Deciding between an HRR216 & HRX217...looking for input

[silvrbreez]

Alright, so I've shopped all the brands and I've landed on Honda as my preferred choice. I'm considering the HRR216 and HRX217 as my top choices. Specifically, the models I'm looking at closest are:

HRR216VKA
HRR217VYA (Blade Brake Clutch)
HRX217VKA
HRX217HYA (Blade Brake Clutch & Hydrostatic)

I see my decision process going something like this...
I need to decide if the blade brake is something I definitely want.
After that, is the larger engine, Nexite deck, and Versamow feature something I feel is worth the upcharge.

Built into the decision on the blade brake is also whether or not I want to have the hydrostatic self-propelled on the HRX or the Smart Drive system on the HRR. The HRR216VYA feels more comfortable in my hands versus the HRX217HYA with it's three handles. I think those three handles could get bulky and uncomfortable after awhile.

My questions to the Honda guys out here are:
1. What's your take on Honda's blade brakes? I know they were one of the first to have them on their mowers, but how has their reliability been?
2. Is the GCV190 on the HRX a significant upgrade from the GCV160 on the HRR?
3. For HRX217HYA owners, does the three handle configuration and lack of a cushioned handle cause the mower to be uncomfortable after long mows?

Both are available right now for very competitive prices at a local dealer and are being offered with an extra year added to the warranties if purchased thru April. Looking to make a decision sometime this week.

Thanks in advance for any answers and input you can share.

 

[lzn197]

I think your decision should be based on what makes it easier to mow your lawn and your life with the mower. You have to ask yourself:
1. Do I start and stop my engine frequently as I mow? (blade clutch or no)
2. Are the fixed speeds ok or do I need variable speed? (hydro or not)
3. Do I have walnuts or debris that I may hit and not see on occasion? (plastic or steel)
4. Do I do my own repairs and maintenance or job it out? (more complicated mower)
5. Do I have children and like to warm up the mower before venturing out? (blade clutch)
6. Do I like a lighter weight mower?
7. Your budget.
8. Guys.....chime in here?

 

[robert@honda]

1. What's your take on Honda's blade brakes? I know they were one of the first to have them on their mowers, but how has their reliability been?

For many years, Honda had a patented and robust design of blade brake called Roto-Stop. It was quite reliable and a nice feature if your mowing requires frequent stops (empty bag, clear path, etc.). A while back (probably 6-7 years ago) they changed to a less costly BBC design similar to what other manufacturers were using, but retained the trademark "Roto-Stop" to support the branding/marketing efforts. The cost-down BBC is just as reliable as the original, and highly recommend if you bag clippings.

2. Is the GCV190 on the HRX a significant upgrade from the GCV160 on the HRR?

Really just more power/torque with the extra 30cc displacement. More important are the features you get with the HRX models vs. HRR. HRX has the NeXite composite deck (lifetime warranty) vs. the HRR's steel deck. HRX gets a longer base warranty, HRX has larger wheels, HRX has *variable* mulch, compared to HRR is either full on or full off.

3. For HRX217HYA owners, does the three handle configuration and lack of a cushioned handle cause the mower to be uncomfortable after long mows?

I own/use this model, and the painted steel bars are okay, but I added cushioned bike grip tape (cork/foam) and it significantly decreases the tingle in my hands after mowing steady for 1 hour.

 

[silvrbreez]

I think your decision should be based on what makes it easier to mow your lawn and your life with the mower. You have to ask yourself:
1. Do I start and stop my engine frequently as I mow? (blade clutch or no)
2. Are the fixed speeds ok or do I need variable speed? (hydro or not)
3. Do I have walnuts or debris that I may hit and not see on occasion? (plastic or steel)
4. Do I do my own repairs and maintenance or job it out? (more complicated mower)
5. Do I have children and like to warm up the mower before venturing out? (blade clutch)
6. Do I like a lighter weight mower?
7. Your budget.
8. Guys.....chime in here?

lzn197: You hit all my questions on the head. :thumbsup:

For many years, Honda had a patented and robust design of blade brake called Roto-Stop. It was quite reliable and a nice feature if your mowing requires frequent stops (empty bag, clear path, etc.). A while back (probably 6-7 years ago) they changed to a less costly BBC design similar to what other manufacturers were using, but retained the trademark "Roto-Stop" to support the branding/marketing efforts. The cost-down BBC is just as reliable as the original, and highly recommend if you bag clippings.


Really just more power/torque with the extra 30cc displacement. More important are the features you get with the HRX models vs. HRR. HRX has the NeXite composite deck (lifetime warranty) vs. the HRR's steel deck. HRX gets a longer base warranty, HRX has larger wheels, HRX has *variable* mulch, compared to HRR is either full on or full off.



I own/use this model, and the painted steel bars are okay, but I added cushioned bike grip tape (cork/foam) and it significantly decreases the tingle in my hands after mowing steady for 1 hour.

Thanks for the input. I honestly feel like I can give or take the 30cc boost, the NeXite deck, 1" larger wheels, and Versamow. As for the Versamow, I've never had the option so maybe I just don't know what I'm missing...I just figured if I'm bagging and bagging and if I'm mulching I'm mulching. I also don't have a need to shred leaves, so the 4-in-1 with the Versamow isn't something I'd take advantage of.

Also, thanks for the picture of the grip tape. I'd also contemplated just getting some palm-padded work gloves to wear while mowing. Figured that'd keep the sweat off the mower which could only help to prolong the life of the handles.

As for the difference in self-propelling...
How would you, from experience, compare the hydrostatic drive with selectable speeds on the HRX217HYA to the Smart Drive on the lower HRX and HRR models? It seems like the Smart Drive is more variable on the fly which could be nice. The Smart Drive controls also seem more comfortable vs. the third lever. Honestly, how that compares is what has me leaning to the HRR.

Guess I'm looking for someone to sell me on something else the HRX offers me that I might be missing.

I see the HRX models all have front and rear ball-bearing wheels where the HRR models only have rear ball-bearing wheels. Can you tell me more about that?

 

[robert@honda]

How would you, from experience, compare the hydrostatic drive with selectable speeds on the HRX217HYA to the Smart Drive on the lower HRX and HRR models? It seems like the Smart Drive is more variable on the fly which could be nice. The Smart Drive controls also seem more comfortable vs. the third lever. Honestly, how that compares is what has me leaning to the HRR.

I see the HRX models all have front and rear ball-bearing wheels where the HRR models only have rear ball-bearing wheels. Can you tell me more about that?

Honda's hydrostatic drive and multi-lever system has been unchanged for decades now. I've used it for so long it has become second nature. I've not spent any significant time with the SmartDrive controls to comment on how they compare. I can tell you Honda engineers worked extensively with an ergonomic PhD consultant to refine the SmartDrive. Version 1.0 of SmartDrive got a few complaints early on, and version 2.0 has a height-adjustment / position function to let the operator change the at-rest angle of the control.

If you can arrange it, I'd try a few test laps with both types. Personally, I really like the performance and feel of the hydrostatic drive, and maybe subconsciously willing to give up some ergonomic advantages offered by the SmartDrive.

The lack of all-bearings on the HRR is a simple cost constraint. The development teams must pay attention to every single penny of cost, and when you are building tens of thousand of anything, pennies add up quickly. While a typical consumer mower customer will likely never experience any difference, the data and testing show that with enough time, a simple bushing/sleeve will simply not last as long as a real ball-bearing. The front wheels on the HRRs don't get that, because they carry a fraction of the weight/wear compared to the rear.

 

[silvrbreez]

Mowed my rear yard this evening with my 10 yr old Craftsman pushmower bagger/mulcher. Realized a few things...
-Pushing this yard isn't all that bad if I stay on top of it, cut it to the right height, and don't wait too long between mows. Still want the self-propelled though.
-If I can restart this old Craftsman with 1 pull if I need to stop to empty the bag or move something out the yard, I'm sure the new mowers will start just as good. Not feeling like the blade brake is such a desire anymore.
-The old Craftsman has a 6.5hp B&S so I'd like to at least stay that size or larger, which I think equates to the Honda GCV190. (EDIT: Found the specs on my old B&S and it is more in line with the GCV160).

So I'm abandoning the blade brake option, still want self propelled, and don't want a smaller engine than I currently have. I think that leaves me with the HRR216VKA to be near identical engine specs or jump up to the HRX217VKA for a little more oompf. The local dealer has each in stock and I'll probably make up my mind this weekend.

 

[NJsnapper]

I agree. The blade stop is a useless option to have since Honda's start so darn easy .

 

[jimrs]

I agree. The blade stop is a useless option to have since Honda's start so darn easy .

Untell you break the starter rope. I will not buy a lawnmower without the blade break on it. I only want to start it once a week. If you have to walk away from the mower for any reason during the cutting process Open Gate, Pick up twigs or something else, Move anything then you have to restart the mower. I have had only 1 mower without and I hated it.

 

[NJsnapper]

break the starter rope? LOL:laughing:

 

[exotion]

You must pull the ropes to death then. Usually after a few years you see the rope is getting worn. Simply replace once and a while. As for the blade brake useless ... No besides stopping to move and pick things up the blade brake allows you to drive the mower around your property with out the blades engaged... Through beds.. over plants through gravel etc I love having a blade brake mostly for this reason