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Generac GP7000E Generator outputting only 110v

Oct 23, 2022#1

oldlawnguy

Generac Model: 0056260 Serial: 5452944 (don't know the build date)

Unit is basically/looks new, however it only outputs 110v not 120v and (while testing) blown out LED bulbs and Alexa devices. Trying to help a neighbor who wants to give to me and go buy another generator.

Pulled the schematic and suspect the

GENERAC 0G84440101 CAPACITOR VOLTAGE REGULATOR

Any tips on how to confirm this and or what else to check to help troubleshoot?

I tried to lookup the above part number and it appears no one has it including Generac, so is there any cross reference part numbers to source?

It's a $19.00 part!

Thanks

Oct 23, 2022#2

StarTech

You need to contact Generac on this one to verify that 28 microfarad capacitor is the correct one.

Wiring schematic shows a 47 microfarad 450 vac capacitor yet the pn given is a 28 microfarad 450 vac capacitor.

Oct 23, 2022#3

oldlawnguy

StarTech said:
You need to contact Generac on this one to verify that 28 microfarad capacitor is the correct one.

Wiring schematic shows a 47 microfarad 450 vac capacitor yet the pn given is a 28 microfarad 450 vac capacitor.

Good catch Star!!! I pulled the pn from the parts list. Where did you get the info 0G84440101 is 28mf? I'm going to call them on Mon.

Thanks!

Oct 23, 2022#4

StarTech

Oct 23, 2022#5

oldlawnguy

StarTech said:
View attachment 62603

Interesting... I did find the part on Generac website, my bad as I was using "g" instead of G. Let's see what Generac support says on 28uf .vs 47uf as well as getting to root cause. Thanks again Star!!!

Oct 23, 2022#6

ILENGINE

Double check the engine rpm's had a generac generator a few years back that was only putting out 120 total instead of the 240 for both legs. Found out that it was only running half throttle. After speeding the engine up to the correct 3750 has correct voltage.

Oct 24, 2022#7

oldlawnguy

ILENGINE said:
Double check the engine rpm's had a generac generator a few years back that was only putting out 120 total instead of the 240 for both legs. Found out that it was only running half throttle. After speeding the engine up to the correct 3750 has correct voltage.

Thanks ILENGINE
I did notice the choke was on 1/2 way. Will put a tach in it and measure.

oldlawnguy said:
Interesting... I did find the part on Generac website, my bad as I was using "g" instead of G. Let's see what Generac support says on 28uf .vs 47uf as well as getting to root cause. Thanks again Star!!!

Pulled off the OG84440101 It's 28uF part not 47uf as wiring diagram stated. Diagram has Rev E ECO chain so I wonder if 47uf was a phase in part. This unit was built in 2009

Measured with 2 different multimeters. On DCV was expecting like 5v, but highest I got on multiple readings was 2.01v but kept decreasing steadily as probes stayed attached. Other multimeter gave 0V.

Got 0.L for Ohms and no continuity. Seems bad to me unless I missed something??? Anything else to measure before ordering part?

Oct 24, 2022#8

StarTech

Capacitor don't test an OHMs meter or continuity meter as they tend to charge up. Also you will get false readings. To test a capacitor you need a capacitance meter. Some more expensive multimeters has this test available.

The reading should be between 26.6uf to 29.4uf when tested with one these meters which is +- 5%.

Oct 24, 2022#9

oldlawnguy

StarTech said:
Capacitor don't test an OHMs meter or continuity meter as they tend to charge up. Also you will get false readings. To test a capacitor you need a capacitance meter. Some more expensive multimeters has this test available.

The reading should be between 26.6uf to 29.4uf when tested with one these meters which is +- 5%.

Ahhhhhh light shines on marble head.... Thanks Star!

Oct 25, 2022#10

oldlawnguy

oldlawnguy said:
Ahhhhhh light shines on marble head.... Thanks Star!

Star got ahold of a MM that measures capacitance... 27.52uf so it's good.

I asked neighbor more questions and he said the engine ran "rough" and he and electrician could only test generator with 1/2 throttle???

I'm gonna pick up on ILENGINE suggestion and go to engine side. Neighbor said the gas has plenty of Stabil in gas and I suspect that "plenty" may be the issue.

Gonna drain gas and put some of my own in a see what happens.

The generator was stored in cellar and always drained the tank and had regular maintenance. It literally looks like it just came out of the box.

Oct 25, 2022#11

ILENGINE

oldlawnguy said:
Star got ahold of a MM that measures capacitance... 27.52uf so it's good.

I asked neighbor more questions and he said the engine ran "rough" and he and electrician could only test generator with 1/2 throttle???

I'm gonna pick up on ILENGINE suggestion and go to engine side. Neighbor said the gas has plenty of Stabil in gas and I suspect that "plenty" may be the issue.

Gonna drain gas and put some of my own in a see what happens.

The generator was stored in cellar and always drained the tank and had regular maintenance. It literally looks like it just came out of the box.

If that new meter will test frequency put it on that setting and insert the leads into the outlet. if getting around 30 hertz instead of 60 you most likely found the issue.

Oct 25, 2022#12

oldlawnguy

ILENGINE said:
If that new meter will test frequency put it on that setting and insert the leads into the outlet. if getting around 30 hertz instead of 60 you most likely found the issue.

It does... was playing with new toy settings and placed into wall outlet by couch and got a 121v @ 59Hz reading. If it's around 30Hz, you saved me from draining gas (not much in tank).

I'll add some and let it run a while and see if it settles down and then take another reading.

Thanks for the tip ILENGINE!

Oct 27, 2022#13

oldlawnguy

oldlawnguy said:
It does... was playing with new toy settings and placed into wall outlet by couch and got a 121v @ 59Hz reading. If it's around 30Hz, you saved me from draining gas (not much in tank).

I'll add some and let it run a while and see if it settles down and then take another reading.

Thanks for the tip ILENGINE!

Added my own gas and started up Generac and she ran rough (3500 rpms) for 5 min then settled down.
Tach reading 3660 rpms at full throttle no load
Measured fluctating readings of 99-110v all at 60.x-61Hz

Head scratcher, any tips on what to try next???

For comparison fired up my own generator;
Tach reading 3660 rpms at full throttle no load
Measured reading of 125v all at 60.x-61Hz

Oct 28, 2022#14

oldlawnguy

oldlawnguy said:
It does... was playing with new toy settings and placed into wall outlet by couch and got a 121v @ 59Hz reading. If it's around 30Hz, you saved me from draining gas (not much in tank).

I'll add some and let it run a while and see if it settles down and then take another reading.

Thanks for the tip ILENGINE!

ILENGINE said:
If that new meter will test frequency put it on that setting and insert the leads into the outlet. if getting around 30 hertz instead of 60 you most likely found the issue.

Oct 28, 2022#15

ILENGINE

oldlawnguy said:
Added my own gas and started up Generac and she ran rough (3500 rpms) for 5 min then settled down.
Tach reading 3660 rpms at full throttle no load
Measured fluctating readings of 99-110v all at 60.x-61Hz

Head scratcher, any tips on what to try next???

For comparison fired up my own generator;
Tach reading 3660 rpms at full throttle no load
Measured reading of 125v all at 60.x-61Hz

That frequency says that the engine is at the correct rpm. Could still be a voltage regulator issue, but could be other issues like brush contact issues on the slip rings if this model has brushes. Also could be issue with the rotor, which you don't want to get into. ie $$$$$$$

Oct 28, 2022#16

StarTech

Oct 28, 2022#17

oldlawnguy

ILENGINE said:
That frequency says that the engine is at the correct rpm. Could still be a voltage regulator issue, but could be other issues like brush contact issues on the slip rings if this model has brushes. Also could be issue with the rotor, which you don't want to get into. ie $$$$$$$

Oct 28, 2022#18

oldlawnguy

Yup Star beat me it's brushless. Anything to try to eliminate the rotor and focus back to voltage regular which I confirmed its within 29uf spec???

Thanks!

Oct 28, 2022#19

oldlawnguy

StarTech said:
View attachment 62667

DId some more poking around on help sites,

for a brushless alternator: troubleshooting test is to disconnect capacitor and connect MM to the 2 alternator leads and measure running AC voltage. If it measures 5v it's good and capacitor is bad.

If not 5v then alternator is bad and Generac wants you to buy a new generator at that price!!!! Maybe they design them to fail after x hours? :^(

Oct 31, 2022#20

oldlawnguy

oldlawnguy said:
DId some more poking around on help sites,

for a brushless alternator: troubleshooting test is to disconnect capacitor and connect MM to the 2 alternator leads and measure running AC voltage. If it measures 5v it's good and capacitor is bad.

If not 5v then alternator is bad and Generac wants you to buy a new generator at that price!!!! Maybe they design them to fail after x hours? :^(

I measured the out of the alternator on 2 different MM and got 3.5v and 3.7v AC
A 5v +/- 2v AC should be a indicator of alternator working. Measured voltage regulator again and got 27.5 uF

Put on my dunce cap. I was hoping to get to root cause, but still scorching my head. Any ideas fellas?

Thanks!

Oct 31, 2022#21

Hammermechanicman

See if you can find a 35uf cap for it and set the RPM so it runs at 62Hz no load.

Oct 31, 2022#22

oldlawnguy

Hammermechanicman said:
See if you can find a 35uf cap for it and set the RPM so it runs at 62Hz no load.

Star picked up on the wire diagram Rev E it called for a 47uf cap, yet the replacement part # lists 28uf.

Should I try finding a 47uf cap and do the same test?

Thanks!

Oct 31, 2022#23

ILENGINE

Came across this little tidbit in the Generac service manual

NOTE: The voltage of a brushless capacitive discharge generator will start low and increase as load is applied So the 110 volts may be normal until a load is applied.

Nov 1, 2022#24

StarTech

You got to put that torch out when not in use....And never try yo do a haircut with one. <lol>

But here is some general info about brush-less alternators.

This would that you just might need a slightly larger cap mounted remotely. You can parallel say a 5 uF capacitor temporarily for test purposes. Just make whatever you use is non-polarized version.
Polarized version will explode; sometimes dangerously. I have had some to send shrapnel all over the shop. One took a week to piece enough together to find out what size it was.

Nov 1, 2022#25

oldlawnguy

ILENGINE said:
Came across this little tidbit in the Generac service manual

NOTE: The voltage of a brushless capacitive discharge generator will start low and increase as load is applied So the 110 volts may be normal until a load is applied.

Interesting ILENGINE. I'm going to put a load on it and then measure AC voltage. Neighbor was testing with a LED lightbulb and stated it flickered and then blew out. He tried and Alexa device and said that blew out too.

I've seen low fat LED bulbs flicker on regular power so that probably not a sizable load or good test.

Nov 1, 2022#26

oldlawnguy

StarTech said:
You got to put that torch out when not in use....And never try yo do a haircut with one. <lol>

But here is some general info about brush-less alternators.
View attachment 62705
This would that you just might need a slightly larger cap mounted remotely. You can parallel say a 5 uF capacitor temporarily for test purposes. Just make whatever you use is non-polarized version.
Polarized version will explode; sometimes dangerously. I have had some to send shrapnel all over the shop. One took a week to piece enough together to find out what size it was.

Thanks Star useful info from you and ILENGINE. Was hoping to get some info from the Pro manual side as Generac is pretty much closed to DYI.

I guess a better way to test a brushless is to connect it to an inlet to your house and then turn on some breakers and then measure AC voltage.

My generator is older and has brushes so not an apples to apples comparison. Your catch on the 47uf drawing .vs 28uf replacement part is like a 60% boost. Not sure if it's a cut and paste typo or an actual phase in ECO. If there was a service bulletin on a FCO for this model that would be interesting too.

Thanks for the above info.

Nov 1, 2022#27

ILENGINE

oldlawnguy said:
Thanks Star useful info from you and ILENGINE. Was hoping to get some info from the Pro manual side as Generac is pretty much closed to DYI.

I guess a better way to test a brushless is to connect it to an inlet to your house and then turn on some breakers and then measure AC voltage.

My generator is older and has brushes so not an apples to apples comparison. Your catch on the 47uf drawing .vs 28uf replacement part is like a 60% boost. Not sure if it's a cut and paste typo or an actual phase in ECO. If there was a service bulletin on a FCO for this model that would be interesting too.

Thanks for the above info.

I would connect the voltage meter to one outlet on the generator and then plug a drill. angle grinder, etc into the other outlet and see what the voltage is under load.

Nov 1, 2022#28

oldlawnguy

ILENGINE said:
I would connect the voltage meter to one outlet on the generator and then plug a drill. angle grinder, etc into the other outlet and see what the voltage is under load.

yes was planning to do drill, extra hair dryer etc.

I was implying that the master electrician who installed the 30A inlet/gentran switch would have tested via connecting to inlet and e.g. turn on the breaker to garage and test some stuff with neighbor.

I'm surprised how a master electrician would not understand how brushless/brush/inverter gas generator all differ and work.

Thanks

Nov 2, 2022#29

oldlawnguy

oldlawnguy said:
yes was planning to do drill, extra hair dryer etc.

I was implying that the master electrician who installed the 30A inlet/gentran switch would have tested via connecting to inlet and e.g. turn on the breaker to garage and test some stuff with neighbor.

I'm surprised how a master electrician would not understand how brushless/brush/inverter gas generator all differ and work.

Thanks

OK fellas here is what I measured:

I also checked the entire distribution box wire connections from generator:

No load measurements: constantly fluctuating between 107-112v 61.2-62.1 Hz
Running Drill :106-110V
Running 1500w small desk space heater: 111-113v

Something is wrong with this puppy, maybe diodes, but I think I'm gonna give back to neighbor and recommend he go get that inverter generator he's eying.

I learned a ton here on brushless .vs brush generators and want to thank Star, ILENGINE and Hammer for helping this DYI stiff learn some things. Hopefully this thread can help someone else too.

You guys are the best!

Nov 2, 2022#30

Hammermechanicman

An inverter genset or one with a AVR would probably be a better choice for power backup purposes.

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Generac GP7000E Generator outputting only 110v

GENERAC 0G84440101 CAPACITOR VOLTAGE REGULATOR

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Generac GP7000E Generator outputting only 110v

GENERAC 0G84440101 CAPACITOR VOLTAGE REGULATOR​

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