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Are mulching blades about the same?

#1

SJMaye

SJMaye

I have had my Ariens Max Zoom 60 for about 6 years. I installed the OEM mulching kit on it about 5 years ago and have loved it. It is time to buy new blades. The OEM mulching blades have done a pretty good job, but thought I would ask the experts if there is something better. My father in law swears by the Gator Blades, but I have read that high lift blades are not good to use if you have a mulching kit.

Can someone comment on their experiences?


#2

R

Rivets

This is when I normally say if you like the cut from the blades you have been using, DOT CHANGE. Mulching has more to do with mulching kit, blade speed, unit speed and deck design, than which blade to use. If you switch blades and you don’t like the cut, what are you going to do?


#3

M

MParr

Use the OEM Gravely mulching blades. Gator or Gator style blades are designed for side discharge. Now, Stens, Rotary, or Oregon might have direct aftermarket replacements.


#4

B

bullet bob

www.lawnmowerforum.com

Mulching blades that can still actually lift grass?

Gravely 60" ZT HD, 2017. Every fall I install https://www.gravely.com/en-us/part/zero-turn-mulching-kit---60-in-decks-79105900 the mulching kit, mainly because without it, the leaves blow out the side chute w/o ever being cut up. So again this year I tackle the project. Sharpen & balance the...
www.lawnmowerforum.com www.lawnmowerforum.com


#5

SJMaye

SJMaye

MParr said:
Use the OEM Gravely mulching blades. Gator or Gator style blades are designed for side discharge. Now, Stens, Rotary, or Oregon might have direct aftermarket replacements.
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I think I will. There was so much good press around the Gator blades I wondered if they may hold an edge longer.

Bullet Bob - Thank you for the link. When I searched previously, not being a pro I did not search that forum. I want to read through the comments there. Good stuff. Thanks.


#6

M

MParr

SJMaye said:
I think I will. There was so much good press around the Gator blades I wondered if they may hold an edge longer.

Bullet Bob - Thank you for the link. When I searched previously, not being a pro I did not search that forum. I want to read through the comments there. Good stuff. Thanks.
Click to expand...
Read Oregon’s product information on the Gator blades. Oregon clearly states that they are for bagging or side discharge.

Gator Mulching Blades | Oregon Products

Increase your efficiency and productivity with Oregon Gator mulching mower blades. All Gator mulching mower blades feature the patented Gator mulching teeth which circulate cut grass back into the deck multiple times, creating a finer cut and better looking lawn.
www.oregonproducts.com www.oregonproducts.com


#7

Tiger Small Engine

Tiger Small Engine

MParr said:
Read Oregon’s product information on the Gator blades. Oregon clearly states that they are for bagging or side discharge.

Gator Mulching Blades | Oregon Products

Increase your efficiency and productivity with Oregon Gator mulching mower blades. All Gator mulching mower blades feature the patented Gator mulching teeth which circulate cut grass back into the deck multiple times, creating a finer cut and better looking lawn.
www.oregonproducts.com www.oregonproducts.com
Click to expand...
I am a Gator blade fan bigtime. I am also NOT a mulching fan at all. If you are happy with cut quality from mulching then stay with it. I cannot for the life of me, see how the cut quality with mulching would exceed side discharge and Gator blades.


#8

SJMaye

SJMaye

Tiger Small Engine said:
I am a Gator blade fan bigtime. I am also NOT a mulching fan at all. If you are happy with cut quality from mulching then stay with it. I cannot for the life of me, see how the cut quality with mulching would exceed side discharge and Gator blades.
Click to expand...
I have never had a complaint in the cut quality. In fact, I have been amazed how well the mulching kit works. Prior to buying this kit, I only knew of the one my Dad had on his John Deere riding mower. It just blocked the side discharge and clumped all the time. The Ariens OEM kit includes baffles to isolate each blade. I am not clear why it works so well, but I am happy with it.

One question - While researching this I began seeing posts about doubling up blades on each spindle for even better mulching. Does this actually work well?


#9

R

Rivets

In my opinion doubling up blades is a DYI guys stupid idea. What can go wrong? Can’t properly tighten blades, may come loose. Destroying the spindles. Not made for two blades. Safety, may destroy the deck or blades go flying. Don’t even give that idea another thought, you’re asking for trouble. Who ever posted that or is thinking about do it, should have a frontal lobotomy ASAP, and should loose his manhood.


#10

B

bullet bob

Rivets said:
In my opinion doubling up blades is a DYI guys stupid idea. What can go wrong? Can’t properly tighten blades, may come loose. Destroying the spindles. Not made for two blades. Safety, may destroy the deck or blades go flying. Don’t even give that idea another thought, you’re asking for trouble. Who ever posted that or is thinking about do it, should have a frontal lobotomy ASAP, and should loose his manhood.
Click to expand...
Ahhh c'mon, how do you really feel? ;)


#11

H

hlw49

Rivets said:
In my opinion doubling up blades is a DYI guys stupid idea. What can go wrong? Can’t properly tighten blades, may come loose. Destroying the spindles. Not made for two blades. Safety, may destroy the deck or blades go flying. Don’t even give that idea another thought, you’re asking for trouble. Who ever posted that or is thinking about do it, should have a frontal lobotomy ASAP, and should loose his manhood.
Click to expand...
Dixie Chopper has a double blade setup. The top blade is called an X blade and the bottom H blade is flat. The flat bottom H blade fits in the X portion of top blade seem to work pretty well and have never seen one come off yet.


#12

H

hlw49

https://www.dixiechopperpartsdistributors.com/ you can see the setup here where the blades are X. If it doesn't pop up click on blades in the threads on the left side of the screen.


#13

SJMaye

SJMaye

hlw49 said:
https://www.dixiechopperpartsdistributors.com/ you can see the setup here where the blades are X. If it doesn't pop up click on blades in the threads on the left side of the screen.
Click to expand...
Yes, that is the setup I saw on youtube


#14

R

Rivets

I’ll agree that some mowers are designed to use a double blade, but that doesn’t mean you can add a second blade to those which are not designed with a longer threaded shaft or adapter designed for two. Honda also has two blades, but the threads are longer and they have an adapter designed for both blades, plus the second blade is much lighter.


#15

bkeller500

bkeller500

it's difficult to understand how a mulching set-up actually can work properly. If you stick to the 1/3 rule and cut your grass when it's dry, would a mulched clipping decompose any quicker? How can a mulch deck be expected to lift the grass and cut it and recut it and distribute it evenly as it discharges the clippings? The same deck & blades that is supposed to lift the grass for cutting is supposed to let the grass exit by gravity as there is no discharge chute. The deck becomes over loaded or clogged and typically windrows or clumps fall out. If your grass is 6"-8" for example and you are cutting to 4" how is a mulching blade going to recut a 2"-4" clipping and drop them evenly on the turf? When I have tried to mulch in the past, I mostly ended up with a cogged deck that required scraping, thus defeating the idea of distributing the clippings and benefitting as food for the turf. I fail to see any real benefit.


#16

R

Rivets

Most mulching setups don’t discharge the clippings, as the good ones have closed decks when mulching, so the clippings are cut multiple times before dropping straight down. Toro and Honda have the best setups, with blades that lift and decks that provide room for the clippings to be chopped into small pieces. To properly mulch you must keep your blade sharp and deck clean.


#17

bkeller500

bkeller500

Rivets said:
Most mulching setups don’t discharge the clippings, as the good ones have closed decks when mulching, so the clippings are cut multiple times before dropping straight down. Toro and Honda have the best setups, with blades that lift and decks that provide room for the clippings to be chopped into small pieces. To properly mulch you must keep your blade sharp and deck clean.
Click to expand...
I think the issue is as you stated the blades are spinning and lifting the grass ….. how are the clippings going to drop if the blades are lifting?


#18

R

Rivets

What goes up must come down.
1697665242090.jpeg


#19

bkeller500

bkeller500

Rivets said:
What goes up must come down.
View attachment 67052
Click to expand...
not arguing here.....and I know the photo shows how it's marketed to us.......in reality it has to overcome blades that lift and cut, grass volume, an enclosed deck speed, gravity, blow out and moisture. I'm all in if it would work every time.


#20

R

Rivets

For the last thirty years, since I move into a new house in 1993, I’ve had the same Toro tractor and two Toro Super Recycler mowers. These mowers have all been setup for mulching since day one and do a great job. Two things will cause me problems, but it is my own fault and nothing works 100% of the time. Having to cut when the grass is wet and cutting the grass when it is too long. Sometimes you have to do just that and you live with it for a week. I’ve sold the Super Recycler mowers to two neighbors and at least 2 dozen relatives or personal friends. Not one of them has been displeased with their purchase and one neighbor even got his brother-in-law to purchase one also. Everyone mulches or bags in the fall. Only thing that you must do is keep the underside of the deck clean and blade sharp.


#21

M

MParr

Rivets said:
For the last thirty years, since I move into a new house in 1993, I’ve had the same Toro tractor and two Toro Super Recycler mowers. These mowers have all been setup for mulching since day one and do a great job. Two things will cause me problems, but it is my own fault and nothing works 100% of the time. Having to cut when the grass is wet and cutting the grass when it is too long. Sometimes you have to do just that and you live with it for a week. I’ve sold the Super Recycler mowers to two neighbors and at least 2 dozen relatives or personal friends. Not one of them has been displeased with their purchase and one neighbor even got his brother-in-law to purchase one also. Everyone mulches or bags in the fall. Only thing that you must do is keep the underside of the deck clean and blade sharp.
Click to expand...
“Set up for mulching” That’s they key. True mulching blades are matched to the mulching baffles. That’s why they are sold in kits. Many people overthink things. They hear this and that about Gator style blades, buy them and expect them to perform better than the OEM mulchers. G5 and G6 Gator are high lift and will clog a mulching kit. The G3 is a standard lift blade. Oregon clearly states that Gator blades are for bagging and side discharge.
The mulching blades sold with the kits are typically a low lift blade. There is just enough lift to keep the grass suspended for multiple cuts. That’s where the wavy blade design pays off.
A mulching kit isn’t going to perform well on tall or wet grass.
Side discharge with a Gator G5 or G6 in tall or wet grass isn’t going to perform well either. They make a soupy or clumpy mess. A Gator G3 and side discharge is going to give better performance. However, an OEM standard lift or high lift is going to work best for side discharge in all mowing conditions. The same goes for aftermarket standard or high lift blade.


#22

H

hlw49

You need to mow slower for things to work properly.


#23

MyGrassHasCrabs

MyGrassHasCrabs

I have Rotary Copperhead Mulching Mower Blades:

1697883374914.png


on my JD along with the JD mulching baffle. These blades have held a sharp edge longer than any others I have used.

I keep the deck balanced and proper tire pressure and always get a good, even mulching cut. I never cut below 3.5" and mow as dry as possible, although it is wetter sometimes.

After two mowing seasons I have yet to find thatch buildup in my lawn in the fall, so it's been doing a decent job grinding up clippings.


#24

M

moparjoe

SJMaye said:
I have had my Ariens Max Zoom 60 for about 6 years. I installed the OEM mulching kit on it about 5 years ago and have loved it. It is time to buy new blades. The OEM mulching blades have done a pretty good job, but thought I would ask the experts if there is something better. My father in law swears by the Gator Blades, but I have read that high lift blades are not good to use if you have a mulching kit.

Can someone comment on their experiences?
Click to expand...
The best way to avoid mulching is called A CHAIN SAW. Cut the trees down and you wont have to worry about mulching.


#25

tgzzzz

tgzzzz

MParr said:
Use the OEM Gravely mulching blades. Gator or Gator style blades are designed for side discharge. Now, Stens, Rotary, or Oregon might have direct aftermarket replacements.
Click to expand...
I notice you said "Stens" not 8ten. Maybe 8ten is Sten in Mandarin.


#26

B

billcoleman520

MParr said:
“Set up for mulching” That’s they key. True mulching blades are matched to the mulching baffles. That’s why they are sold in kits. Many people overthink things. They hear this and that about Gator style blades, buy them and expect them to perform better than the OEM mulchers. G5 and G6 Gator are high lift and will clog a mulching kit. The G3 is a standard lift blade. Oregon clearly states that Gator blades are for bagging and side discharge.
The mulching blades sold with the kits are typically a low lift blade. There is just enough lift to keep the grass suspended for multiple cuts. That’s where the wavy blade design pays off.
A mulching kit isn’t going to perform well on tall or wet grass.
Side discharge with a Gator G5 or G6 in tall or wet grass isn’t going to perform well either. They make a soupy or clumpy mess. A Gator G3 and side discharge is going to give better performance. However, an OEM standard lift or high lift is going to work best for side discharge in all mowing conditions. The same goes for aftermarket standard or high lift blade.
Click to expand...
hlw49 said:
You need to mow slower for things to work properly.
Click to expand...


#27

N

nbpt100

Rivets said:
In my opinion doubling up blades is a DYI guys stupid idea. What can go wrong? Can’t properly tighten blades, may come loose. Destroying the spindles. Not made for two blades. Safety, may destroy the deck or blades go flying. Don’t even give that idea another thought, you’re asking for trouble. Who ever posted that or is thinking about do it, should have a frontal lobotomy ASAP, and should loose his manhood.
Click to expand...
To give this some context. The best mulching walk behind mowers, in my humble opinion, use a double blade. Honda and Toro in particular. But they were designed that way from the factory. I do not know of a brand new riding mower deck that has double blades from the factory. If I am wrong I am happy to be corrected. Maybe a commercial one? Kits that add an extra blade are add on modifications. You are adding more weight( inertia) to the system and you will get faster wear and tear on the entire system. As Rivets said something is open to go wrong that may be dangerous. For certain you will have more wear and tear on the entire blade drive system
Good mulching mowers are designed to work with a particular blade and deck design.
Playing around with different blades and mulch kits for your deck is fine. I say have at it if that is what you want to do. But adding an extra blade per spindle is more risk when the machine is not designed for it. It may or may not mulch better but you are taking on other risks. It pays to understand what you are doing.


#28

W

W1D2C

Rivets said:
This is when I normally say if you like the cut from the blades you have been using, DOT CHANGE. Mulching has more to do with mulching kit, blade speed, unit speed and deck design, than which blade to use. If you switch blades and you don’t like the cut, what are you going to do?
Click to expand...


#29

W

W1D2C

Rivets said:
This is when I normally say if you like the cut from the blades you have been using, DOT CHANGE. Mulching has more to do with mulching kit, blade speed, unit speed and deck design, than which blade to use. If you switch blades and you don’t like the cut, what are you going to do?There is a time for aftermarket and a time for oem. Bothe have strenghs. As Rivets said too many variables go with oem.
Click to expand...


#30

W

W1D2C

There is a time for aftermarket and a time for oem. Both have strengths. As Rivets said too many variables go with oem.


#31

F

flaing

Rivets said:
In my opinion doubling up blades is a DYI guys stupid idea. What can go wrong? Can’t properly tighten blades, may come loose. Destroying the spindles. Not made for two blades. Safety, may destroy the deck or blades go flying. Don’t even give that idea another thought, you’re asking for trouble. Who ever posted that or is thinking about do it, should have a frontal lobotomy ASAP, and should loose his manhood.
Click to expand...
And that’s all it is, your opinion! If you’ve never personally tried double blades, you really don’t know what you’re talking about, do you? I was skeptical, too, but now I’ve been running the Ballard X-Blade system for two years with no problems whatsoever, and a much better cut at higher speeds than single blades. I don’t mulch, though.


#32

N

need-for-speed

Rivets said:
Most mulching setups don’t discharge the clippings, as the good ones have closed decks when mulching, so the clippings are cut multiple times before dropping straight down. Toro and Honda have the best setups, with blades that lift and decks that provide room for the clippings to be chopped into small pieces. To properly mulch you must keep your blade sharp and deck clean.
Click to expand...
I have the Toro kit (on my Toro ;);)) and it provides a very level, clean cut.


#33

N

need-for-speed

moparjoe said:
The best way to avoid mulching is called A CHAIN SAW. Cut the trees down and you wont have to worry about mulching.
Click to expand...
I lived in Hobbs, NM for 3 years. After moving back to Montgomery county, TX, I will NEVER cut down another tree :p


#34

J

JKQ

SJMaye said:
I have had my Ariens Max Zoom 60 for about 6 years. I installed the OEM mulching kit on it about 5 years ago and have loved it. It is time to buy new blades. The OEM mulching blades have done a pretty good job, but thought I would ask the experts if there is something better. My father in law swears by the Gator Blades, but I have read that high lift blades are not good to use if you have a mulching kit.

Can someone comment on their experiences?
Click to expand...
Are mulching blades designed to be used with a grass catcher that's mounted on the back for the mower?


#35

R

Rivets

You have found the the Ballard system works for you. That is great, but you missed the point of this thread and why I posted what I did. The OP asking for an opinion on whether to change the style of blades on his Ariens units, to which I posted that if you like the cut with what you have don’t change. Then the thread turned to why mulch and if it really does any good. At this point the thread took a left turn and someone said their research indicated that you can convert to a two blade system. Having worked on units for 50+years my opinion still stands, unless you have unit designed for two blades, do you want to stick $$$ and time into an experiment? I never recommend doing that unless you can cover the cost of the experiment if something goes wrong.


#36

M

MParr

JKQ said:
Are mulching blades designed to be used with a grass catcher that's mounted on the back for the mower?
Click to expand...
No. High lift blades are what’s needed for bagging.


#37

T

Timbuktu

I agree, mulching is not for grass. I have a mulching kit with mulching blades but it is only used after the last mow of the summer. I only mulch the leaves that end up on the yard. It does a very good job of making those leaves disappear.


#38

G

gasjr4wd

SJMaye said:
I have had my Ariens Max Zoom 60 for about 6 years. I installed the OEM mulching kit on it about 5 years ago and have loved it. It is time to buy new blades. The OEM mulching blades have done a pretty good job, but thought I would ask the experts if there is something better. My father in law swears by the Gator Blades, but I have read that high lift blades are not good to use if you have a mulching kit.

Can someone comment on their experiences?
Click to expand...
Look at Rotary Copperhead Mulching Blades. (similar to Gators, but the little fins go out rather than in) I've also got the wavy blades... they suck. If you gave me a set I'd still not use them. If you really want to a good mulch, get the these blades and Ballard X-Blade Dual Mulching Blade Adapters. No matter what blade you get, sharpen them and keep them sharp. Yea, it matters. And I'm NOT a fan of mulching kits. They only fairly work if you aren't cutting much. But yea, some people swear buy them, others swear at them. Now I will say the bagging kits manufactures sell come with ultra high lift blade for the bag side. I tend to think that one blade cuts a little nicer than the other two standard/ mid lift. LOL


#39

M

mudpie

I have an old 48" Scag walk behind with side discharge that I use to mow my yard. I put Gator mulching blades on it to help with leaves this time of year. I don't have a mulching kit on it, just the blades. I still put the bag on, and it gets full, but it is obviously chopping up stuff more and leaving it on the ground, which reduces the number of times I have to empty the bag compared to mowing up leaves with high lift blades on. I'm happy with the arrangement for my own yard, but I've got a bunch of big leaf maples, so there's an obvious mess of mulched leaves left behind. I don't know if many customers would be happy with the mulched stuff that's left on the ground if they were paying me to mow their yard.
I have noticed that the Gator's are much heavier, and when I engage the PTO there's a much more noticeable strain to get the blades spinning. I don't know what issues that will give me down the road in terms of parts wearing out faster. Hopefully it's just the belt. I've also noticed a lot more fine particles of stuff getting packed up under my deck with mulching blades on, so I've got to spray underneath every time I mow. I didn't have to do that with the high lift.
If you ever watch any Project Farm videos, he's done a comparison of mulching blades. You can find it HERE


#40

H

hlw49

To do the best job of mulching you have to slow down.


#41

stevestd

stevestd

Mulching decks are well suited for residential use as they don’t have a dangerous side discharge, they leave a clean finish, and there are no clippings to dispose of. Mulching is also completely different to side discharge which also requires an adjustment to mowing technique. Speed is usually slower and cut length longer. Other factors to consider are the type of grass, length of grass, and moisture content. I have used about six different blade types for my Toro Z300 (with dedicated mulching deck) which are summarized below.

Low lift gator blades (Toro) - Not good for general use as they leave clumps of grass. I use these to slash long grass when finish is not an issue, and when the grass is long and/or wet grass. Several passes may be required to leave a clean finish.

Medium lift blades (standard) (Toro & others) are best overall. There are only slight differences between the brands and types. The blade I prefer is for another mower.

High lift (Oregon) gator blades give the best finish when the grass is relatively short as they tend to vacuum and pulverize all the small extraneous matter on the lawn. These blades are less effective on long grass and/or wet grass as the engine can bog down and clog the deck. Although usually great blades, they are not suitable for long and/or wet grass.

My response to your question is “horses for courses”. I also suggest changing the blades subject to the mowing conditions.


#42

M

motomike

hlw49 said:
To do the best job of mulching you have to slow down.
Click to expand...
Like Dr. Breen told the congregation in Mayberry:

"Slow down!.....Take it easy!.........WHAT'S your hurry!"


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