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Briggs Carburetor dies when accelerating

#1

T

tim4

I am working on a briggs tiller model 130297 type 301501 code 88090207 and I replaced the tank gasket and the diaphram and it will idle fine when I adjust the needle valve but when I try to speed it up it stalls. I made sure the long tube was clear and I cleaned the hole in the side of the part that goes in the fuel pick up are. If I move the throttle slow toward high speed it will pick up speed for 2 seconds then stall. If I turn the needle valve out it will pick up speed if I move the throttle and sometines stay running but it won't idle smooth.


#2

R

Rivets

I’m guessing it is time to replace the pump diaphragm. Also, I would replace the gasket between the carb and tank, making sure it is making a good seal. This manual should help you out. http://www.tuks.nl/WFCProject/img/E...210-Briggs-Stratton-Service-Manual-L-Head.pdf


#3

R

Rivets

Another thing, when I get a 30 year old with this style carb/tank setup, I many times find the tank warpped. Tank most times is NLA so I seal around the carb base with a good auto body sealer.


#4

T

tim4

I replaced the pump diaphram so I will try a new carb gasket thanks.


#5

F

Forest#2

Might try two gaskets.

Fill the tank completely FULL of fuel and report back? (let us know if it makes any difference in the engine symptoms????)
(I have a reason for suggesting such)


#6

T

tim4

Befor I replaced the gasket to block I noticed there was 2 gaskets on there so I scrapped them and tried 1 gasket. It speeds up slightly but full throttle it dies.


#7

T

tim4

On the carburetor how many holes should be in the small pickup that fits in the shallow hole on the fuel tank.


#8

R

Rivets

Have you taken any time to read the section on carbs in the manual I posted??? I’ll bet not. If you find a picture of the mounting gasket, it should answer your question. To help you out it is in section 3, starting around page 29.


#9

T

tim4

Rivets said:
Have you taken any time to read the section on carbs in the manual I posted??? I’ll bet not. If you find a picture of the mounting gasket, it should answer your question. To help you out it is in section 3, starting around page 29.
Click to expand...
I tr ied reading the manual but my screen reader does not read it properly


#10

R

Rivets

That’s a new one on me, it’s just a pdf file. Everything I have is in that format. Try searching for “Briggs pulsa jet tank mounted carbs” or “Briggs L-head repair manual” and you should find material to help you out.


#11

StarTech

StarTech

Probably trying to use a smart phone. People sometimes needs a real desktop computer with a large screen.

Rust is not your friend; it is a sneaky enemy.

These carburetors are mounted on steel tanks that tends to rust a lot. This rust can even clog up unseen passage especially in the tower section. Over the years before the tanks became unavailable I had drill the tower steel plugging ball(s) and clean the passage contain within. Once cleaned out that passage has to be resealed. Even ultrasonics won't clean out the rust nor will dip cleaners.

On that many of these carburetor's towers never had a filter screen install. Most were installed by tech upon the first major repair. An after thought on Briggs part.

Also check the valve clearances as this is a very old L-head engine and the valve clearance probably at zero.

I do have one 3 qt tank left that I am saving for later use. That is if the customer will to part with $150. When they hit over $100 the customer quit buying them and I don't blame them.


#12

F

Forest#2

Did you fill the gas tank completely full and test?


Here is a carb repair link

Small Engine, Lawn Mower, Snowthrower Troubleshooting, Repairs and Safety

outdoorpowerinfo.com outdoorpowerinfo.com


#13

F

Forest#2

tim4 said:
On the carburetor how many holes should be in the small pickup that fits in the shallow hole on the fuel tank.
Click to expand...

?????????
explain.
Pickup tube holes?????


#14

T

tim4

I was referring to the piece with a hole in the side of it that is casted on the carburetor. I took the carb off again and sprayed carb cleaner in it again and blew it out with air and now it works fine thanks.


#15

H

hlw49

You may have to clean out under the welch plug on the side of the carb. part no 691742


#16

T

tim4

How do you remove them.


#17

F

Forest#2

tim4 said:
How do you remove them.
Click to expand...
I only remove welch plugs when all other cleaning methods fail.
If I have a replacement Welch plug I carefully drill a hole in the center to use a ice pick or small sheet metal screw to pry out the plug. Be really careful and do not let the drill bit go into the plug too deep.

If I do not have a replacement welch plug I use a very small drill bit and drill a hole in the center of the aluminum plug, carefully pry out the plug for re-use.
I re-form the plug using a piece of leather and a round ended punch.
To re-install tap the plug into place and then I have a slow drying 2 part epoxy that is non flow type that I use to seal the drilled hole and the edges of the plug. I sometimes give the re-used plug two coats of the sealer epoxy.

I usually only do this on NLA carbs that are in the category of dinosaur eggs. (extinct) and my own stuff.


Some of the pulsa jet carbs are NLA, but I see that China in now cloning some od them and for sale on flea bay for around $15.


#18

F

Forest#2

The reason I ask you to test with the tank completely full is:
This bypass's the long pick-up tube and the pump for such which is used to pump gas UP into the upper storage pan for the short tube when the fuel level drops below about 1/2 in the tank or below the level of the short tube.

If same symptoms with a full tank check the short tube and carb jets, diaphragm, etc.

If I have to clean out the tubes I just punch a hole in the screen and clean out the tube with the tube in place on the carb and then use a screen or gas tank filter sock over the end of the tube tied in place with a copper wire.
It's quite common for the long tube to severely clog internally due to corrosion if it's a brass tube.


#19

A

Auto Doc's

tim4 said:
I am working on a briggs tiller model 130297 type 301501 code 88090207 and I replaced the tank gasket and the diaphram and it will idle fine when I adjust the needle valve but when I try to speed it up it stalls. I made sure the long tube was clear and I cleaned the hole in the side of the part that goes in the fuel pick up are. If I move the throttle slow toward high speed it will pick up speed for 2 seconds then stall. If I turn the needle valve out it will pick up speed if I move the throttle and sometines stay running but it won't idle smooth.
Click to expand...
Hello T.,

This likely has a bad pulse diaphragm in the side or parts were not put back correctly.

Here is an aftermarket carburetor that is compatible:

Amazon.com: AUTOKAY 299437 297599 Carburetor Fits for engine Series 135200 130200 100200 4 Cycle Small Engine 130201 130202 130203 130205 130206 135252 130251 130292 Carb with Fuel Filter Gaskets Valve : Patio, Lawn & Garden

Buy AUTOKAY 299437 297599 Carburetor Fits for engine Series 135200 130200 100200 4 Cycle Small Engine 130201 130202 130203 130205 130206 135252 130251 130292 Carb with Fuel Filter Gaskets Valve: Tune-Up Kits - Amazon.com ✓ FREE DELIVERY possible on eligible purchases
www.amazon.com


#20

F

Forest#2

tim4 said:
I was referring to the piece with a hole in the side of it that is casted on the carburetor. I took the carb off again and sprayed carb cleaner in it again and blew it out with air and now it works fine thanks.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the comeback.


#21

T

tim4

Also those tubes have a check ball in them.


#22

F

Forest#2

tim4 said:
Also those tubes have a check ball in them.
Click to expand...
Your does not.
If the pump diaphragm is on the side of the pulsa jet carb it does not have the check ball tube. The flappers on the diaphragm is the check valve.
Also most generally it will be found that these type carbs engines start easier with less manual cranking after they have been at rest long time if the gas tank is full when trying to get a startup without using a prime into the carb throat because the long pickup tube is being used to pump fuel into the upper bowl for the short tube when the fuel level in the tank is below the bottom of the short tube.
(take more manual rope cranking to get the carb's short pickup tube fuel bowl primed)


Most generally the pulsa jet carbs with the check ball in the PLASTIC pickup tube have the pump diaphragm UNDER the carb body on top of the tank and have to have a good seal between the diaphragm and the top of the tank to operate properly.
and were used on the 3.5 vertical crankshaft engines.
Here is a link to one type of the check ball in the tube type pulsa jet

Disassembly, Repair of Briggs Tank-mounted Vacu-jet Automatic Choke Carburetor

outdoorpowerinfo.com outdoorpowerinfo.com


#23

T

tim4

I thought that type had a check ball because I could blow in to the long tube but could not suck the tube so that is because the flapper valve thanks.


#24

T

tank1949

tim4 said:
I am working on a briggs tiller model 130297 type 301501 code 88090207 and I replaced the tank gasket and the diaphram and it will idle fine when I adjust the needle valve but when I try to speed it up it stalls. I made sure the long tube was clear and I cleaned the hole in the side of the part that goes in the fuel pick up are. If I move the throttle slow toward high speed it will pick up speed for 2 seconds then stall. If I turn the needle valve out it will pick up speed if I move the throttle and sometines stay running but it won't idle smooth.
Click to expand...
If it has an older metal gas tank like mine has, it will accumulate rust and pass the rust to carb. I soaked my tank with muriatic acid, rinsed thoroughly with baking soda/water but still accumulated rust and passed rust to carb. You might be able to find an after market plastic tank.


#25

F

Forest#2

tank1949 said:
If it has an older metal gas tank like mine has, it will accumulate rust and pass the rust to carb. I soaked my tank with muriatic acid, rinsed thoroughly with baking soda/water but still accumulated rust and passed rust to carb. You might be able to find an after market plastic tank.
Click to expand...
I just got through red koting some of those tanks.
Really surprised at how well they cleaned up inside.
I strapped them to a tractor tire, put nuts and bolts inside and jacked up the tire and rotated them for few hours just using water as the rinse.
Use plastic under the cap when rotating and a sealing plate on top.
Using the tractor as the tumbler really gets them clean and ready for the inner coating. If the small pan for the short tube has rusty holes it's not worth the effort usually.

Looking for a plastic tank usually requires going to a gravity feed requires changing to a different carb, etc. I've done such for myself and it's time consuming.

Also costly unless you have the donor parts already.


#26

T

tim4

So after you tumble it with the nuts and bolts just use soap and water to rinch it? thanks.


#27

R

rhkraft

It is getting enough gas to idle, but not enough to run fast. Dirty filter or cracked fuel pickup line. To test for cracked pickup line fill the fuel tank. If it runs good then, the line is cracked. When the fuel gets below the crack, it sucks air.


#28

F

Forest#2

tim4 said:
So after you tumble it with the nuts and bolts just use soap and water to rinch it? thanks.
Click to expand...
No, final rinse after it's removed from the tumbler is a manual rinse with small amount lacquer thinner or acetone.
I tumble with the tractor tire just using very little water with the nuts and bolts and have the tank where I can drain the water and rinse with the tank strapped in place. When the rinse water comes clean the inside is clean. Soap is not necessary. Use a piece of old carpet or padded protector under or around the tank when strapped to the tractor wheel.

To prep for the red kote I rinse the inside with little bit of lacquer thinner or acetone then use a heat lamp or heater and a fan to move little bit of air over the tank while its drying internally.
I use two coats of the liner, first coat sets for about 8-12 hours with very low air flow across the tank from a low speed fan and I keep the tank just slightly warm using a light bulb or heat lamp. The cap is off so the tank can breath. The first coat is not thick, I dump out the excess and save it for the 2nd coat and apply the 2nd coat while the first coat is still slightly tacky. I rotate the tank about every hour so as to get an even coating inside.
I let the tank dry for several days using the low heat and fan before adding fuel. I can do several one gallon small engine tanks using 1/2 pint of the sealer and saves time doing several at same time.
I also do large tanks using the tractor tire tumbling cleaning.
On very large tanks I sometimes make a drain hole to drain out the excess sealer then seal the hole during the final coat.
Mainly just follow the instructions for applying the sealer in use.


#29

A

Auto Doc's

Forest#2 said:
No, final rinse after it's removed from the tumbler is a manual rinse with small amount lacquer thinner or acetone.
I tumble with the tractor tire just using very little water with the nuts and bolts and have the tank where I can drain the water and rinse with the tank strapped in place. When the rinse water comes clean the inside is clean. Soap is not necessary. Use a piece of old carpet or padded protector under or around the tank when strapped to the tractor wheel.

To prep for the red kote I rinse the inside with little bit of lacquer thinner or acetone then use a heat lamp or heater and a fan to move little bit of air over the tank while its drying internally.
I use two coats of the liner, first coat sets for about 8-12 hours with very low air flow across the tank from a low speed fan and I keep the tank just slightly warm using a light bulb or heat lamp. The cap is off so the tank can breath. The first coat is not thick, I dump out the excess and save it for the 2nd coat and apply the 2nd coat while the first coat is still slightly tacky. I rotate the tank about every hour so as to get an even coating inside.
I let the tank dry for several days using the low heat and fan before adding fuel. I can do several one gallon small engine tanks using 1/2 pint of the sealer and saves time doing several at same time.
I also do large tanks using the tractor tire tumbling cleaning.
On very large tanks I sometimes make a drain hole to drain out the excess sealer then seal the hole during the final coat.
Mainly just follow the instructions for applying the sealer in use.
Click to expand...
Hi Forest#2,

I use a similar method with the steel farm tractor fuel tanks except in a larger scale and I use 4-inch short pieces of various sized chains as tumbler material.

Regardless of tank size, the rattle and shake by hand method gets old really fast. It is much easier to strap them to a tractor wheel or similar slow-moving vehicle and let it do the "hard work".

Recently, I've been considering using evapo-rust liquid to dissolve and convert the rust, but I don't think it will be effective in dealing with old residual fuel resins. I'm going to try it in some in a couple of small engine metal tanks to see how it works.


#30

F

Forest#2

Auto Doc's said:
Hi Forest#2,

I use a similar method with the steel farm tractor fuel tanks except in a larger scale and I use 4-inch short pieces of various sized chains as tumbler material.

Regardless of tank size, the rattle and shake by hand method gets old really fast. It is much easier to strap them to a tractor wheel or similar slow-moving vehicle and let it do the "hard work".

Recently, I've been considering using evapo-rust liquid to dissolve and convert the rust, but I don't think it will be effective in dealing with old residual fuel resins. I'm going to try it in some in a couple of small engine metal tanks to see how it works.
Click to expand...

I do about the same with large tanks such as old tractor tanks and vec tanks that are obsolete.
I use pieces of porch swing chain on large tanks, it has sharp edges and will cut the dried gunk plus rust.
Some tanks, including tractor tanks have a baffle inside and I have to carefully prepare a access on the other side of the baffle for the chains, nuts and bolts, etc when tumbling.


#31

StarTech

StarTech

Here's one problem that has been overlooked as these Briggs tank has a reservoir cup that can develop pin holes. The main tank is fairly easy to coat, its this reservoir cup that is a pain to do as there is limited spacing between and the carb tower.

Also many of three tanks have plastic and foam baffle materials especially those on garden tillers.


#32

F

Forest#2

StarTech said:
Here's one problem that has been overlooked as these Briggs tank has a reservoir cup that can develop pin holes. The main tank is fairly easy to coat, its this reservoir cup that is a pain to do as there is limited spacing between and the carb tower.

Also many of three tanks have plastic and foam baffle materials especially those on garden tillers.
Click to expand...

Right about the reservoir cup.
I hinted about the reservoir cup and fuel level in post #18. If reservoir cup has leakage (or the long tube is not pumping fuel the engine will need the fuel level in the tank above the level of the short pickup tube.
If I encounter one of these type carb acting weird I fill the tank full of gas and test. If it runs ok with such it's a hint that the issue is with the long pickup tube or reservoir pan pump area. Operating the engine with a full tank will let you repair the carb later if the equipment is really needed at the immediate time.

Do not let the sealer coating build up in the bottom of the reservoir cup or the bottom of the carb short tube will get restricted/blocked when the carb is installed.

As mentioned some of the tanks have the foam baffle materials.
I've removed that foam baffle on some tanks and some will clean up good due to a good non-rusting type metal and others will not get clean, rust too heavy and tumbling will actually create pin holes. Just have to start tumbling and see what the results will be. I get surprises how well some of the small engine rusty tanks will get clean by tumbling and would live long time without being coated if proper fuel storage is used. Ethanol gas left in the tanks seems to speed up the rusting. If small engine metal tank is going to be stored for long time I add a 2 cycle mix to the tank to reduce chance of corrosion and rusting. The engine will usually operate ok when needed using a 50:1 2 cycle mix. (and carb pump diaphragms last longer)

Not a fun job but some of the vintage JUNK stuff such as tanks are NLA as new. (or priced out of sight)


#33

T

tim4

That tumbling is a great idea. I used to shake the tanks by hand with nuts and bolts in them and dunp it out in a tray andwipe the bolts with a rag and put them inside the tank again for more shaking.


#34

G

georgPru2

tim4 said:
I am working on a briggs tiller model 130297 type 301501 code 88090207 and I replaced the tank gasket and the diaphram and it will idle fine when I adjust the needle valve but when I try to speed it up it stalls. I made sure the long tube was clear and I cleaned the hole in the side of the part that goes in the fuel pick up are. If I move the throttle slow toward high speed it will pick up speed for 2 seconds then stall. If I turn the needle valve out it will pick up speed if I move the throttle and sometines stay running but it won't idle smooth.
Click to expand...
Throttle shaft/carb worn out. Ck for side to side play. Running too lean.


#35

T

tim4

I checked that and there was no excessive play in the throttle shaft.


#36

F

Forest#2

tim4 said:
I was referring to the piece with a hole in the side of it that is casted on the carburetor. I took the carb off again and sprayed carb cleaner in it again and blew it out with air and now it works fine thanks.
Click to expand...
and now it works fine thanks.

He got it going.


#37

C

Chipg1956

StarTech said:
Here's one problem that has been overlooked as these Briggs tank has a reservoir cup that can develop pin holes. The main tank is fairly easy to coat, its this reservoir cup that is a pain to do as there is limited spacing between and the carb tower.

Also many of three tanks have plastic and foam baffle materials especially those on garden tillers.
Click to expand...
And that foam starts to deteriorate. If you have that, remove it.


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