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My 2001 42 inch - 14 HP Scotts law tractor will not start by key, I must jump the positive terminal of the starter

I tested the solenoid and it tested fine (it is 3 years old)
I jumped the seat safety switch and it wouldn't start
Cleaned the posts of mower safety switch
I haven't checked the safety switch for brake

The engine will start if

1. I place a have the key turned to start
2. Jumper wire from the positive terminal of the battery to the positive terminal of the starter

The engine starts and runs

With other tractors I've owned in the past the darn safety switches are always a PITA. On my WHeel Horse 310 I had some of the switches disabled....oh and yes I did survive.

The seat switch has absolutely nothing to do with any of the starting circuits so leave it alone.
The cranking circuit goes
Solenoid hot terminal > fuse > B terminal on key switch > S terminal on key switch > PTO switch > parking brake switch > trigger terminal on Solenoid.

This is a daisy chain so any single break = no crank
You can back check the sockets for voltage but that requires third hand on the key switch, or jump each switch one at a time till the culprit reveals itself .

Warning

The PTO & BRAKE switches may also have magneto kill wires and connecting them to 12V will fry the control chip in the magneto.
Get a wiring diagram to make sure you don't blow the magneto or pull the blower housing off & disconnect the magneto kill wire.

Thanks

The weird thing was that for a while the engine would start even if I wasn't sitting on the tractor. Isn't the tractor starting without being on the seat a no-no? Crank would be one thing but full start would be another thing. Right??

I put my meter on the positive terminal on the starter and when turning the key to start, there is not voltage.

I recently put a new belt on and I'm trying to think if I did something.

Three years ago I had this same situation but a new solenoid fixed it.

bertsmobile1 said:

The seat switch has absolutely nothing to do with any of the starting circuits so leave it alone.
The cranking circuit goes
Solenoid hot terminal > fuse > B terminal on key switch > S terminal on key switch > PTO switch > parking brake switch > trigger terminal on Solenoid.

This is a daisy chain so any single break = no crank
You can back check the sockets for voltage but that requires third hand on the key switch, or jump each switch one at a time till the culprit reveals itself .

Warning

The PTO & BRAKE switches may also have magneto kill wires and connecting them to 12V will fry the control chip in the magneto.
Get a wiring diagram to make sure you don't blow the magneto or pull the blower housing off & disconnect the magneto kill wire.

Click to expand...

Seat switch is bypassed by the brake switch so as long as the brake is on & PTO is off you can start the mower with an empty seat
Otherwise it is a tad problematic for techs to service the engine

Just jump started it and for testing, I engaged the mower PTO without anyone on the seat. Isn't the safety switch supposed to shut down the engine when the seat is empty?

So I shut it down, engaged the PTO, not sitting on seat and jump started it with the PTO engaged --- it started.

Now my thinking is that maybe jumping the starter bypasses the PTO safety switch? But shouldn't the negative side of the switch not allow ignition.

The safety switch for the PTO has four spades. For testing purposes, I'm not sure which female sides of that connector to jumper and bypass the safety switch.

I'm about to do what I did to a Saturn my son once owned. Use a remote starter switch to make things work. On the Saturn it was supposed to be temporary but the switch that needed replaced was in the column and more money than my kid had at that time. The remote starter
fix worked for years.

bertsmobile1 said:

Seat switch is bypassed by the brake switch so as long as the brake is on & PTO is off you can start the mower with an empty seat
Otherwise it is a tad problematic for techs to service the engine

Click to expand...

I did a push button start on mine when the ignition switch went out. Alot cheaper and easier to do. Total was 10 buks for the kill switch and the button switch

Just bought one from Harbor Freight and the gauge wiring isn't good enough. Can't push enough juice.

Wiring may not be able to handle from the battery to the starter. But it can energize from the positive on the battery to the one bolt with the ear, on the solenoid. It will start using such a method. My solenoid has two ears tabs.

So for now I will do the above and be done with it. Does the solenoid jump bypass safety switches?

Smurfy76 said:

I did a push button start on mine when the ignition switch went out. Alot cheaper and easier to do. Total was 10 buks for the kill switch and the button switch

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Yeah I use a car horn button.

Just jump started it and for testing, I engaged the mower PTO without anyone on the seat. Isn't the safety switch supposed to shut down the engine when the seat is empty?

Yes it is so you obviously have some wiring problems that should be sorted out.
The seat switch is there for both your safety & the safety of others in the locality of you mowing


So I shut it down, engaged the PTO, not sitting on seat and jump started it with the PTO engaged --- it started.

If you read & understood my original reply then it would be apparent that jumping directly to the starter motor bypasses the entire cranking circuit so why would it not start ?

Now my thinking is that maybe jumping the starter bypasses the PTO safety switch? But shouldn't the negative side of the switch not allow ignition.
Well yes if you are not using the cranking circuit a safety switch in the cranking circuit is hardly going to have any effect is it ?
There is no battery ignition, the Magneto is self energising so nothing there to stop the engine firing up & blades spinning lopping off a lump of your hand or foot while you are there jumping the starter or you slipping & putting your hand into the belts on the deck, so the belt can not so neatly remove large lumps of flesh.

The safety switch for the PTO has four spades. For testing purposes, I'm not sure which female sides of that connector to jumper and bypass the safety switch.
There is a golden rule about staying alive & well
If you have no idea about what you are doing then DON'T DO IT

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I was originally trying to help you diagnose & fix your mower
However you are obviously determined to bastardize the wiring with less than no idea what you are doing & the potential consequences of doing it.
Thus you are now on your own

That's a little harsh. You would hate seeing my mower as I bypassed all safety switches with the push button start.

BTW the switch isn't for the starter but the solenoid. Mine has only one tab so I'm not sure the difference on that.

Whoa!

At the moment I have a broken finger, on antibiotics for Lyme, I'm 66 years old, I'm sitting with my neighbor some days, the one dying from cancer and all I want to do it get my 2.5 acres mowed. I really don't have the time or the physical capacity to crawl around on the ground. Now if you can tell me exactly which switch is crapped out, I would appreciated it.

Almost everyone around my area has disabled one or another of those safety switches at one time or another. Maybe over the winter I can get it set perfect again.

Yes I do live in an area that we joke about all the government BS that is here for our safety. We all have our feet, our fingers and some of the guys are in their 90's still crawling up onto their tractors to plow the fields.

Oh and yes, since my home isn't three prong receptacles, I also cut off that third ground off my wires.

bertsmobile1 said:

I was originally trying to help you diagnose & fix your mower
However you are obviously determined to bastardize the wiring with less than no idea what you are doing & the potential consequences of doing it.
Thus you are now on your own

Click to expand...

Smurfy76 said:

That's a little harsh. You would hate seeing my mower as I bypassed all safety switches with the push button start.

Click to expand...

Some might call it harsh, down here we call it plain talking & Aussies are renown for it.
No tip toeing around just in case come one might get upset, call it as you see it.

If people who come here for assistance decide to ignore what they are told or asked to do then there is no point in wasting time trying to help them.
During my time I worked with a few functionally illiterate customers who were actually trying make a go of commercial lawn mowing but going broke because they did not understand their gear & how to maintain it.
And it is with a great deal of pride ( I can be as vein as anyone else ) I can say they are all doing quite well and now earning more from mowing than they were spending on their equipment servicing & repairs.
I show my customers what I do & how to do it and because of that they do not fell like I am ripping them off & recommend me to their friends.
However there are enough headaches in the yard that I can not fix without bashing my head against a brick wall on the forum with people who refuse to be helped to give me more headaches.

urdrwho said:

Whoa!

At the moment I have a broken finger, on antibiotics for Lyme, I'm 66 years old, I'm sitting with my neighbor some days, the one dying from cancer and all I want to do it get my 2.5 acres mowed. I really don't have the time or the physical capacity to crawl around on the ground. Now if you can tell me exactly which switch is crapped out, I would appreciated it.

Almost everyone around my area has disabled one or another of those safety switches at one time or another. Maybe over the winter I can get it set perfect again.

Yes I do live in an area that we joke about all the government BS that is here for our safety. We all have our feet, our fingers and some of the guys are in their 90's still crawling up onto their tractors to plow the fields.

Oh and yes, since my home isn't three prong receptacles, I also cut off that third ground off my wires.

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Buy the time your mowing season ends I will be preparing for my 70th birthday, it is called aging and is 100% better than the alternative , I know because in 78 I went there.
You got a sore finger, I got a smashed ankle , not many get to this age intact , but at this age things get damaged a lot easier & take a lot longer the heal, thus things designed to prevent injury become more important.

Just cause you live amongst a community of 1/2 wit idiots does not mean you have to be one as well.
Removing something that was put there for your protection , regardless of weather it is essential or not ( & I don't believe is most of them myself ) is not a sign of a higher inteligance or a blow for freedom, it is plain dumb.

And no, we can not tell you exactly which switch to replace or what wire is bad because we are on the other side of a screen, not standing there looking at your mower, beer in hand.
You have to do what you get asked to do so the person who is trying to help you can work out exactly what is wrong.

Having signed off on your thread, perhaps other might fell inclined to pander to you.
There is a sort of unwritten agreement that we do not generally post to a thread where we see a person providing good information so now I have signed off your thread has been left clear for others.
And no I do not wish you any harm or mallace but I can make better use of my time helping people who are receptive to help.

Look I see both sides of the story. On one hand yeah it should be fixed with it all working 100 percent. But sometimes you have to bypass things to make them work to get the job done. Take my mower. Yeah I bypassed every switch it has. You know why? Because I don't have 25 bucks for a ignition switch plus other things. Do I need the safety switches no not really because I have common sense. Just like a car I don't start it in gear. And let's be honest here. Most safety things are there not to protect people but the companies from being sued. So let's all. So let's relax everyone grab your internet beer and not take this that serious. We're here to help each other out not bitch at each other.

Yep product liability. For your safety Nytol Sleeping Pills - warning label "May cause drowsiness." I do like the one on my recent purchase, it is a folding ladder and it says, failure Failure to read and follow the instructions on this ladder may result in injury or death. Hm? I would think that failure to read isn't the peril, it is falling from the ladder may result in injury or death.

Oh I also forget this one:

Reading a cabinet manufacturers & installers recent contract sent to them to sign, I asked them are you aware of the life preserver clause. Answer - no. Well if any of your guys are installing a cabinet within 15 feet of a body of water, they must wear a coast guard approved life preserver. Well I won't say the words he used. I also mentioned to him that the "body of water" in the contract has no definition. Is the spirit of the word a swimming pool, a lake, the ocean, a small retention pond a mud puddle. Ah --- we are here to protect you

Smurfy76 said:

Look I see both sides of the story. On one hand yeah it should be fixed with it all working 100 percent. But sometimes you have to bypass things to make them work to get the job done. Take my mower. Yeah I bypassed every switch it has. You know why? Because I don't have 25 bucks for a ignition switch plus other things. Do I need the safety switches no not really because I have common sense. Just like a car I don't start it in gear. And let's be honest here. Most safety things are there not to protect people but the companies from being sued. So let's all. So let's relax everyone grab your internet beer and not take this that serious. We're here to help each other out not bitch at each other.

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