop. Life doesn't work that way. Most shops would show him the door. I agree if he was doing his own work yes put a engine in it and he could do it for about 500+ dollars. If you didn't know it yet one of the ways a shop makes money, they don't sell parts for what they paid for them. As I read it he already has it at a shop and was quoted a price. 800 dollars short block or 1200 dollars complete engine 1900 dollars new mower. He was asking what he should do.


#22

M

motoman

"Why would he go to a forum for advice?" ??????????? I thought this forum is to provide such advice.


#23

wjjones

wjjones

motoman said:
"Why would he go to a forum for advice?" ??????????? I thought this forum is to provide such advice.
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It is for advice, and he should not go to the shop unless he doesnt know how to repair it on his own. I dont I will figure it out on my own, or junk it before it goes to the shop but anyone giving those kind of quotes should be run out of business. Considering the fact that a complete engine, and labor would be cheaper for the customer.


#24

reynoldston

reynoldston

wjjones said:
It is for advice, and he should not go to the shop unless he doesnt know how to repair it on his own. I dont I will figure it out on my own, or junk it before it goes to the shop but anyone giving those kind of quotes should be run out of business. Considering the fact that a complete engine, and labor would be cheaper for the customer.
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If this job had come into my shop. I wouldn't be quoting prices till I have taken things apart. Also it would be up to the customer as to what they would want before I would take anything apart. Also being a small shop it takes me hours sometimes looking up parts and prices. This is the very reason I am going to get out of the repair business. Yes it would just be easier to say it needs a engine from the very start.


#25

wjjones

wjjones

reynoldston said:
If this job had come into my shop. I wouldn't be quoting prices till I have taken things apart. Also it would be up to the customer as to what they would want before I would take anything apart. Also being a small shop it takes me hours sometimes looking up parts and prices. This is the very reason I am going to get out of the repair business. Yes it would just be easier to say it needs a engine from the very start.
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Yep you would have to make $$ but the prices he listed where a little over the top dont you think? I almost made the same mistake myself I could replace my engine for $1583.00 + shipping from sears, or less than $600 from the surplus center online for the exact same engine.


#26

Mower Doctor 78006

Mower Doctor 78006

If it was me. I would find another shop. Or get a good used mower from Craigslist. Spending 800 for just a short block is crazy!! You can get a good used engine from a mower with a bad transmission, or other non engine related problems for prob 200-300 bucks. Its not more than a few hours work to swap it out. Did you run it low on oil?


#27

reynoldston

reynoldston

wjjones said:
Yep you would have to make $$ but the prices he listed where a little over the top dont you think? I almost made the same mistake myself I could replace my engine for $1583.00 + shipping from sears, or less than $600 from the surplus center online for the exact same engine.
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I really don't think the prices are over the top. As a fact I would say 800 dollars for a short block sound like a bargain. Yes OP should buy his engine himself and do his own labor, yes he will save money. The repair shop can't give their parts and labor away. It cost them just as much for everyday living as any other business. Are you afraid this shop is going rich off this job? I don't think so. I have no idea how you made your money but its a good chance most people get paid for what they do, unless they were born rich. I made my living in repairs and know a lot of people who have a lot more money then I have. It just doesn't bother anybody when someone makes big money in sales but don't do it in repairs.


#28

Mower Doctor 78006

Mower Doctor 78006

I understand the shop has to make money........... If the short block cost 300 to them wholesale. They mark it up 600 to the customer. And 200 labor to install and get running is fair. I just think for that kind of money its cheaper in the long run to have another engine installed then reuse the head, carb intake, starter ect. Sometimes when the engines go they bend valves, and ruin heads in the process.



reynoldston said:
I really don't think the prices are over the top. As a fact I would say 800 dollars for a short block sound like a bargain. Yes OP should buy his engine himself and do his own labor, yes he will save money. The repair shop can't give their parts and labor away. It cost them just as much for everyday living as any other business. Are you afraid this shop is going rich off this job? I don't think so. I have no idea how you made your money but its a good chance most people get paid for what they do, unless they were born rich. I made my living in repairs and know a lot of people who have a lot more money then I have. It just doesn't bother anybody when someone makes big money in sales but don't do it in repairs.
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#29

wjjones

wjjones

Mower Doctor 78006 said:
I understand the shop has to make money........... If the short block cost 300 to them wholesale. They mark it up 600 to the customer. And 200 labor to install and get running is fair. I just think for that kind of money its cheaper in the long run to have another engine installed then reuse the head, carb intake, starter ect. Sometimes when the engines go they bend valves, and ruin heads in the process.
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Yep its like half new engine, and half old engine which might end up causing more trouble. I think 100% markup is a little much myself, and usually shops like that dont hang around long because it catches up with them. We have had 3 go under with that kind of business practice in our area in the last 4 years... making money is one thing but ripping people off is another.


#30

Fish

Fish

Most shops tend to shy away from someone bringing in engines, new or used, and wanting the shop to do the swap. If they
bring in an engine that is not the same, it gets into time=money, and if the new engine throws a rod in the first 10 minutes,
the customer expects the shop to stand behind it, a big problem.
If the shop got the engine or shortblock through their own distributor, they would have some recourse, but an engine bought
off the internet, or used, etc....., no one will stand behind it, and if anyone did, who will pay the extra labor. No, that
is the kind of work that one gets a neighborhood kid to do it.



No, the guy will bring in an engine with different alternator, wrong crank size, etc.....


#31

M

motoman

Deferring to you with more exposure to repairs and parts...It's hard for me to imagine finding a good engine where other major components have failed. At least with respect to Briggs. Seems like I see more decks for sale than used engines. A while back on this thread there was interesting discussion about the application of H-Frt Chinese sourced AC engines (YES, I know, if I think I had problems with Intek then just wait) . The writer had mentioned the crazy warranty available with H-Frt so that every couple years he could keep getting new ones for (virtually) nothing once the warranty was in place. Do not know about fit, form and coupling problems. Just saying....:laughing:


#32

wjjones

wjjones

Fish said:
Most shops tend to shy away from someone bringing in engines, new or used, and wanting the shop to do the swap. If they
bring in an engine that is not the same, it gets into time=money, and if the new engine throws a rod in the first 10 minutes,
the customer expects the shop to stand behind it, a big problem.
If the shop got the engine or shortblock through their own distributor, they would have some recourse, but an engine bought
off the internet, or used, etc....., no one will stand behind it, and if anyone did, who will pay the extra labor. No, that
is the kind of work that one gets a neighborhood kid to do it.



No, the guy will bring in an engine with different alternator, wrong crank size, etc.....
Click to expand...




This is true too I know what you mean, and have seen it.


#33

Mower Doctor 78006

Mower Doctor 78006

I haul in mowers weekly with good engines and bad body's. Out here in the Texas hill country there's a lot of rocks. To the harbor freight engine deal. I wouldn't use one of those engines if you payed me to!! I certainly wouldn't install one in a customers machine. I only repair, and sell equipment I would use myself. If it's not good enough for me. Its not good enough for my customers. I get briggs engines all the time that usually need nothing more than carb work, And tune ups. Over the years I have had more good briggs than anything else.


motoman said:
Deferring to you with more exposure to repairs and parts...It's hard for me to imagine finding a good engine where other major components have failed. At least with respect to Briggs. Seems like I see more decks for sale than used engines. A while back on this thread there was interesting discussion about the application of H-Frt Chinese sourced AC engines (YES, I know, if I think I had problems with Intek then just wait) . The writer had mentioned the crazy warranty available with H-Frt so that every couple years he could keep getting new ones for (virtually) nothing once the warranty was in place. Do not know about fit, form and coupling problems. Just saying....:laughing:
Click to expand...


#34

reynoldston

reynoldston

wjjones said:
Yep its like half new engine, and half old engine which might end up causing more trouble. I think 100% markup is a little much myself, and usually shops like that dont hang around long because it catches up with them. We have had 3 go under with that kind of business practice in our area in the last 4 years... making money is one thing but ripping people off is another.
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I have no idea why the three shops went out of business and unless you know them personally how do you know. Yes I have seen repair shops come and go and the ones that can get a good sales business are going will stay. The money is in sales not repairs. The dealers that I have worked for have always said that. Yes the shops need a parts mark up. The large shops have to support a parts department and a small shop has to spend a lot of time getting there own parts. Someone will spend big dollars to buy new equipment but then cries about repair cost. This is the reason I always liked doing repair work for large company's, they would fix what ever it needed and not worry what it cost. I say if the home owner doesn't want to pay for a shop to do their repairs do it themselves.


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