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rough idle and engine stalls when moving lever from choke to run position; B&S 16.50 series

#1

K

kelazier

This is on a generator. The engine has a rough idle and vibrates. Is there such a thing as "timing" on an engine like this? Would it be a carb issue? It starts right up and when I slide the lever from the choke position to run position it starts to stall out about 1/4 of the way over. When I move it back toward the choke position it regains its momentum. Any general thoughts? I can give more details if you need them, but just maybe I'm missing something obvious.


#2

StarTech

StarTech

Clean and rebuild carburetor


#3

Scrubcadet10

Scrubcadet10

Time for a carburetor cleaning, choking richens the fuel mixture, when you take the choke off, it stalls out due to crap in the carb blocking fuel


#4

1

100 td

Get your carby jet cleaners out and clean the main jet as well as others. When you put the genset away ensure you turn the fuel off and run it out of fuel so varnish can't build up in the carby.


#5

StarTech

StarTech

Unless the carburetor is properly cleaned and rebuilt those so called jet cleaners will only mask the problems. Many of the 1650 series B&S uses a Nikki carburetor; therefore, once they are opened up new gaskets are needed. Even the main jet will need a new o-ring.

Running the engine until all the fuel is supposedly used up in the carburetor doesn't guarantee that the carburetor won't have problems from residual fuel left in the carburetor.


#6

1

100 td

Turning the fuel off and running it out of fuel lowers the fuel level so the main jet isn't sitting in fuel for 12 months at a time for the varnish to deposit. Turning the fuel off stops the fuel from continuously topping up for 12 months as the fuel slowly evaporates leaving the varnish/impurities behind, concentrating them in the carby. Leaving the fuel on creates a lot of money for folks who charge to get gensets going every year.


#7

StarTech

StarTech

Some generators do need to be started up every few months anyway to keep the rotors fully magnetize.
100 td said:
Turning the fuel off and running it out of fuel lowers the fuel level so the main jet isn't sitting in fuel for 12 months at a time for the varnish to deposit. Turning the fuel off stops the fuel from continuously topping up for 12 months as the fuel slowly evaporates leaving the varnish/impurities behind, concentrating them in the carby. Leaving the fuel on creates a lot of money for folks who charge to get gensets going every year.
Click to expand...
Yes this does occur but even when ran supposedly dry there is still fuel in the idle and main jet passages as it is impossible to get every bit of fuel out. It is the same when I clean a carburetor as some water/soap is left behind which why I use a non-residual soap. I haven't use either the spray or dip carburetor cleaner since 2014 on any carburetor.

As a repair only shop, repairs is how we stay in business. If no repairs then we go out of business or try to make it as I have the last three months of paying overhead and losing money. Matter of fact my bank account for the business is now under $400 even though I have $33,000 in parts in the warehouse. I currently don't have medical insurance but my doctor is still insisting on me coming to his office for office visit and tests which I am unable to do so my medical problems just have to wait.

And yes I charge to get these carburetors clean but I consider $25-$50 in labor is well worth it considering some these carburetor are a couple hundred dollars. Matter I doing a Generac genset now that carburetor [$130] that having rework the needle seat due water damage. Even Generac charges $60 for the carburetor repair kit. But I am using 82 degree countersink to straighten out the needle seat problem. Now if you think a shop like charging $50 for two hours of work is making a killing then so it be. Even the electricity and hand toolsI use cost anyone doing the work. Besides the customer is paying for things to be do right and not half a$$ done.

Now of course some think we make tons of money every year, well I don't. When I retire in a few years then everyone can go to those shops that have so-call mechanics that can't even find a bad spark plug.


#8

K

kelazier

StarTech said:
Clean and rebuild carburetor
Click to expand...
thank you


#9

K

kelazier

Scrubcadet10 said:
Time for a carburetor cleaning, choking richens the fuel mixture, when you take the choke off, it stalls out due to crap in the carb blocking fuel
Click to expand...
thank you


#10

K

kelazier

100 td said:
Get your carby jet cleaners out and clean the main jet as well as others. When you put the genset away ensure you turn the fuel off and run it out of fuel so varnish can't build up in the carby.
Click to expand...
thank you


#11

K

kelazier

StarTech said:
Unless the carburetor is properly cleaned and rebuilt those so called jet cleaners will only mask the problems. Many of the 1650 series B&S uses a Nikki carburetor; therefore, once they are opened up new gaskets are needed. Even the main jet will need a new o-ring.

Running the engine until all the fuel is supposedly used up in the carburetor doesn't guarantee that the carburetor won't have problems from residual fuel left in the carburetor.
Click to expand...
thank you


#12

K

kelazier

100 td said:
Turning the fuel off and running it out of fuel lowers the fuel level so the main jet isn't sitting in fuel for 12 months at a time for the varnish to deposit. Turning the fuel off stops the fuel from continuously topping up for 12 months as the fuel slowly evaporates leaving the varnish/impurities behind, concentrating them in the carby. Leaving the fuel on creates a lot of money for folks who charge to get gensets going every year.
Click to expand...
thank you


#13

K

kelazier

StarTech said:
Some generators do need to be started up every few months anyway to keep the rotors fully magnetize.

Yes this does occur but even when ran supposedly dry there is still fuel in the idle and main jet passages as it is impossible to get every bit of fuel out. It is the same when I clean a carburetor as some water/soap is left behind which why I use a non-residual soap. I haven't use either the spray or dip carburetor cleaner since 2014 on any carburetor.

As a repair only shop, repairs is how we stay in business. If no repairs then we go out of business or try to make it as I have the last three months of paying overhead and losing money. Matter of fact my bank account for the business is now under $400 even though I have $33,000 in parts in the warehouse. I currently don't have medical insurance but my doctor is still insisting on me coming to his office for office visit and tests which I am unable to do so my medical problems just have to wait.

And yes I charge to get these carburetors clean but I consider $25-$50 in labor is well worth it considering some these carburetor are a couple hundred dollars. Matter I doing a Generac genset now that carburetor [$130] that having rework the needle seat due water damage. Even Generac charges $60 for the carburetor repair kit. But I am using 82 degree countersink to straighten out the needle seat problem. Now if you think a shop like charging $50 for two hours of work is making a killing then so it be. Even the electricity and hand toolsI use cost anyone doing the work. Besides the customer is paying for things to be do right and not half a$$ done.

Now of course some think we make tons of money every year, well I don't. When I retire in a few years then everyone can go to those shops that have so-call mechanics that can't even find a bad spark plug.
Click to expand...
thank you sir!


#14

M

madeinus

kelazier said:
This is on a generator. The engine has a rough idle and vibrates. Is there such a thing as "timing" on an engine like this? Would it be a carb issue? It starts right up and when I slide the lever from the choke position to run position it starts to stall out about 1/4 of the way over. When I move it back toward the choke position it regains its momentum. Any general thoughts? I can give more details if you need them, but just maybe I'm missing something obvious.
Click to expand...
I used this technique, in the video link below, to clean my generator carb and it runs like new now after soaking it 3 times in Pine-Sol. It has run like new ever since. It's easy and simple and you will be so proud of yourself. Good luck! Carburetor Cleanining 101 Tepco Cycles


#15

M

madeinus

kelazier said:
This is on a generator. The engine has a rough idle and vibrates. Is there such a thing as "timing" on an engine like this? Would it be a carb issue? It starts right up and when I slide the lever from the choke position to run position it starts to stall out about 1/4 of the way over. When I move it back toward the choke position it regains its momentum. Any general thoughts? I can give more details if you need them, but just maybe I'm missing something obvious.
Click to expand...
I used this technique, in the video link below, to clean my generator carb and it runs like new now after soaking it 3 times in Pine-Sol. It has run like new ever since. It's easy and simple and you will be so proud of yourself. Good luck! Carburetor Cleanining 101 Tepco Cycles


#16

M

madeinus

kelazier said:
This is on a generator. The engine has a rough idle and vibrates. Is there such a thing as "timing" on an engine like this? Would it be a carb issue? It starts right up and when I slide the lever from the choke position to run position it starts to stall out about 1/4 of the way over. When I move it back toward the choke position it regains its momentum. Any general thoughts? I can give more details if you need them, but just maybe I'm missing something obvious.
Click to expand...
kelazier said:
This is on a generator. The engine has a rough idle and vibrates. Is there such a thing as "timing" on an engine like this? Would it be a carb issue? It starts right up and when I slide the lever from the choke position to run position it starts to stall out about 1/4 of the way over. When I move it back toward the choke position it regains its momentum. Any general thoughts? I can give more details if you need them, but just maybe I'm missing something obvious.
Click to expand...

I used this technique, in the video link below, to clean my generator carb and it runs like new now after soaking it 3 times in Pine-Sol. It has run like new ever since. It's easy and simple and you will be so proud of yourself. Good luck! Carburetor Cleanining 101 Tepco Cycles


#17

K

kelazier

Thank you everyone for your responses and advice. I have replaced the carb with a new one and the problem persists. I start with the choke on position and let it idle (roughly) for a few seconds and then shift along the spectrum to full throttle. The engine starts to vibrate and stall at full throttle; it runs seemingly fine at half-throttle, without a load. I removed and cleaned the new carb jets and ran a wire throughout all obvious places gas could go. the gaskets are new and seated properly. I'm vexed. Any suggestions?


#18

Scrubcadet10

Scrubcadet10

When it starts to stall at full throttle, spray some starting fluid, or carburetor cleaner/parts cleaner in the intake/straight into the carb... if it runs better, i'd suspect a fuel issue.


#19

K

kelazier

Scrubcadet10 said:
When it starts to stall at full throttle, spray some starting fluid, or carburetor cleaner/parts cleaner in the intake/straight into the carb... if it runs better, i'd suspect a fuel issue.
Click to expand...
Thank you S/C I'll give that a shot this weekend...and let you know how that works.


#20

R

Richard Milhous

If this were a car engine, I'd say it probably has a vacuum leak. That's less common with small engines, but I *have* seen it happen.


#21

K

kelazier

Richard Milhous said:
If this were a car engine, I'd say it probably has a vacuum leak. That's less common with small engines, but I *have* seen it happen.
Click to expand...
Thanks...I'll search for that, too.


#22

R

Richard Milhous

kelazier said:
Thanks...I'll search for that, too.
Click to expand...
You won't find crap. It's a plague with cars, especially older ones, but mowers don't have those leak sources. I suppose a PCV leak is possible in some cases, but in reality it's either the intake/block seal or the carburetor/intake seal. Or, 99%, it's the carburetor and not a vacuum leak. Just saying: check the easy stuff first.


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