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No start issue

#1

C

CLStout

This is with an Ariens 42" hydro tractor, model 936042. I only get a click from the fuel solenoid on the carburetor. Using a voltmeter, I checked the voltage at the energizing wire at the starter solenoid, and I get 9 volts. I get 12.47 volts at the battery and the battery post on the starter solenoid. If I test the voltage on the starter post on the solenoid, I only get 1.6 volts. But here's the real puzzler. I get a very weak spark when I try to jump the 2 posts on the starter solenoid. Nothing at all from the starter itself.
Even if the starter solenoid is faulty, shouldn't there be something from the starter when the 2 posts are jumped?
One thing that it did when I last used it was, when I shut it off, it sputtered instead of shutting down, like it didn't want to shut off.
Also, I was doing the tests with the voltmeter with the clutch/brake pedal depressed and the parking brake on.
Thanks much!


#2

ILENGINE

ILENGINE

Lets do some testing.

With a voltmeter connected to the battery what is the voltage?
Now while still connected to the battery attempt to start the mower, what is the voltage at the battery?
Now move the positive lead from the battery to the energizing wire on the starter solenoid and while attempting to start what is the voltage?
Now move the positive lead to the wire on the starter and while attempting to start what is the voltage?
And finally move the positive test lead to the metal housing of the starter and while attempting to start what is the voltage?


#3

C

CLStout

Voltmeter connected to battery: 12.79 v
Voltmeter connected to battery attempt to start: 7.8 v
Energizing wire: 7.08 v
Starter wire: 0 v
Metal housing: 0 v

I do hear the fuel solenoid on the carburetor working.


#4

ILENGINE

ILENGINE

The 12.79 dropping to 7.8 when attempting to start would indicate a faulty battery. Take it to a local auto parts place for further load testing.


#5

C

CLStout

Is it a bad cell? I just tried to charge it, but the charger says it's at a full charge.


#6

S

slomo

CLStout said:
Is it a bad cell? I just tried to charge it, but the charger says it's at a full charge.
Click to expand...
All batteries and all electrical circuits, must be, LOAD TESTED. Under cranking, assuming all else is good, if your battery drops below 10.5 volts DC, you have a bad battery. Take it to an auto parts store. They will check for free as ILENGINE said.

Your charger doesn't test anything under load. All it does is charge.


#7

C

CLStout

I understand that. I have a load tester, but I haven't used it yet. I would assume that the load tester at the local auto parts store is probably a little more complicated than mine.


#8

ILENGINE

ILENGINE

CLStout said:
I understand that. I have a load tester, but I haven't used it yet. I would assume that the load tester at the local auto parts store is probably a little more complicated than mine.
Click to expand...
It probably is but if you have one of the toaster style load testers give it a go. Most are a 100 amp load, but the one that I purchased probably 20+ years ago is a 50 amp toaster style load tester. Nothing like watching a fully charged battery at 12.7 volts drop to 0 under load.


#9

C

CLStout

You're correct, mine is a toaster style one.
Is there a good dependable make of battery? This one is only a few years old.


#10

ILENGINE

ILENGINE

CLStout said:
You're correct, mine is a toaster style one.
Is there a good dependable make of battery? This one is only a few years old.
Click to expand...
Not really. With a little research you will find no matter the name on the battery most are made by one of 3 companies.


#11

C

CLStout

Thanks. I guess quality is a thing of the past, at least as far as automotive and mower parts is concerned. Sorry state of affairs.


#12

S

slomo

If I recall, been a while, you load test one at 80% of rated cold cranking amp value???. Someone check me on that. So some toaster type might not fully load her down.


#13

C

CLStout

Well, that was a show! Dang thing just about buried the needle in the "replace" end of the meter.


#14

B

bullet bob

A good 'ole tip-of-the-hat to the members here that stepped upped & helped a fella out. Good job guys! (y)


#15

S

stihlmania

CLStout said:
Well, that was a show! Dang thing just about buried the needle in the "replace" end of the meter.
Click to expand...
Load testing the battery is the first thing I do , so easy to eliminate the battery as the problem
and move to other diagnostics.


#16

C

CLStout

Replaced the battery, reconnected the cables, and it started right up!
Thanks to everyone for your help!


#17

S

slomo

CLStout said:
Replaced the battery, reconnected the cables, and it started right up!
Thanks to everyone for your help!
Click to expand...
A-Maz-Zin'. Glad she is running again.


#18

C

CLStout

slomo said:
A-Maz-Zin'. Glad she is running again.
Click to expand...
Gotta say, it's been a long time since it started so quickly and ran so well!


#19

G

Gord Baker

CLStout said:
This is with an Ariens 42" hydro tractor, model 936042. I only get a click from the fuel solenoid on the carburetor. Using a voltmeter, I checked the voltage at the energizing wire at the starter solenoid, and I get 9 volts. I get 12.47 volts at the battery and the battery post on the starter solenoid. If I test the voltage on the starter post on the solenoid, I only get 1.6 volts. But here's the real puzzler. I get a very weak spark when I try to jump the 2 posts on the starter solenoid. Nothing at all from the starter itself.
Even if the starter solenoid is faulty, shouldn't there be something from the starter when the 2 posts are jumped?
One thing that it did when I last used it was, when I shut it off, it sputtered instead of shutting down, like it didn't want to shut off.
Also, I was doing the tests with the voltmeter with the clutch/brake pedal depressed and the parking brake on.
Thanks much!
Click to expand...
The 'click' means the Fuel Solenoid is working I believe. Remove and Clean all battery connections including Grounds. Use a cable to go directly from + Battery post to Starter. That will narrow your problem. If you have a connector near the key switch with multiple wires, open it and clean the tiny terminals. Use Pep Battery spray on them and reconnect.


#20

F

Freddie21

Good Old Walmart. I've been using their batteries for many years and will hold up as well as ones with twice the price. $30 for a 230 amp, which is all needed for a single cylinder. I think $40 for a 275 amp. I bring it home, top off the charge and always put a battery tender when not used for more than a month. I easily get 4 years or more. Bring it indoors for the Winter.

Also clean all your battery cable connections. Both ends. Make sure the solenoid and engine mounting bolts are tight.


#21

G

garyoldfart

The newer testers here in ohio anyway won't test under load.
Alternator or battery they just say it is fine. After two or 3 trips
to 2 different stores we finally determined a bad battery cell.


#22

ILENGINE

ILENGINE

Freddie21 said:
Good Old Walmart. I've been using their batteries for many years and will hold up as well as ones with twice the price. $30 for a 230 amp, which is all needed for a single cylinder. I think $40 for a 275 amp. I bring it home, top off the charge and always put a battery tender when not used for more than a month. I easily get 4 years or more. Bring it indoors for the Winter.

Also clean all your battery cable connections. Both ends. Make sure the solenoid and engine mounting bolts are tight.
Click to expand...
I used Walmart batteries for years but ran into a situation where the batteries on the shelf were 12-14 months old. And since the batteries are wet charge/wet ship are supposed to be put into service within 6 months of manufacture.


#23

S

SCAGCAT

CLStout said:
This is with an Ariens 42" hydro tractor, model 936042. I only get a click from the fuel solenoid on the carburetor. Using a voltmeter, I checked the voltage at the energizing wire at the starter solenoid, and I get 9 volts. I get 12.47 volts at the battery and the battery post on the starter solenoid. If I test the voltage on the starter post on the solenoid, I only get 1.6 volts. But here's the real puzzler. I get a very weak spark when I try to jump the 2 posts on the starter solenoid. Nothing at all from the starter itself.
Even if the starter solenoid is faulty, shouldn't there be something from the starter when the 2 posts are jumped?
One thing that it did when I last used it was, when I shut it off, it sputtered instead of shutting down, like it didn't want to shut off.
Also, I was doing the tests with the voltmeter with the clutch/brake pedal depressed and the parking brake on.
Thanks much!
Click to expand...
I had the same issue with 37hp vanguard. The fix was surprisingly easy after months of frustration This from amazion took care of it has not failed since. Took a few minutes to install.

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#24

A

AChrome

Best thing to do with your batteries at the end of the season is to make sure they are fully charged and put them on a trickle charger all winter. I've gotten as much as 5+ years out of the Wallyworld batteries.


#25

H

heyinway

Battery is junk.


#26

C

CLStout

SCAGCAT said:
I had the same issue with 37hp vanguard. The fix was surprisingly easy after months of frustration This from amazion took care of it has not failed since. Took a few minutes to install.
Click to expand...
Already had that installed 👍


#27

C

CLStout

I'm using a battery that came out of a UTV that I have. I replaced that battery because it didn't seem to have enough CCA's to start it. This battery is a 300 CCA one. I put it on a charger before I installed it, and after hooking up the starter assist relay, it started right up with just a touch of the key. Now it's taking at least 2 hits of the key to get it to spin over. The battery is showing 12.29v at rest, and after it's running for a few minutes, the charging system is showing at least 13.01v. Is this battery shot, as well?


#28

ILENGINE

ILENGINE

CLStout said:
I'm using a battery that came out of a UTV that I have. I replaced that battery because it didn't seem to have enough CCA's to start it. This battery is a 300 CCA one. I put it on a charger before I installed it, and after hooking up the starter assist relay, it started right up with just a touch of the key. Now it's taking at least 2 hits of the key to get it to spin over. The battery is showing 12.29v at rest, and after it's running for a few minutes, the charging system is showing at least 13.01v. Is this battery shot, as well?
Click to expand...
Maybe. Need to see what the battery voltage is while cranking. If dropping below 10 volts then new battery time.


#29

C

CLStout

I will do that, and thanks 👍


#30

C

CLStout

ILENGINE said:
Maybe. Need to see what the battery voltage is while cranking. If dropping below 10 volts then new battery time.
Click to expand...
Well, I just checked it with a voltmeter. It drops to 9.62v during cranking.


#31

S

slomo

CLStout said:
Well, I just checked it with a voltmeter. It drops to 9.62v during cranking.
Click to expand...
She dead.


#32

C

CLStout

Dang, batteries sure don't last long anymore 🥺


#33

S

slomo

ILENGINE said:
I used Walmart batteries for years but ran into a situation where the batteries on the shelf were 12-14 months old. And since the batteries are wet charge/wet ship are supposed to be put into service within 6 months of manufacture.
Click to expand...
Stunned that ANYTHING at wally's is that old on the shelf. Weekly ours has the shelves raped clean of groceries. I always check the born on date before buying.


#34

C

CLStout

I wonder if maybe I should buy an AGM battery for the UTV and put the newer battery in the mower. It's a 340 CCA.


#35

S

slomo

CLStout said:
Dang, batteries sure don't last long anymore 🥺
Click to expand...
If you remove during winter, put a Battery Tender on her, she will last 5 plus, agreed. Even those cheap wallymart batteries I've had good luck with.


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