Won't start...fuel? or timing or ????

[boneinhead]

Long story but I'm an aircraft Mech and I know you need all the details. This is a J Deere D130 22hp BandS V Twin Type 0283 G1 Code 100809YG. 157 hours total time The story: I was mowing along and heard a pop or backfire with light blue smoke from the exhaust. The engine slowed a bit then picked back up and I finished the back yard and parked the mowing to get a drink (of water!). When I came back it wouldn't start, not even a pop. I rolled it into the garage and tackled it the next day. To shorten the story I did the following: Replaced the fuel pump, yes it's hooked up correctly. Pulled off the carb and disassembled for the through cleaning with HP air and reassembled. Still wouldn't start so I pour gas in the throat and it finally lit with enough blue smoke to kill all the bugs in my garage. It ran but very poorly so I thought it was definitely still a carb issue. Yanked the carb back off and put a new carb kit in it (Bye bye C note). Put it all back together and same thing! I messed with the carb linkages but could not really see any improvement. Yanked the plugs found them sooty from the oil they seem to burn every time I get the thing started. Then wondered if there was a crack in a piston or cyl sleeve so I did a compression check and got 110 PSI both sides. I can get it started, by pouring gas in the carb and mow the lawn with it but it seems to run best with the throttle in the full choke position and even then it misses a bit. I'm outta bad ideas fellas...help. Small engines is not what I do best!

 

[rgpsctl]

Long story but I'm an aircraft Mech and I know you need all the details. This is a J Deere D130 22hp BandS V Twin Type 0283 G1 Code 100809YG. 157 hours total time The story: I was mowing along and heard a pop or backfire with light blue smoke from the exhaust. The engine slowed a bit then picked back up and I finished the back yard and parked the mowing to get a drink (of water!). When I came back it wouldn't start, not even a pop. I rolled it into the garage and tackled it the next day. To shorten the story I did the following: Replaced the fuel pump, yes it's hooked up correctly. Pulled off the carb and disassembled for the through cleaning with HP air and reassembled. Still wouldn't start so I pour gas in the throat and it finally lit with enough blue smoke to kill all the bugs in my garage. It ran but very poorly so I thought it was definitely still a carb issue. Yanked the carb back off and put a new carb kit in it (Bye bye C note). Put it all back together and same thing! I messed with the carb linkages but could not really see any improvement. Yanked the plugs found them sooty from the oil they seem to burn every time I get the thing started. Then wondered if there was a crack in a piston or cyl sleeve so I did a compression check and got 110 PSI both sides. I can get it started, by pouring gas in the carb and mow the lawn with it but it seems to run best with the throttle in the full choke position and even then it misses a bit. I'm outta bad ideas fellas...help. Small engines is not what I do best!

Sounds like the crankcase is over filled with oil. Or gas from carburetor problem. Needle and seat should be fixed now when you installed carburetor kit. Unless carburetor had a brass seat and you didn't replace it. Pull dipstick check for overfill and smell oil for gasoline.

 

[boneinhead]

Sounds like the crankcase is over filled with oil. Or gas from carburetor problem. Needle and seat should be fixed now when you installed carburetor kit. Unless carburetor had a brass seat and you didn't replace it. Pull dipstick check for overfill and smell oil for gasoline.

Very interesting, during my trouble shooting I did find the crankcase overfilled with oil, close to a quart. I have no idea how that happened or who suddenly decided to put more oil in it. I drained it down to the hash marks and found the symptoms still remain...(pour gas in to start it and have to run at full choke). The very expensive carb overhaul kit P/N 797890 had a new needle valve which I replaced but did not include a new seat. Should there have been a new seat in the kit and should I now go buy a new seat and replace it? Thanks for your help!

 

[rgpsctl]

Very interesting, during my trouble shooting I did find the crankcase overfilled with oil, close to a quart. I have no idea how that happened or who suddenly decided to put more oil in it. I drained it down to the hash marks and found the symptoms still remain...(pour gas in to start it and have to run at full choke). The very expensive carb overhaul kit P/N 797890 had a new needle valve which I replaced but did not include a new seat. Should there have been a new seat in the kit and should I now go buy a new seat and replace it? Thanks for your help!

You said engine was over filled with oil by a quart and drained it out. But you didn't say if the oil smelled like gasoline? If the oil had a gasoline smell you need to change the oil & filter. This carburetor has a fuel shut off seloniod on the carburetor bowl, when you turn the ignition switch to the run position the seloniod will open. You should be able to hear click open & if you are touching the seloniod yo will be able feel it open. If seloniod is stuck closed it will not let fuel flow in the carburetor and the engine will never start. You can remove the seloniod & bench check it with a 12 volt battery. Now this carburetor has experience problems with the 2 small jets in lower well of main carburetor body. Sometimes the jets which are retained by very small o-ring, the jets will fall out or the o-rings won't seal correctly. You may also have blockage in the small passage ways in the carburetor. In the past if I had any of problems & I know you don't want to hear this. You are better off replacing the carburetor than beating your head against the wall. I hope this will help you. Please post to let me know if you get it repair. P.S. Check out all prices on all the parts before you decide what to do.

 

[boneinhead]

You said engine was over filled with oil by a quart and drained it out. But you didn't say if the oil smelled like gasoline? If the oil had a gasoline smell you need to change the oil & filter. This carburetor has a fuel shut off seloniod on the carburetor bowl, when you turn the ignition switch to the run position the seloniod will open. You should be able to hear click open & if you are touching the seloniod yo will be able feel it open. If seloniod is stuck closed it will not let fuel flow in the carburetor and the engine will never start. You can remove the seloniod & bench check it with a 12 volt battery. Now this carburetor has experience problems with the 2 small jets in lower well of main carburetor body. Sometimes the jets which are retained by very small o-ring, the jets will fall out or the o-rings won't seal correctly. You may also have blockage in the small passage ways in the carburetor. In the past if I had any of problems & I know you don't want to hear this. You are better off replacing the carburetor than beating your head against the wall. I hope this will help you. Please post to let me know if you get it repair. P.S. Check out all prices on all the parts before you decide what to do.

It does smell like gas so I will change the oil and filter. I checked the solenoid early in the process, it works fine. I saw the jets with small O rings when I cleaned out the carb and again when I put the new kit in it. They are in place and clean. After I change the oil/Filter, I'll assess if I want to drop more dollars in it or run it the way it is or trade it off. I can't swallow the idea of having to buy a new carb for a 3 year old garden tractor with 158 hours on it. I'll let you know what happens, it may just clear up and be fine! :laughing:

 

[cpurvis]

I have seen carburetors that had to be replaced before the first year of ownership was up.

If you go trade it off, you'll take a worse beating than replacing a carburetor AND you won't be getting anything of any higher quality than what you've got.