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Dead Mower

#1

T

Tim6559

Hey guys. 2015 hustler raptor 60", Kohler engine. While mulching leaves today, she just died suddenly. She won't even turn over. Gas and battery are fine. I bypassed the seat switch (just jumped the wires together) and that did nothing. What else could it be???


#2

StarTech

StarTech

Look for the 15 amp main fuse and check it. If it is blown and you was using the elecric clutch then it is possible that the electric clutch is partially shorted or have bad place touching ground at random


#3

T

Tim6559

StarTech said:
Look for the 15 amp main fuse and check it. If it is blown and you was using the elecric clutch then it is possible that the electric clutch is partially shorted or have bad place touching ground at random
Click to expand...
If you're talking about the fuse just off of the starter solenoid, checked it. It's good


#4

T

Tim6559

Any other ideas guys? Could it be the PTO engagement switch? I see some relays or something in there


#5

R

Rivets

Time for electrical troubleshooting. Here is the procedure I use, but others do it in other ways.
Electrical problems can be very easy or very difficult, depending on four things.

1. How well you understand basic electricity.
2. What tools you have and know how to use.
3. How well you follow directions.
4. You don't overlook or assume anything and verify everything.

Remember we cannot see what you are doing. You are our eyes, ears and fingers in solving this problem. You must be as accurate as you can when you report back. The two basic tools we will ask you to use are a test light and a multi-meter. If you have an assistant when going through these tests it would be very helpful. These steps work the best when done in order, so please don't jump around. Now let's solve this problem.

First, check the fuse(s), check battery connections for corrosion (clean if necessary) and voltage - above 12.5 volts should be good. Check and make sure the chassis ground is clean and tight.
Second, check for power from the battery to one of the large terminals on the solenoid. One of the wires is connected directly to the battery and has power all the time so one of the large terminals should light a test light or show 12 volts on a meter at all times.
Third, check for power at the small terminal of the solenoid while depressing the clutch/brake pedal and holding the key in the start position (you may need an assistant to sit in the seat to override the safety switch). If your solenoid is a four wire solenoid, check both small wire terminals as one is ground and the other is power from the ignition switch. If your solenoid is a three wire solenoid, make sure the solenoid body is not corroded where it bolts to the chassis of the mower as this is your ground path back to the battery. If in doubt, remove the solenoid and clean the mounting area down to bare metal. If there is no power to the small terminal then your problem is most likely a safety switch, ignition switch or in the wiring.
Fourth, check for power on the other large terminal of the solenoid while holding the key in the start position (you may need an assistant to sit in the seat to override the safety switch).
Fifth, check for power at the starter while holding the key in the start position (assistant again).
Sixth, check your ground circuit back to the battery.

After you have gone through each of the above steps, let us know what happened when you did each step. At that point we will have great info to tell you how to proceed. Remember you are our eyes, ears, and fingers, so please be as accurate as possible.

Be as specific as possible with voltage readings as this will help diagnose your problem quicker. If you do not know how to perform the above checks, just ask and I will try to guide you through it. Youtube also has some videos and as you know a picture is worth a thousand words.


#6

T

Tim6559

Rivets said:
Time for electrical troubleshooting. Here is the procedure I use, but others do it in other ways.
Electrical problems can be very easy or very difficult, depending on four things.

1. How well you understand basic electricity.
2. What tools you have and know how to use.
3. How well you follow directions.
4. You don't overlook or assume anything and verify everything.

Remember we cannot see what you are doing. You are our eyes, ears and fingers in solving this problem. You must be as accurate as you can when you report back. The two basic tools we will ask you to use are a test light and a multi-meter. If you have an assistant when going through these tests it would be very helpful. These steps work the best when done in order, so please don't jump around. Now let's solve this problem.

First, check the fuse(s), check battery connections for corrosion (clean if necessary) and voltage - above 12.5 volts should be good. Check and make sure the chassis ground is clean and tight.
Second, check for power from the battery to one of the large terminals on the solenoid. One of the wires is connected directly to the battery and has power all the time so one of the large terminals should light a test light or show 12 volts on a meter at all times.
Third, check for power at the small terminal of the solenoid while depressing the clutch/brake pedal and holding the key in the start position (you may need an assistant to sit in the seat to override the safety switch). If your solenoid is a four wire solenoid, check both small wire terminals as one is ground and the other is power from the ignition switch. If your solenoid is a three wire solenoid, make sure the solenoid body is not corroded where it bolts to the chassis of the mower as this is your ground path back to the battery. If in doubt, remove the solenoid and clean the mounting area down to bare metal. If there is no power to the small terminal then your problem is most likely a safety switch, ignition switch or in the wiring.
Fourth, check for power on the other large terminal of the solenoid while holding the key in the start position (you may need an assistant to sit in the seat to override the safety switch).
Fifth, check for power at the starter while holding the key in the start position (assistant again).
Sixth, check your ground circuit back to the battery.

After you have gone through each of the above steps, let us know what happened when you did each step. At that point we will have great info to tell you how to proceed. Remember you are our eyes, ears, and fingers, so please be as accurate as possible.

Be as specific as possible with voltage readings as this will help diagnose your problem quicker. If you do not know how to perform the above checks, just ask and I will try to guide you through it. Youtube also has some videos and as you know a picture is worth a thousand words.
Click to expand...
I appreciate the write up. I'm a mechanical engineer so I'm quite savvy. Have an entire workshop of tools including multimeters. However, I don't think it's a solenoid or any sort of main power issue. A bad solenoid or fuse wouldn't cause it to suddenly due while mowing. That's why I'm leaning more towards one of the safety switches or some sort of relay. I bypassed the seat safety switch. I'm going to check the break switches next. So my question is, what else is there? There's alot going on in the PTO engage switch. Wondering if it could be in there?


#7

R

Rivets

I understand, but the first thing I taught my high school students when we started electrical troubleshooting is “NEVER ASSUME ANYTHING, TEST EVERYTHING IN ORDER”. I’m sure you’ve heard this more than once. As I said there are different ways to do things.


#8

T

Tim6559

Replaced both the PTO and Ignition switch. They were cheap on Amazon. Not sure which one it was, but that did the trick.


#9

Tiger Small Engine

Tiger Small Engine

Tim5779 said:
Replaced both the PTO and Ignition switch. They were cheap on Amazon. Not sure which one it was, but that did the trick.
Click to expand...

You replaced two parts without troubleshooting the actual issue. I am glad you got it resolved and repaired, however, replacing parts does not “make you savvy.” Just like I don’t work on electrical engineering issues everyday, you don’t go hands on with outdoor power equipment everyday. Nothing replaces real world experience.


#10

T

Tim6559

Tiger Small Engine said:
You replaced two parts without troubleshooting the actual issue. I am glad you got it resolved and repaired, however, replacing parts does not “make you savvy.” Just like I don’t work on electrical engineering issues everyday, you don’t go hands on with outdoor power equipment everyday. Nothing replaces real world experience.
Click to expand...
It does make me savvy numb nuts....and smarter than you obviously. I already expressed it wasn't a battery, fuse, or solenoid issue. I also ruled out the seat switch. That only leaves ignition and/or PTO switch. There are 10 leads between those two switches. I could be a super duper smart guy like you and spend hours tracing every one of those leads, or spend $30 for both on Amazon with next day delivery and have them swapped out in 10 mins. Time is money smart guy....I think I won that battle


#11

StarTech

StarTech

Just another person that just throws parts at a problem and hope to hit on the solution.

If you were so tech savvy you would have use the electrical schematic and figure where the problem. but most DIYers are too lazy to learn how to read electrical schematics.

You just got lucky as it could had been a starter relay or neutral safety switch or even mouse chewed wire. The seat only controls the kill relay and fuel solenoid.
1701863533707.png


#12

T

Tim6559

StarTech said:
Just another person that just throws parts at a problem and hope to hit on the solution.

If you were so tech savvy you would have use the electrical schematic and figure where the problem. but most DIYers are too lazy to learn how to read electrical schematics.

You just got lucky as it could had been a starter relay or neutral safety switch or even mouse chewed wire. The seat only controls the kill relay and fuel solenoid.
View attachment 67416
Click to expand...
Ya'll talk alot of shit for people who offered no help what so ever. The issue is fixed with minimal time, effort, and $$$ Go strut your tiny balls elsewhere.

FYI....your little lawnmower knowledge is cute and all. But I'm an Engineer at Allison Transmission. I literally design the worlds most advanced propulsion systems. I know you think you're smart, but in comparison, you don't know shit


#13

R

Rivets

You came here looking for help, now you say we don’t know what we are talking about. The techs on this site provided you with a few different ways we solve problems. I for one provided a step by step procedure I use to solve problems, but you blew that off, because you say you’re more savy than we are. Seems to me you are now contradicting yourself. You either needed help or you didn’t need help, just wanted to show us how savy you are and can solve the problem by throwing parts at it, then get a pat on the back. Would you act the same way when you took your car in for service and the techs charged you for parts they throw into it instead of following an industry procedure to find and fix the problem. You fixed the problem, but you really don’t know the exact cause because you replaced multiple parts, not diagnosing which one was bad. If I did that to a customer and charged him for all parts, plus time, I would be out of business. On top of that your language shows us you don’t know how to deal and work with others, especially those you deem to be inferior to you. We’ll know how savy you are when we see you helping others who come here for help. Until then I would stick to what you really think you know.


#14

StarTech

StarTech

Just because somebody knows one line of products does not ever mean they know everything. I personally know that I don't know everything but at I am willing to listen to others and learn what I can.

As far the OP here I just ignore him from now on.


#15

I

ILENGINE

Bye Tim.


#16

G

GeneralEclectic

He probably never changed/checked the oil. Engine seized and the story about the switches was a convenient out.


#17

T

Tim6559

I find it hillarious that none of you Karen's had anything to say until I said I fixed it myself without your help 🤣


#18

R

Rivets

Before you make comments like that I suggest you reread the thread again. I guess you couldn’t read or understand post #2 & #5. Both were suggesting where to look or how to troubleshoot your problem, which you asked for. They were posted before you told us you threw parts at it in an attempt to fix it. Anyone reading your last post will see that we were trying to help you the way we help customers at our different locations. We follow industry procedures, pinpoint the problem and then repair the problem with appropriate parts. We don’t make guesses, add unneeded parts or try buffalo customers by trying to say we’re the smartest guy around and know everything. If you are as savvy as you claim, you will know that now is the time to bite your tongue and realize that anymore you post will not make you look good or smart.


#19

B

bbirder

Tim,
I don't have a dog in this fight, but you lost this one buddy. You bragging about your degree and occupation just shows your immaturity. You also seem to have a temper issue. What did you expect for your parts changing diagnosis----A trophy!.


#20

T

Tim6559

Alright look ladies. I came to ya'll with an issue. After a week and a half of no help, I took my limited knowledge and went with what I knew. It's not a main power issue (you'd know that if you read my OP). There's 2 switches, and 2 relays that would cause the machine to shut off suddenly during operation if they failed. Switches are 10x more likely to fail. Both switches were old and ugly. Both switches were $15 on Amazon. Replaced, fixed, end of story. But for some reason that triggered all the sissies on this site and I caught all kinds off butthurt hell. I only mentioned my credentials when ya'll started attacking my intelligence. Ya'll sound like a bunch of fuckin Biden lovers 🤦‍♂️


#21

StarTech

StarTech

What he doesn't realize is that even if he change the switches a faulty Delphi terminal could still be at fault; although, it is making contact for now if he didn't inspect the terminals. This why you troubleshoot a problem instead just throwing parts at it and hoping you found the problem. He sounds like the mechanics at new car dealers that just throw parts at a problem and charge the customer for those parts even the parts replaced were not bad.

That is like the time I had brought a new car and a week later it failed. The first thing the dealer shop barked was that they didn't if it was covered or not by the bumper to bumper warranty. Boy did they changed their mind when I called my lawyer. They gave me a list of things they replaced including the actual failed part, the distributor. They still tried billing me for all those parts and labor but I had them by the balls in writing. I don't know they ever got that $8,000 from Plymouth or not but I didn't pay them one red cent.

I had one DIYer that changed everything major starting component wise trying to fix a starting issue to only finally give up and bring the mower into the shop. The problem was a fifty cent Delphi terminal. He spend well over $400 on electrical parts and still didn't fix the problem. What worst he had thrown away perfectly good parts.

For education it is only worth it when you know how to apply it. Beside most schools, colleges, and universities are not fully up to date on the latest information. There is still a lot OTJ self training a person has to do. That is if they are willing to try to learn new things. I got one member of the family that has a four college degree that couldn't even fry an egg without a YouTube video and he designs computers for a living. He had depended on his wife to do the cooking until she died.


#22

Tiger Small Engine

Tiger Small Engine

StarTech said:
What he doesn't realize is that even if he change the switches a faulty Delphi terminal could still be at fault; although, it is making contact for now if he didn't inspect the terminals. This why you troubleshoot a problem instead just throwing parts at it and hoping you found the problem. He sounds like the mechanics at new car dealers that just throw parts at a problem and charge the customer for those parts even the parts replaced were not bad.

That is like the time I had brought a new car and a week later it failed. The first thing the dealer shop barked was that they didn't if it was covered or not by the bumper to bumper warranty. Boy did they changed their mind when I called my lawyer. They gave me a list of things they replaced including the actual failed part, the distributor. They still tried billing me for all those parts and labor but I had them by the balls in writing. I don't know they ever got that $8,000 from Plymouth or not but I didn't pay them one red cent.

I had one DIYer that changed everything major starting component wise trying to fix a starting issue to only finally give up and bring the mower into the shop. The problem was a fifty cent Delphi terminal. He spend well over $400 on electrical parts and still didn't fix the problem. What worst he had thrown away perfectly good parts.

For education it is only worth it when you know how to apply it. Beside most schools, colleges, and universities are not fully up to date on the latest information. There is still a lot OTJ self training a person has to do. That is if they are willing to try to learn new things. I got one member of the family that has a four college degree that couldn't even fry an egg without a YouTube video and he designs computers for a living. He had depended on his wife to do the cooking until she died.
Click to expand...

Out of respect for the members and this forum, it is a pleasure and breath of fresh air to rarely see what we just witnessed with “Tim”, the dude that posted the question originally. He immediately got defensive, proceeded to one up everyone he could, bragged about his credentials, then resorted to name calling. He called me “numb nuts” with 9 minutes of my reply. I gave it a day to see what happened and other people responded. I appreciate everyone on this forum. Knowledge is power. But don’t abuse that power.
Merry Christmas


#23

R

Rivets

I wonder if Tim ever got his hydraulic problem he posted about last year solved by throwing parts at it? Never came back after two members posted possible solutions. Hope he learns how to be a “Civil Engineer “ when he comes back for more help.


#24

T

Tim6559

Oh I won't be coming back with any questions trust me. You guys are worthless. I'm just here to watch you guys stroke each other's minimum wage balls.


#25

StarTech

StarTech

I would not count him being ever civil. I know if he was on the forum I manage he would be already barred. I simply don't put the like on that forum.


#26

R

Rivets

Because you are so ”savvy” most people around you are worthless. I personally would rather be dumb and worthless, but still be appreciated by those I try to help, than savvy, educated and not be appreciated by his own mother, because she tried to teach him how to talk to people in a civil way. In school we had a description for those administrators, “IQ SMART, BUT COMMON SENCE KNOWLEDGE OF A ROCK”. Most never caught on hearing “Here comes Rocky”. I wouldn’t bar him, because this forum needs something to laugh at besides the MOWER HUMOR thread, although he might be the guy n many of those pictures.


#27

R

Rivets

Just figured this out, yes I’m slow. Tim is showing us, by his language and common sense, that he is the Sanitary Engineer for Allison Transmission.


#28

StarTech

StarTech

At least he knows how to shovel it.:ROFLMAO:


#29

X

xj61975

Tim5779 said:
It does make me savvy numb nuts....and smarter than you obviously. I already expressed it wasn't a battery, fuse, or solenoid issue. I also ruled out the seat switch. That only leaves ignition and/or PTO switch. There are 10 leads between those two switches. I could be a super duper smart guy like you and spend hours tracing every one of those leads, or spend $30 for both on Amazon with next day delivery and have them swapped out in 10 mins. Time is money smart guy....I think I won that battle
Click to expand...
As a Professional engineer AND a believer in logical troubleshooting I have to ask why you bother requesting advice on this forum as you are obviously much more "savvy" than any of us could ever hope to be. Glad I don't have to interface with you in the engineering world.


#30

JoeZ

JoeZ

Tim5779 said:
Hey guys. 2015 hustler raptor 60", Kohler engine. While mulching leaves today, she just died suddenly. She won't even turn over. Gas and battery are fine. I bypassed the seat switch (just jumped the wires together) and that did nothing. What else could it be???
Click to expand...
I followed this post & see you have repaired the issue. Just for a possible future "died suddenly" issue I had several units that had bad coils. A bad coil will shut down a running unit, once cooled off it will allow it to start again. Although a bad coil will not prevent the engine from turning over. Stay safe, Joe Z


#31

M

mmoffitt

Tim5779 said:
I appreciate the write up. I'm a mechanical engineer so I'm quite savvy. Have an entire workshop of tools including multimeters. However, I don't think it's a solenoid or any sort of main power issue. A bad solenoid or fuse wouldn't cause it to suddenly due while mowing. That's why I'm leaning more towards one of the safety switches or some sort of relay. I bypassed the seat safety switch. I'm going to check the break switches next. So my question is, what else is there? There's alot going on in the PTO engage switch. Wondering if it could be in there?Sir
Tim5779 said:
It does make me savvy numb nuts....and smarter than you obviously. I already expressed it wasn't a battery, fuse, or solenoid issue. I also ruled out the seat switch. That only leaves ignition and/or PTO switch. There are 10 leads between those two switches. I could be a super duper smart guy like you and spend hours tracing every one of those leads, or spend $30 for both on Amazon with next day delivery and have them swapped out in 10 mins. Time is money smart guy....I think I won that battle
Click to expand...
Heh Tim The ME I am an ME TOO, TIM....Be a polite ME, TIM Don't give us ME's a bad Name... Tim I was also an Aircraft Maintenance Specialist in the USAF for many years Tim... That does not make an experienced lawn mower/small equipment Mechanic ... 99% of These gentlemen and sometimes ladies too are more then ready to share their MANY years of doing this as a living with more knowledge,experience and savy than any weekend warrior who just happens to have a four year degree in what-ever-one may have Doctor Lawyer ME Indian Chief.. Some of them have degrees too ....remember to be and play nice in the spirit of the holidays
Click to expand...


#32

MarineBob

MarineBob

Yikes, every now and then I need some help with an issue so not here too often but this discussion is something. Time to sit back with a beer and relax


#33

M

mmoffitt

Heh Tim The ME I am an ME TOO, TIM....Be a polite ME, TIM Don't give us ME's a bad Name... Tim I was also an Aircraft Maintenance Specialist in the USAF for many years Tim... That does not make an experienced lawn mower/small equipment Mechanic ... 99% of These gentlemen and sometimes ladies too are more then ready to share their MANY years of doing this as a living with more knowledge,experience and savy than any weekend warrior who just happens to have a four year degree in what-ever-one may have Doctor Lawyer ME Indian Chief.. Some of them have degrees too ....remember to be and play nice in the spirit of the holidays


#34

P

pritcharddesign

Quick comment...I wrestled with my Kubota for a long time and finally took it in...it was the parking break safety switch. There are a lot of safeties on a zero-turn.


#35

F

Freddie21

What you may be looking at, in the near future, is one of those cheap, knock-off, switches failing again. Now, which one do you replace, or do both again? Most of us replace things one at a time. Also, by replacing those items, you may have just corrected a failed connection problem. Not to say what you did was wrong, you'll know in the future.


#36

H

Honest Abe

Wow, simply wow, i.e. "but in comparison, you don't know shit"; hmmm, whatever you say, "Jack" . . . . .

Merry "Christ-mas" and Happy Holidays to ALL ..... 🧑‍🎄 🎁 🤶


#37

M

mgmine

No sense in starting a flame war and calling names. There are other things that could cause a problem. It could be that the motor wasn't getting any spark. Not because of a switch but simply a bad connection possibly the plug wire came loose or maybe a ground wire. It could be that it wasn't getting any fuel. It could be that the blade got jammed up with grass or a dead possum. The point is that there are any number of things that could cause a malfunction.


#38

MyGrassHasCrabs

MyGrassHasCrabs

The OP's attitude reminds me of many that have invaded the USA from the over the southern border - taxpayer provided food, shelter, phones, transportation, medical, and so on, yet many of them complain that it isn't "good enough". Still others who have been let into the country protest in the streets at the drop of a hat, waving the flags of the countries they ran from.

A grateful attitude goes a long way, regardless of your education, occupation, or personal situation. Recognize when people give you "free stuff" (like their time and expertise) and say, "Thank you". I can't help but think less of Allison Transmissons now - keep in mind you're representing them with your speech and attitude. Maybe someone will refer this entire conversation to people that are paid to manage the reputation of that company.

Finally, I'd like to offer my sincere thanks to the good folks that provide so much help. Many (and I'm one of them) read your comments, apply your knowledge, and are most grateful for having this site and your expertise. Keep up the great work and have a Merry Christmas. I'm hoping for great things in 2024!


#39

L

LawnWizard

Tim5779 said:
It does make me savvy numb nuts....and smarter than you obviously. I already expressed it wasn't a battery, fuse, or solenoid issue. I also ruled out the seat switch. That only leaves ignition and/or PTO switch. There are 10 leads between those two switches. I could be a super duper smart guy like you and spend hours tracing every one of those leads, or spend $30 for both on Amazon with next day delivery and have them swapped out in 10 mins. Time is money smart guy....I think I won that battle
Click to expand...
And THIS IS EXACTLY why I very rarely even look at this forum any more. Less of a community of mower enthusiasts, more of a pissing contest.


#40

T

Timbuktu

Tim5779 said:
It does make me savvy numb nuts....and smarter than you obviously. I already expressed it wasn't a battery, fuse, or solenoid issue. I also ruled out the seat switch. That only leaves ignition and/or PTO switch. There are 10 leads between those two switches. I could be a super duper smart guy like you and spend hours tracing every one of those leads, or spend $30 for both on Amazon with next day delivery and have them swapped out in 10 mins. Time is money smart guy....I think I won that battle
Click to expand...
From reading this post, not sure why you even needed to come on here and ask for help! Good luck next time you ask for help, treating people as you do.


#41

The Maintenance Guy

The Maintenance Guy

StarTech said:
Look for the 15 amp main fuse and check it. If it is blown and you was using the elecric clutch then it is possible that the electric clutch is partially shorted or have bad place touching ground at random
Click to expand...
Check the 15 amp fuse holder for corrosion. The fuse might be good but the fuse holder could be corroded and not making contact. I've had that happen to me, similar symptoms.


#42

The Maintenance Guy

The Maintenance Guy

Check the 15 amp fuse holder for corrosion. The fuse might be good but the fuse holder could be corroded and not making contact. I've had that happen to me, similar symptoms.


#43

E

elmrfudd

I, for one, have gained much from the great professionals here on this forum. There’s a ton of very friendly, knowledgeable, and helpful experts that give great advice here. It’s obvious to me that Tim lacks patience, and didn’t want to take the time to do the testing necessary to pinpoint the cause of the problem, thus not learning the necessary troubleshooting techniques for future issues with like symptoms. Yes, the problem was fixed, but it was done so from the lack of due diligence, patience, and learning. Then, he becomes unappreciative, defensive, and then lashes out with name-calling and profanities. I, myself, am retired from an automotive transmission plant, but that does NOT qualify me, nor carry over to servicing lawn equipment, as it’s a totally different ball game. I also worked in two different lawn equipment service shops, learned a ton of stuff at each, and I’m still learning. I don’t claim to know it all, and never will. This is a great forum of experts, and I will always appreciate the help you guys give. Obviously, Tim doesn’t get it, and it’s sad that the great people of this forum has to deal with immaturity and bad attitudes from those who think they know it all and refuses sound advice.


#44

MarineBob

MarineBob

Waaaaaay back an old guy then told me this basic idea about small engines. If you got gas and spark, they got to run. Maybe not good, maybe not for long, but with spark and gas they got to run. Even today, I think that is still a good place to start most diagnoses. With the plethora of safety switches these days, I think most/many/all are wired into the spark system. So if there is no spark but gas, at least you eliminated 1/2 the possible issues.


#45

C

Cajun power

Tim5779 said:
Alright look ladies. I came to ya'll with an issue. After a week and a half of no help, I took my limited knowledge and went with what I knew. It's not a main power issue (you'd know that if you read my OP). There's 2 switches, and 2 relays that would cause the machine to shut off suddenly during operation if they failed. Switches are 10x more likely to fail. Both switches were old and ugly. Both switches were $15 on Amazon. Replaced, fixed, end of story. But for some reason that triggered all the sissies on this site and I caught all kinds off butthurt hell. I only mentioned my credentials when ya'll started attacking my intelligence. Ya'll sound like a bunch of fuckin Biden lovers 🤦‍♂️
Click to expand...
this one is damaged goods folks....just ignore. he's obviously here for one reason only...and it is not advice to fix a mower. just ignore. don't feed the moron.


#46

C

curmudgeon555

Tim5779 said:
It does make me savvy numb nuts....and smarter than you obviously. I already expressed it wasn't a battery, fuse, or solenoid issue. I also ruled out the seat switch. That only leaves ignition and/or PTO switch. There are 10 leads between those two switches. I could be a super duper smart guy like you and spend hours tracing every one of those leads, or spend $30 for both on Amazon with next day delivery and have them swapped out in 10 mins. Time is money smart guy....I think I won that battle
Click to expand...
Kinda rude to a guy who was spending HIS time to try and help you out. A really smart guy wouldn't need to ask for help here.


#47

M

mmoffitt

LawnWizard said:
And THIS IS EXACTLY why I very rarely even look at this forum any more. Less of a community of mower enthusiasts, more of a pissing contest.
Click to expand...


#48

M

mmoffitt

I come here all the time for the help,wisdom and to learn....few and far between with the "un-happy campers"!!
This is my favorite site by far thanks to all!


#49

B

Blockhead22

We all know the Tim type of *man. The little squirrelly guy that sits at the end of the bar who’s afraid of his own shadow… what a punk.


#50

R

rutbuster1

Tim5779 said:
It does make me savvy numb nuts....and smarter than you obviously. I already expressed it wasn't a battery, fuse, or solenoid issue. I also ruled out the seat switch. That only leaves ignition and/or PTO switch. There are 10 leads between those two switches. I could be a super duper smart guy like you and spend hours tracing every one of those leads, or spend $30 for both on Amazon with next day delivery and have them swapped out in 10 mins. Time is money smart guy....I think I won that battle
Click to expand...
Dude. The guy was just trying to be helpful. No need for a reply like that. Besides, he was in fact correct. You still (technically) didn't find out what caused the problem in the first place.


#51

R

rutbuster1

Tim is perfect example of a person with a 'narcissistic personality disorder'.


#52

M

MTD Lawnboy

Tim5779 said:
Replaced both the PTO and Ignition switch. They were cheap on Amazon. Not sure which one it was, but that did the trick.
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I did the same on a 02 MTD mower and the ignition switch was the problem


#53

G

GDHS

Rivets said:
Time for electrical troubleshooting. Here is the procedure I use, but others do it in other ways.
Electrical problems can be very easy or very difficult, depending on four things.

1. How well you understand basic electricity.
2. What tools you have and know how to use.
3. How well you follow directions.
4. You don't overlook or assume anything and verify everything.

Remember we cannot see what you are doing. You are our eyes, ears and fingers in solving this problem. You must be as accurate as you can when you report back. The two basic tools we will ask you to use are a test light and a multi-meter. If you have an assistant when going through these tests it would be very helpful. These steps work the best when done in order, so please don't jump around. Now let's solve this problem.

First, check the fuse(s), check battery connections for corrosion (clean if necessary) and voltage - above 12.5 volts should be good. Check and make sure the chassis ground is clean and tight.
Second, check for power from the battery to one of the large terminals on the solenoid. One of the wires is connected directly to the battery and has power all the time so one of the large terminals should light a test light or show 12 volts on a meter at all times.
Third, check for power at the small terminal of the solenoid while depressing the clutch/brake pedal and holding the key in the start position (you may need an assistant to sit in the seat to override the safety switch). If your solenoid is a four wire solenoid, check both small wire terminals as one is ground and the other is power from the ignition switch. If your solenoid is a three wire solenoid, make sure the solenoid body is not corroded where it bolts to the chassis of the mower as this is your ground path back to the battery. If in doubt, remove the solenoid and clean the mounting area down to bare metal. If there is no power to the small terminal then your problem is most likely a safety switch, ignition switch or in the wiring.
Fourth, check for power on the other large terminal of the solenoid while holding the key in the start position (you may need an assistant to sit in the seat to override the safety switch).
Fifth, check for power at the starter while holding the key in the start position (assistant again).
Sixth, check your ground circuit back to the battery.

After you have gone through each of the above steps, let us know what happened when you did each step. At that point we will have great info to tell you how to proceed. Remember you are our eyes, ears, and fingers, so please be as accurate as possible.

Be as specific as possible with voltage readings as this will help diagnose your problem quicker. If you do not know how to perform the above checks, just ask and I will try to guide you through it. Youtube also has some videos and as you know a picture is worth a thousand words.
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Rivet: That's a mighty fine troubleshooting guide and sound advice. I'm a retired Navy Aircraft Electrician, and - though I don't have lawn-mower-specific training - I completed multiple formal electrical training schools, classes, and courses and gained 20+ years of experience, and I understand electrical circuits, and I know very well that there are no (reliable) shortcuts in making sure they are intact and functional, This is especially so when maintaining aircraft, and it makes sense to me to apply the same principles to 'ground-hugging-machinery'. So I applaud your response to Tim. And I say that if that arrogant, ungrateful clown was even half as savvy as he proclaims himself to be, he would at least know how to spell the word 'brake' (instead of 'break') when referring to the brake switch. My oldest son is a Mechanical Engineer by degree, working as an Aeronautical Engineer. But when he has lawnmower problems, he turns to someone who knows what they're doing with lawnmowers - usually me.
Based on Tim's diatribe, I will never again think favorably of Allison Transmissions.


#54

M

mmoffitt

roger that Sir! thanks for your service!


#55

Law57

Law57

Tim5779 said:
If you're talking about the fuse just off of the starter solenoid, checked it. It's good
Click to expand...
You may be on to something - the PTO...
Tim5779 said:
Any other ideas guys? Could it be the PTO engagement switch? I see some relays or something in there
Click to expand...

You may be on to something... My small Kubota B2601 will not start if the PTO is engaged. The solenoid switch won't even click. Everything is dead, dead, dead. When I throw the lever to disengage the PTO - things are back to normal.

Just a personal story below - nothing on topic.

I learned the hard way last winter - long story. We had 26 inches of wet, heavy, snow. lots of trees down and tons of limbs. I was pulling someone out - a tree was across the road. So I shut the tractor off walked home to get my chain saw. Cleared the tree and the tractor was stone dead. Got my truck and tools - tested the battery, did everything I could think of... Called my brother - he has a B2301 and said his won't start if the PTO is engaged. Then I remembered that the hammer loop of my bibs had snagged on something when I climbed off of my tractor. Went back to it and disengaged the PTO an Voila!

The next day... had left the tractor on the road overnight - glad to get it home. My wheeler and plow were buried with wheels off the ground. My truck/plow was at the end of the driveway and wouldn't go into gear. I vaguely remembered something about the disengagement procedure of the rear locker. I looked it up in the manual and it worked. I used the truck to pull the wheeler out. Parked all three pieces, tractor, wheeler, and truck in the garage.

The first day, with everything stuck or dead I quit and was very discussed - good thing I don't drink. The second day everything was working again. I just parked everything in the garage and took a deep breath. The third day I finished plowing. What an ordeal!


#56

B

Boomer49

Tim5779 said:
Alright look ladies. I came to ya'll with an issue. After a week and a half of no help, I took my limited knowledge and went with what I knew. It's not a main power issue (you'd know that if you read my OP). There's 2 switches, and 2 relays that would cause the machine to shut off suddenly during operation if they failed. Switches are 10x more likely to fail. Both switches were old and ugly. Both switches were $15 on Amazon. Replaced, fixed, end of story. But for some reason that triggered all the sissies on this site and I caught all kinds off butthurt hell. I only mentioned my credentials when ya'll started attacking my intelligence. Ya'll sound like a bunch of fuckin Biden lovers 🤦‍♂️
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Y'all were doing good, I was actually cheering you on, then you threw in a small dick comment. Oh yeah, pay attention to the correct spelling of the first word. All reflections on your 'intelligence'.


#57

L

Lilranch2001

I think name calling is uncalled for…..


#58

S

SamB

GDHS said:
Rivet: That's a mighty fine troubleshooting guide and sound advice. I'm a retired Navy Aircraft Electrician, and - though I don't have lawn-mower-specific training - I completed multiple formal electrical training schools, classes, and courses and gained 20+ years of experience, and I understand electrical circuits, and I know very well that there are no (reliable) shortcuts in making sure they are intact and functional, This is especially so when maintaining aircraft, and it makes sense to me to apply the same principles to 'ground-hugging-machinery'. So I applaud your response to Tim. And I say that if that arrogant, ungrateful clown was even half as savvy as he proclaims himself to be, he would at least know how to spell the word 'brake' (instead of 'break') when referring to the brake switch. My oldest son is a Mechanical Engineer by degree, working as an Aeronautical Engineer. But when he has lawnmower problems, he turns to someone who knows what they're doing with lawnmowers - usually me.
Based on Tim's diatribe, I will never again think favorably of Allison Transmissions.
Click to expand...
Just a thought,..but did you, perhaps, misspell the descriptive word for the OP? :)


#59

J

JD14SB

Wow!


#60

L

Lilranch2001

Tim5779 said:
Ya'll talk alot of shit for people who offered no help what so ever. The issue is fixed with minimal time, effort, and $$$ Go strut your tiny balls elsewhere.

FYI....your little lawnmower knowledge is cute and all. But I'm an Engineer at Allison Transmission. I literally design the worlds most advanced propulsion systems. I know you think you're smart, but in comparison, you don't know shit
Click to expand...
I noticed you came to a forum to ASK for help…..

Seems to me like a soooper dooooper Allison engineer wouldn’t need any help at all!


#61

C

Cadet2138

Money doesn't = class. I'm sure the Allison mechanics just relish the idea of working on the "masterpieces" you put out there 😂.
Just because one knowledgeable member suggested you follow the common steps of troubleshooting, you flew off the handle and became very insecure; Resorting to name-calling and assuming people's political stance, which has absolutely NOTHING to do with lawnmower troubleshooting. Good luck in your future endeavors pal. You won't get much out of life with that sort of attitude towards people.


#62

Reverett

Reverett

Tim5779 said:
It does make me savvy numb nuts....and smarter than you obviously. I already expressed it wasn't a battery, fuse, or solenoid issue. I also ruled out the seat switch. That only leaves ignition and/or PTO switch. There are 10 leads between those two switches. I could be a super duper smart guy like you and spend hours tracing every one of those leads, or spend $30 for both on Amazon with next day delivery and have them swapped out in 10 mins. Time is money smart guy....I think I won that battle
Click to expand...
I agree, You should have replaced one at a time to determine what failed. Now you don't know which one was the problem for future issues. But it's working and time to mow.


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